From the casual observer what appears to make RX-79G happy is to be in an argument.


If you feel like a hater, then perhaps re-examine your approach, feeling like a hater is your perception of yourself, nobody here has attacked you personally.

I am curious, do you own a P320, is that the source of your disdain for the line, the company and demands for the head of Ron Cohen.

quote:

But why don't we just dispense with the penis comparison stuff...

I really don't understand where you are coming up with that.

There are many firearms that have several parts pivoting off the center of mass. They are not balanced, they are not symmetrical. There are also many designs that work unlike other firearms...Sig designed this, they didn't copy it.

I'm done with this thread.

Carry on!

I love my FS P320 and have not had any problems with it although I have never dropped it either. I have not had time to read 34 pages of post so can someone tell me, is there a problem or not and if so is Sig working on a fix? This is the sweetest shooting gun I own and is now my go to weapon so it would be nice to know one way or the other. Thanks in advance for any help/answers you might have.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
From the casual observer what appears to make RX-79G happy is to be in an argument.

It takes two. I've been following since page 1 and he has been called out from the beginning for his opinions. When he is in fact proven correct in his initial opinion, said attackers then shifted gears to try and invalidate his words at every turn, rather unsucessfully, imo.

Casual lurking member for years, I love my P320 and more info will come to light soon enough. As for RX-79G in the words of Jackie Chan in Rush Hour.

"You seem as if you like to talk. I like to let people talk who like to talk. It makes it easier to find out how full of sXXt they are.

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Originally posted by floorance:
"You seem as if you like to talk. I like to let people talk who like to talk. It makes it easier to find out how full of sXXt they are.

This is a gun discussion forum. By that logic, we have many, many members here who are very full of shit. (Not that I doubt that.)

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Originally posted by lordhamster:

quote:

Originally posted by Nipper:
I don't tell anybody else what their decision should be. I don't expect anybody else to tell me what my decision should be.

Re the P320, I'm waiting until the dust settles.

It goes without saying that everyone is entitled to do as they please.... but now you've got me curious. You say you will "wait until the dust settles." That is a little bit vague.

I infer from that that you will not panic and go selling the P320... but, will you
a) Stop using the P320 and maybe relegate to safe duty till the dust settles?
b) Ignore the current evidence and keep using the P320 as if nothing ever happened till the dust settles?

They are two very different reactions. For me personally I'd probably do A and choose to not use the P320 for a while. Moot point for me through as I sold my P320 about a year ago when I switched to all Hammer fired DA/SA pistols......

Fear not, I will satisfy your curiosity.

Re your Q's:

a) Actually, I don't carry it yet. Bought it in 2015 as a P320C 9mm and added an X-Change FS .40. Having age-related arthritis in my hands, I know I will have to eventually go to strikers. Bought a Gen4 G19 and G34 a few years ago with this in mind. Like and carry both Glocks. While my hands hold up, I prefer Sig DA/SA for EDC and HD. Been using them since 1995. My three primaries are P229 .40 (old friend), Gen4 G19 (capacity) and Wilson Pro .45 (accuracy/concealability).

b) I do intend to use the P320 while the dust is settling. I'm not ignoring the current evidence, just keeping it in perspective. Been shooting/carrying for 50 years and the tiny number of failures I've experienced were due to...the damn shooter. Don't know who the hell he was, but I know it wasn't the equipment.

I have no specific definition of "dust settles". Just waiting for the whole thing to play out. I prefer verified facts, not rampant speculation. Rough analogy: While eye witness testimony is nice, forensic evidence is better. I have no need to make a decision until then.

I've promised all the guys in my defensive shooting group that I will no longer throw my P320 on the concrete floor every time I get more than one shot out of the A-zone. I thought it was the best thing to do after they all ran to the back of the range when I arrived.

I like the P320 platform very much. It's a natural shooter and I don't have to work very hard to get the best out of it. As Jones mentioned, it's very tolerant of small errors in shooter input. My 1911's are the same. All of my other guns require that I be 100% on for each shot.

