Excellent.

Oh man. He ripped the WHO a new ass today. Which actually didn't help us much because now they will be requiring twice the toilet paper.

Great! Much of this might have been mitigated if WHO had not been covering up Chinese lies. This was either a Chinese lab accident or maybe even on purpose and WHO helped cover it up.

quote:

Originally posted by 9mmepiphany:

quote:

Originally posted by lastmanstanding:
I know they have the right information because the automatic withdrawal worked just fine today. Took a nice bite out of the account. State should be along shortly to make their withdrawal I'm sure.

I take from the above that you didn't put them off until it was due on July 15th

No. Pay me now pay me later. We had the money set aside before all this started. There is no virus known to God or the Chinese that would halt the tax collection process!

quote:

Originally posted by Ackks:

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:
Sounds like everyone starting to see the big picture here.

OK, convince me of the wisdom of your plan. A small spark of less than 100 people caused this, so how is it not going to cause a major spike to go back to normal right now when thousands have it? What was the point of the last month if we throw that kind of gas on the fire at this point?

I'll take a stab at it...
It's called "natural herd immunity", and the only way you get it is by opening things up:

Viruses 101: How Overprotecting People from COVID 19 Could Make it More Lethal


With heroic imagination rivalling Don Quixote’s, our hysterical health technocrats are stuck in a time capsule in the middle of World War 1 from which they battle the most terrible pathogen of all time -- the original H1N1 flu virus. How else to explain why they have adopted precisely the public health tactics -- masking, social distancing, and quarantining -- that were used in 1918?

Our wildly anachronistic approach to COVID 19 notwithstanding, we have spent billions for research and know volumes more about viruses and immunity than we did a century ago. The crime is that we the taxpaying public never received a proper education on the subject. I realized that myself 20 years ago when I first read J. R. Paul’s A History of Poliomyelitis. It quietly reveals that almost none of what we have learned in American public schools is even close to the truth.

More importantly, the deep knowledge of viruses garnered from studying both the original H1N1 flu and polio strongly implies that, if we continue to over-react and over-protect people from COVID-19, we risk turning it into a much more lethal virus. In order to understand why I am so concerned about that, first let’s look at how the original flu virus turned into the worst killer the world has ever known, one which not only felled older people and those with weakened immunity, but people in the prime of life including older children and young adults:

1) In general, viruses evolve with their human hosts to get what they need without killing us. Allowing us to survive actually benefits the virus -- they get to survive, too, and get passed to another human host.

2) During WWI, millions of people globally were terrified, malnourished and immuno-suppressed.

3) Soldiers lay in foxholes bleeding, coughing and vomiting on each other.

4) In this chaotic situation, the flu virus could "get away with" becoming extremely lethal and kill the host soldiers -- because there were so many of them in close proximity -- the virus could spread to another soldier almost as easily from a dead soldier as from a live one.

5) Having millions of people with weakened immunity allowed the flu virus to spread quickly and easily into new populations.

How did the H1N1 monster of 1918 become -- evolve into--the relatively meek flu viruses of today? As the human population gradually recovered from WW1, the flu virus had to go back to the safety of peaceful coexistence with its human hosts, and to co-evolving with their immune systems in a way that would allow both species to survive. The real polio story is similar:

Incredibly, from our modern “civilized” standpoint, and as David Shumway Jones recently reminded me, the polio virus was not dangerous until natural herd immunity was disrupted by modern sewerage systems which short-circuited usual fecal-oral natural immunization.

In his seminal book, J. R. Paul explains that polio had probably been living in human intestines for thousands of years, and was mainly a gastrointestinal or GI virus. Only when the human-host-polio-virus balance was “upset” by children no longer putting their feces-contaminated hands in their mouths did polio evolve into a variant that started attacking the spinal cord. Even so, in most families where one child was paralyzed, most had mild flu symptoms and fought it off. It was absolutely necessary to develop good vaccines, based on known natural routes of immunization. But you can't always develop a vaccine, as AIDS has shown, and you need to develop shrewd public health approaches to control new viruses, based on top notch immunological theory.

