I think that ship has sailed. Any ambulance chaser remotely worth his contingency fee, who got a case even remotely based on this flaw, will find the Youtube videos. He'll then find an accredited expert to reproduce the tests in a scientifically controlled manner (whatever the hell that might be.) The results of that test, if they show a failure, will then be shown to the jury. At which point, SIGs obfuscation will be seen as just that.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
You clearly don't understand the litigious nature of America. By calling it a voluntary upgrade and saying it passes standard testing they are merely not giving some ambulance chaser easy ammo. Only a fool would willingly admit fault in today's society if they had a flimsy but defensible position.

If they stuck to that position and made you pay for the fix then you would have a reasonable scenario to "disrespect" them.

For fucks sake. They are going to fix your gun for free. It will cost you the time it takes to ship it. You guys act like you are brain surgeons and your minutes are worth golden bars. Well, they aren't.

Unless they sent a blue eyed, blonde, well endowed virgin to your door to personally apologize and collect your precious plastic gun some of you guys won't be happy.

Grow up.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
I think that ship has sailed. Any ambulance chaser remotely worth his contingency fee, who got a case even remotely based on this flaw, will find the Youtube videos. He'll then find an accredited expert to reproduce the tests in a scientifically controlled manner (whatever the hell that might be.) The results of that test, if they show a failure, will then be shown to the jury. At which point, SIGs obfuscation will be seen as just that.
]

You're a lawyer, right?

There is a winnable case, or a case at all, because of "obfuscation?" No, I'd say a variety of other factors need to be involved, besides some corporate doublespeak.

Shall we review some cases? Hell, just type "Glock" and "sue" or "lawsuit" into Google and you'll find a wonderful selection of people who blame the gun for their fuckups. Or is it really the pistols fault?

Whatever the product, it could be as safe as possible, with airtight language from the manufacturer, and people will still find ways to injure themselves with it, and try to sue a company.

If SIG "obfuscated," then there has been a shit ton of that very "obfuscating" by just about every business, everywhere, ever. Find me a corporation who perfectly and honestly handled a crisis, if such a thing exists, it exists because someone spun it that way.

Seriously, the songs playing on the pipe organ of this merry go round are getting old. Use up all your ride tickets, kids.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

Where were people wrongly called liars exactly?


Trolling has absolutely occurred, and whether or not this drop safety issue was realized, doesn't excuse the trolling behavior.

Go re-read pages 1-5 of this thread. ANYONE doubting the drop safety of the pistol line was explicitly "dismissed" and outright called a troll. That is very different from healthy skepticism.

quote:

Originally posted by lordhamster:
Go re-read pages 1-5 of this thread. ANYONE doubting the drop safety of the pistol line was explicitly "dismissed" and outright called a troll. That is very different from healthy skepticism.

Yup.

quote:

I feel like it is almost weekly that there is an anti P320 thread started with a rumor as its base.

I don't know if people just want to believe that there is a problem with the P320 platform as a whole, or there is just a ton of people that want to hate on the P320 platform because they have loyalty to another polymer frame striker gun. Either way there seems to be no shortage of trolls.

quote:

I wonder if the "drop safe" is going to become the new "double click"?

quote:

The so-called P320 drop test video referenced by many is an outright fraud intended to damage SIG SAUER and the P320, in my opinion. I can perhaps replicate what it portrays, only by removing a bunch of springs and the striker lock first. I defy the makers of that video to come forth and prove they can make a stock P320 fire like that in my presence, under controlled conditions. They can't.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:

quote:

Originally posted by lordhamster:
Go re-read pages 1-5 of this thread. ANYONE doubting the drop safety of the pistol line was explicitly "dismissed" and outright called a troll. That is very different from healthy skepticism.

Yup.

Ok, guys. This was approaching a month ago.

You'll need to open up your hearts and forgive these people for their transgressions. Write them a nice email, or just go take a hot bath, whatever.

You just need to handle it like adults. Adults who can let shit go.

If there's something you want or are looking for, that hasn't occurred in 70 some pages, it means it's time to watch Frozen until it sets in.

Folks are moving on, people are either going to have their P320s upgraded, modified, repaired, or recalled, depending on whether they think this is an upgrade, repair, modification, or recall. They'll do it voluntarily. Or they won't. That's about the long and short of it.

In time, this one goes on the decades long list of gun company design flaw shenanigans, of which there are numerous. If you feel there is more too it, well, that's your business.

Some just don't want to let it go. It's too damn funny.

Remember the ad..."Sig dropped the hammer"
Apparently they forgot to drop the gun....

I've let it go, I really couldn't care less that this point.

But the facts be the facts. You asked where this had occurred, I provided the requested information.

My only complaint throughout this whole debacle is that I was told through my regional LE rep that our depts pistols would be replaced with new pistols. That's not my complaint though. My issue is that I was told to expect them mid September. Now I'm being told 90-120 days. And no answer as to when to expect my personal IOP's replacement. I was told LE was to be expedited, taken care of long before civilians. If 3-4 months is expedited, I sure feel bad for all you guys that are apparently behind me in line. I don't blame my rep, he's been awesome. But I do blame the people giving him conflicting info from day to day.

How has no one photoshopped Elsa dropping a P320 yet?

You guys are slipping.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
How has no one photoshopped Elsa dropping a P320 yet?

You guys are slipping.

I tried but my screen keeps freezing.

Just shot an upgraded P320 FS today. Sig had a demo for local LE and I thought I'd give it a whirl. Shot about the same but with maybe a subtle grittiness / mushiness to it. This was a new gun and I was the first to put rounds down range with it. My current P320 C has over 1100 rounds through it so I'm assuming the new Version check to that nicely.

Have faith,

The Monkey will be along shortly.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
I've let it go, I really couldn't care less that this point.

You clearly do because you've crawled back into this thread again....

quote:

Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
You clearly do because you've crawled back into this thread again....

enough

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
enough

Thank you!

I realize production is shut down for now on the 320. Any ideas when it will start up again? I had a 320X5 ordered until the recall.

thanks

quote:

Originally posted by YVK:

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
You clearly don't understand the litigious nature of America. By calling it a voluntary upgrade and saying it passes standard testing they are merely not giving some ambulance chaser easy ammo.

Fear of litigation is a piss poor excuse for not upholding business ethics standards. The verbiage used has zero protective effect on whether you'll get sued. Issuance of a recall does not amount to admission of culpability.
The problem at hand is an unforeseen risk, most likely very low rate but with theoretically severe consequences, to a customer despite best intentions and acceptable pre-release testing. This is not a unique event by any stretch. Automotive industry, medical device industry, pharma, food, toys, car seats, consumer electronics, it is all out there in open press. Nobody ever said your eggs could be laced with salmonella but it ain't that likely, so return is on your discretion. There isn't more than one way of skinning this cat. You issue a RECALL. You take those products from your distributors and return them back safe. And you deal with legal fallout as it arose.
If you care about your reputation, that is.

Well Said!!

quote:

Originally posted by Oddjob:
I realize production is shut down for now on the 320. Any ideas when it will start up again? I had a 320X5 ordered until the recall.

thanks

Unless SIG corporate management has someone reading these boards, I don't think anyone of us can really answer that question and to be honest, I don't think SIG can at this stage of the upgrade process.

They are probably still trying to get the process figured out/setup.