BTW, thanks for asking an honest, intelligent straight question. Refreshing in this thread.

quote:

Originally posted by Wreckless:

quote:

Originally posted by RC Fan:
I have been following this story from the start. Let's leave the ADs/NDs out as we don't have enough info to know what really happened.

I still don't understand how this would re-occur in a normal situation. From what I can tell, this is happening on the second drop(or second or third blow of hammer on the rear on the slide). Let's assume a reasonable person drops their P320 and it does not discharge. Would the reasonable person not check for damage, or do a function check? Once you rack the slide, the striker is reset. It seems like this whole contrived scenario involves a situation that is unlikely to occur.

The SWAT officer in CT was allegedly shot in the leg when his hostered pistol fell to the ground while he was loading equipment in the trunk of his car. That would appear to directly contradict your assertion.

As I said in my post, can we set that aside for the moment as we don't know exactly what happened?

quote:

Originally posted by jehzsa:
If someone panics on a P320 .40 S&W subcompact Nitron with PELT trigger, kindly let me know.

Price commensurate with the degree of panic.

Now that Para's here, we can get back to providing info and having fun.

I do have a P320 .40 with the PELT trigger. Bad news for you is that I haven't panicked and it's a FullSize.

I'm still a .40 fan - all of my Sigs are .40. Funny story:

I was the first in our defensive shooting group to use a .40 (P229) in 1995. Brass (marked) pickup is a PITA with 20-25 shooters. Mine was easy...if it was .40 it's mine. Eventually the .40 caught on and I had to scrounge just like the .45 and 9 mm shooters (the indignity of it all). Last several months I have been the only shooter in the group with a .40. Back to the future!

quote:

Originally posted by WARPIG602:

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
From the casual observer what appears to make RX-79G happy is to be in an argument.

It takes two. Ive benen following since page 1 and he has been called out from the beginning for his opinions. When he in fact proven correct in his intial opinion, said attackers then shifted gears to try and invalidate his words at every turn, rather unsucessfully, imo.

Thats how I see it too. He's been correct pretty much this whole thread despite attempts to undermine him.

quote:

Originally posted by RC Fan:

quote:

Originally posted by Wreckless:

quote:

Originally posted by RC Fan:
I have been following this story from the start. Let's leave the ADs/NDs out as we don't have enough info to know what really happened.

I still don't understand how this would re-occur in a normal situation. From what I can tell, this is happening on the second drop(or second or third blow of hammer on the rear on the slide). Let's assume a reasonable person drops their P320 and it does not discharge. Would the reasonable person not check for damage, or do a function check? Once you rack the slide, the striker is reset. It seems like this whole contrived scenario involves a situation that is unlikely to occur.

The SWAT officer in CT was allegedly shot in the leg when his hostered pistol fell to the ground while he was loading equipment in the trunk of his car. That would appear to directly contradict your assertion.

As I said in my post, can we set that aside for the moment as we don't know exactly what happened?

So what are you saying/asking? Is the problem caused by multiple hits or just being hit once at a certain angle?

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Originally posted by RX-79G:

quote:

Originally posted by RC Fan:
As I said in my post, can we set that aside for the moment as we don't know exactly what happened?

Does that mean you watched the video I posted for you or not?

That particular video was a new one for me. It seems most of the others involve multiple hits/drops.

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Originally posted by EmpireState:

quote:

Originally posted by WARPIG602:

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
From the casual observer what appears to make RX-79G happy is to be in an argument.

It takes two. Ive benen following since page 1 and he has been called out from the beginning for his opinions. When he in fact proven correct in his intial opinion, said attackers then shifted gears to try and invalidate his words at every turn, rather unsucessfully, imo.

Thats how I see it too. He's been correct pretty much this whole thread despite attempts to undermine him.

Yes RX-79 has been correct in his technical opinions but then he started making a bit outlandish statements that SIG might financially collapse, little firearm design experienc, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by saigonsmuggler:

quote:

Originally posted by EmpireState:

quote:

Originally posted by WARPIG602:

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
From the casual observer what appears to make RX-79G happy is to be in an argument.

It takes two. Ive benen following since page 1 and he has been called out from the beginning for his opinions. When he in fact proven correct in his intial opinion, said attackers then shifted gears to try and invalidate his words at every turn, rather unsucessfully, imo.