Our current everyone-stay-home approach is anything but enlightened by immunological theory. Quite the opposite: As billions of people worldwide are currently in their homes, in close confinement, in situations of extreme fear and psychological distress, being told by their governments to go to the grocery store as rarely as possible, we are creating an environment which is more and more conducive for facilitating a virus with enhanced virulence in the future. How are we doing this?

1) Lowering everyone’s resistance to viruses by scaring, stressing, and discouraging them from normal activities including buying food and drink.

2) Keeping everyone at home in effect creates just the immunosuppressive scenario that fosters flu during the winter time -- cold, close quarters and stress.

3) Discouraging direct human contact including hugging and kissing, and directly loving one another suppresses immunity. With social distancing, our species never would have made it this far.

4) Preventing young people from being exposed to COVID 19 short circuits “herd immunity.”

In stark contrast to the quixotic fantasies driving our stay-at-home American approach, which sees all new viruses as equally terrifying, British health authorities are taking the more sober approach, one which is solidly based on contemporary virological, immunological and evolutionary biological theory: letting children go to school, to acquire COVID 19 and become naturally immune is absolutely the best way to assure that this new virus learns to peacefully coexist with we human beings. Viruses have always been with us, and are part of our very genomes.

I have met few modern immunologists who believe, as Dr. Fauci does, that washing one’s hands 50 times a day is the best way to stay healthy. At the Ghost lab at the Laboratory of Cellular and Molecular Immunology in the 2000s, we often discussed how over-cleanliness and over-protection from viruses and bacteria was a very poor public health approach: too much hand washing actually prevents normal development of the immune system, and leads to autoimmune and other immune-regulatory disturbances later in life. That “hygiene hypothesis” is well known and well accepted by most immunologists.

Read more: https://www.americanthinker.co...l.html#ixzz6Jd9QXqhX

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:

A. It aint my plan, Scooter. Never said it was. So why are you starting trouble where there wasn't any?

B. If you're that scared then go home and stay there. I'll send someone back for ya when it's safe out here. World's a rough place full of rough men and scary viruses. Has been for a while.

C. You know that 99.8% of this is political hype right? Right? You do know this is political hype , right?

You keep posting how the quarantine needs to end immediately, so I'm starting trouble asking you to explain why that is a good idea and wouldn't cause a spike that wipes out the point of the last month? I see a lot of avoidance in the rest of your post, but not much else.

Over 200,000 Michiganders Sign Petition to Oust Governor Whitmer


THOMAS D. WILLIAMS, PH.D. 14 Apr 2020

Michigan citizens have been flooding a petition at Change.org calling for the removal of Governor Gretchen Whitmer, accusing her of gross negligence and failures in handling the coronavirus pandemic.

The “Recall Governor Whitmer” petition alleges the governor’s measures, such as “closing and banning various non essential business’s [sic] and activities while leaving others open,” are actually “causing more Michiganders to get sick.”

Launched three weeks ago by John Powell, the petition has picked up steam in past days following the governor’s extension of a stay-at-home order and raising penalties for non-compliance to a $1,000 fine and/or six months in jail.

In just the 24-hour period between Monday and Tuesday, the petition garnered more than 50,000 new signatures as citizens rush to express their displeasure with the governor, bringing the total number of signatories past the 200,000 mark.

Along with an extension on the statewide lockdown, Whitmer issued new restrictions on stores limiting the number of people in the store at one time to no more than four customers for every 1,000 square feet of customer floor space. Stores must also cordon off areas dedicated to carpeting, flooring, furniture, garden centers, plant nurseries, or paint.

Commenters wondered aloud what possible health concern could motivate the governor to keep people from planting seeds or repainting parts of their homes.

Michiganders have also accused Whitmer of neglecting their interests while attempting to curry favor with presumptive Democrat presidential candidate Joe Biden, who has signaled he is considering bringing her on as running mate.

“Her priorities are no longer the residents of Michigan but her possible position as V.P. for Biden,” wrote Patricia Duncan.

Biden brought Whitmer onto his podcast on April 6, in which he praised her for the job she is doing in Michigan.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

I'll take a stab at it...

Thanks. Makes more sense than just saying it is political hype. What about what is happen in Sweden now? Seems they tried this experiment and now it is backfiring. I'm not being an antagonist. I honestly don't see a good solution to this. If we stay home the economy tanks. If we open it up when thousands are infected it could spike like the last month never happened.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:


Fox News reports that Michigan officials expect at least 15 thousand cars to participate.



Link

I wouldn't put it past her to have the MSP print 15,000 $1,000 citations and go car to car handing them out for violation of her stay at home order. If you're not traveling for essential work, to buy groceries, or court ordered child visitation travel is illegal in Michigan under her Executive Order.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Excellent.

A friend of mine asked me if it was “too soon” to affix blame. Here’s my answer:

No, it is not “too early” to affix blame. The Director of WHO has been in the pocket of the ChiComs and was the main spokesman for its tepid response to informing the rest of the world about the danger.

https://www.cfr.org/blog/who-a...ina-dereliction-duty

https://thehill.com/opinion/in...untable-for-pandemic

https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotli...to-declare-emergency

FYI: the linked Nikkei article (above) was written on Feb 1; well before everything broke here in USA, as the news media was too fixated on the Bernie-Bloomy-Biden primary story. So yeah, that alone gives credence to the validity of the criticism of WHO.

Glad to be of service in educating you over from what the “We Hate Trump” news media is all about.

As for the Donnybrook and kerfuffle over the re-opening USA and who has what power, funny how the Dems have always been about the “supremacy” of the FedGov over the States, but now it’s all about STATES’ RIGHTS and the 10th Amendment. Welcome to the timeworn argument of the concept of Federalism in the American polity.


2BT

I think there will be a revolution if this doesn't have a clear endgame shortly.

OK We've stayed home for 6 weeks- Now What?

quote:

In stark contrast to the quixotic fantasies driving our stay-at-home American approach, which sees all new viruses as equally terrifying, British health authorities are taking the more sober approach, one which is solidly based on contemporary virological, immunological and evolutionary biological theory: letting children go to school, to acquire COVID 19 and become naturally immune is absolutely the best way to assure that this new virus learns to peacefully coexist with we human beings. Viruses have always been with us, and are part of our very genomes.

His info is a little out of date. That's what Boris Johnson SAID the UK's plan was for maybe one day before he and everyone else in the UK government corrected his statement.

UK schools have been closed except for limited exceptions since late March. https://www.theguardian.com/wo...-and-exams-cancelled

The UK is under social distancing recommendations about as extensive as ours. https://www.gov.uk/government/...and-away-from-others

quote:

You should only leave the house for very limited purposes:

shopping for basic necessities, for example food and medicine, which must be as infrequent as possible.

one form of exercise a day, for example a run, walk, or cycle - alone or with members of your household.

any medical need, including to donate blood, avoid or escape risk of injury or harm, or to provide care or to help a vulnerable person.

travelling for work purposes, but only where you cannot work from home.

quote:

Originally posted by braillediver:
I think there will be a revolution if this doesn't have a clear endgame shortly.

OK We've stayed home for 6 weeks- Now What?

Long enough for Democratic governors to create a permanent, government-dependant class.

I think everyone ought to simply ignore these orders and get back to life. Who are these ass-clowns to demand that decent, ordinary, hardworking Americans must suffer financial calamity cuz liberal pussies claim to be ascared. Fuck 'em. If their asacred, they can lock themselves away.

quote:

Originally posted by nhtagmember:

quote:

Originally posted by ersatzknarf:
We need to break out the torches and pitchforks, pronto!

thats old school...and a waste of a good torch

No school like old school!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Rightwire:
I wouldn't put it past her to have the MSP print 15,000 $1,000 citations and go car to car handing them out for violation of her stay at home order. If you're not traveling for essential work, to buy groceries, or court ordered child visitation travel is illegal in Michigan under her Executive Order.

Isn't there a grocery store in Lansing?