Thats how I see it too. He's been correct pretty much this whole thread despite attempts to undermine him.

Yes RX-79 has been correct in his technical opinions but then he started making a bit outlandish statements that SIG might financially collapse, little firearm design experienc, etc.

Not entirely untrue. How long has Sig USA been designing handguns? And of thos desigsn, since we're on the topic, were released with no issues?
As I said it takes 2, RX could say the sky is blue and the Sig gang would argue that its not factual as its actually not a true blue...... at sunrise. Nickel and dime shit. They cant discredit the bulk of his statemetn so the pick and choose words or phrases to try and acomplsih the same thing.

I could care less either way. I dont own one, I likely will never own one....and that has nothign to do with anyting based in this thread.

quote:

Originally posted by RX-79G:

There are several more on Pistol Forum. But really, anyone who can pull a bullet can drop their P320 on a rubber mat for themselves.

I will give the Omaha Outdoors video more credence than some dude on YouTube.

I am all for improving the gun. I'll continue to use mine at the range as usual. After all, I regularly take my ARs, and my 870 to the range, both of which aren't drop safe either.

I personally thing its good to have both views and have people scrutinize the design. Could be the best lock work ever ones the bugs get worked out or it could have been overly complex. Either way, it is good to hear both sides of the story. I have multiple P320s, so any insight is always welcome.

Since the civil suit against Sig has come up since my last post I thought I would add a few thoughts

The term "settlement discussions" is amorphous and really has no meaning. It could be anything from a simple telephone call to the Adjuster handling the matter to a full day mediation where evidence is presented in front of a mediator. Certainly there is never any type of admission of liability during these discussions. In fact, the opposite is usually true. Defendants will throw the kitchen sink at you, telling you why your case sucks and that you will lose at trial.

The term "settle out of court" is also a misnomer. It's a term I refuse to use with my clients. I prefer to use "settle prior to litigation" and "settle during litigation." In my experience there are very few settlements prior to litigation. Period. The fact that there may have been settlement discussions in the Sig case in no way, in and of itself, proves that the Sig P320 is defective or Sig is admitting liability.

Cases settle for a multitude of reasons and as said in an earlier post about 90-95% of cases settle. That is true. There a joke among trial lawyers-(sanitized version) Do you really want your case decided by a bunch of strangers who haven't figured out a way to get of jury duty?

Additionally, if you were Sig's Attorneys would you want to try a major firearms lawsuit in a traditionally, anti-2A northeastern state where Newtown happened?

Additionally, settlements in Products case in my experience, always have a "no admission of liability' clause and an NDA.
The whole point being is that one lawsuit is not determinative of anything.

quote:

Originally posted by Top Gun Supply:

quote:

But why don't we just dispense with the penis comparison stuff...

I really don't understand where you are coming up with that.

There are many firearms that have several parts pivoting off the center of mass. They are not balanced, they are not symmetrical. There are also many designs that work unlike other firearms...Sig designed this, they didn't copy it.

I'm done with this thread.

Carry on!

Thanks for attempting to provide useful, factual information as you have here in the past.

Apparently, the only person offended was our resident firearms design expert.

One of the saddest things about all of this is the fact that anyone who blindly dismissed this issue as bullshit and defended Sig, for whatever reason, without taking a little time and due diligence to examine the facts have lost their credibility and integrity, just as Sig has. Their arrogance has prevented them from recognizing their ignorance.

quote:

Originally posted by RX-79G:

Well, don't bump it off the 4' high shelf at the range and onto the concrete. If your gun kills someone at this point, it is your liability since you know about the problem.[/QUOTE]

That is actually a valid point. "Notice of the defective condition" is key in proving liability in many types of tort actions.

On a side note, and this is in NO WAY LEGAL ADVISE solicited or otherwise-do I own a P320. Yes and I really like it! Will I send it in for upgrade-Yes. Am I going to keep shooting it before its upgraded. No. During a class another student dropped a gun and it landed right by my foot on the concrete floor of the indoor range. It was iirc a p229 or p226. No discharge. Would I be happy now if somebody dropped a P320 at my feet on concrete. No.