"Officer, I'm getting groceries but am stuck in all this traffic!!!"

quote:

Originally posted by Ackks:

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

I'll take a stab at it...

Thanks. Makes more sense than just saying it is political hype. What about what is happen in Sweden now? Seems they tried this experiment and now it is backfiring. I'm not being an antagonist. I honestly don't see a good solution to this. If we stay home the economy tanks. If we open it up when thousands are infected it could spike like the last month never happened.

From what I've read things are no worse n Sweden than they are in the neighboring countries that locked everything down.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

I'll take a stab at it...
It's called "natural herd immunity", and the only way you get it is by opening things up:

Viruses 101: How Overprotecting People from COVID 19 Could Make it More Lethal

So tight close quarters and unsanitary conditions causes the virus to make itself more deadly AND avoiding passing the bug and washing your hands makes the virus more deadly as well. Sounds like we are fucked either way then.

I'd suggest herd immunity as well, but have no clue how we get there. Do what you can to stop everyone from getting it at the same time with a focus on protecting people most likely to die from it. Then once we have a way to test for antibodies and to administer a vaccine to the population as a whole we can go back to normal.

Only problem is we have to either sacrifice economy or at risk people. It's not really politically acceptable to have a policy of acceptable casualties to save the economy. Kind of a catch 22 situation. The other monkey wrench is the reports of 30% loss of lung function which may or may not be permanent.

I have no solution for the problem, but I can sure as hell say I wouldn't want to be PDJT right now.

I talked to a friend of mine Sunday that lives in Bro, Sweden just north of Stockholm. He said all the reports that you’re seeing where the media is saying Sweden is completely open are lies. Many bakeries and restaurants and other places are temporarily closed or are takeout only and many people are staying at home. He says Sweden has basically a “soft lockdown“ as he put it.

quote:

Originally posted by 2BobTanner:

As for the Donnybrook and kerfuffle over the re-opening USA and who has what power, funny how the Dems have always been about the “supremacy” of the FedGov over the States, but now it’s all about STATES’ RIGHTS and the 10th Amendment. Welcome to the timeworn argument of the concept of Federalism in the American polity.

2BT

I don't recall any of these assholes rescuing my freedom during the Federal "Assault Weapon {SIC} Ban"

Our Governor and her actions make no sense. When she lengthened the stay at home order she added restrictions on what can and what cannot be purchased at the same time.

Paint, decorating items, lawn and garden items and supplies are prohibited from sale until April 30th at the soonest.

Party stores, a mainstay of urban life in Detroit, Flint and many other cities are allowed to be open as they are considered essential businesses. They are allowed to stay open because they sell food items critical (Governor's office said that, not I) to neighborhoods. Yep, beef sticks, candy bars, chips, snack food is critical to sustain life. Yep, together with liquor, beer and wine sales. And recreational pot stores are allowed to be open as another essential business. I think a more insidious reason is to keep the masses drunk, numb, stoned and happy while watching TV so they will be less inclined to question what else is going on and to generate tax revenue for the state.

Can't forget the state lottery. In fact this subject has come up often during this. Yesterday the Governor said early in her press conference that she was looking at the lottery question, that got shoved to the side and ignored for the rest of the conference. But never fear, this afternoon WWJ radio played a PSA about staying home, limiting trips to the grocery store and to not go to the store to play the lottery, do it on line. So that is the action taken by the Governor, a radio announcement.

She has stated for exercise "go walk around your neighborhood while observing social distancing", obviously she does not live in Detroit, Highland Park, Flint, Benton Harbor or many other places in Michigan. We are encouraged to use state parks but not drive there. Sure, there are state recreation areas near here, I'll just walk 17 miles round trip to one or 32 miles round trip to the next closest one. My private gun club is open for use with restrictions presently, under the directive I cannot drive there and back. Think it would cause some issues if I walked carrying my AR?

Between the protest scheduled for the state Capitol tomorrow and a Federal suit filed against her today it's going to get interesting around here. Here's a link to that:https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2020/04/14/growing-opposition-ruptures-unity-behind-whitmer-covid-19-response/2991974001/