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Originally posted by David Lee:

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What is the answer here?

Occupation. Own the shit hole and smoke out every bad guy. Occupy it for as long as it takes. Civilize those who choose to live a humane life style and destroy all others.

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Originally posted by DoctorSolo:

Gaza strip?

What Gaza strip?

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Originally posted by parabellum:
Dr. Peterson has proven to be one of the great voices of reason over the past few years, and you can see that even he isn't havin' any of it.

Whether or not it's gaslighting or fear setting in after they realized that they've put on full display to the world their utter savagery, or any other reason, it matters not. Hamas should prepare itself for the lesson of lessons.

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Originally posted by Rightwire:
Israel has a serious problem with the Hamas, Hezbollah and associated groups who have perpetrated this and many other attacks.

As I see it, hey are in a situation not unlike the U.S. found itself in Vietnam with the NVA and Vietcong. We all know from history that the Vietcong were everywhere. Most villages were infiltrated and even women doing the laundry at U.S. bases maybe the ones found dead on the wire the next morning after an attack. Hamas and these other groups have done the same thing.

One big difference is that, except for pacification purposes, the VC typically was attacking military installations. Hamas & Hezbollah attack civilian targets and pray on innocents.

Many might say "Kill them all...." Well, fine that is a great sounding thing but now you are talking genocide. Something that Jewish people are a bit sensitive to, and rightly so. I'm sure in the middle east there are Muslims who really don't care, just want to be left alone, live their lives, tend their herds and crops and try and enjoy life... just like many civilians were in Vietnam.

How do you tell the difference? How do you prevent an incident like the My Lai massacre? Want to assure you lose all support from the world, pull one of those.

Is the world outraged at Hamas for what they're doing. Of course, but it's a group not a country. Same issue, as with the VC. As soon as they are targeted for an attack or even scrutiny they fade away.

Make no mistake. Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq learned the hard way that direct military action against Israel will fail. They developed the Palestinians into their own VC to do the dirty work for them, potentially weaken Israel enough for them to swoop in and finish the job. That is all wrapped in the neat little Islamic zealot package. Slaughter in the name of Allah and if you're killed you get your 72 virgins in paradise. That is a tougher ideology than just people committed to communism.

In my opinion the larger issue lies in one of the unique attitudes with the Islamic zealots. They can murder 500 innocent women and children and its ALLU ACKBAR!!!! but you injure one of their people in a counter attack and a huge number of them are suddenly YOU ATTACKED US!!! I KILL YOU!!!!!! I KILL YOU!!!. Why is that an issue? Even if you are very successful in killing a large number of them, even high ranking ones, those who remain will be even more dedicated to the cause, and likely a lot of moderates get swayed into it simply because an infidel killed a Muslim. They will fade into the caves for months, years, even decades and come out all frothing at the mouth ready to fight.

So.... with that all said. How on earth do you deal with this type of attack? How do you deal with not knowing who is a combatant and who isn't? How do you avoid a My Lai, even when they are doing it to you? How do you shut this down when every effort so far, seems to fuel the fire?

What is the answer here?

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Nehemiah 4:

When Sanballat heard that we were rebuilding the wall, he became angry and was greatly incensed. He ridiculed the Jews, 2 and in the presence of his associates and the army of Samaria, he said, “What are those feeble Jews doing? Will they restore their wall? Will they offer sacrifices? Will they finish in a day? Can they bring the stones back to life from those heaps of rubble—burned as they are?”

3 Tobiah the Ammonite, who was at his side, said, “What they are building—even a fox climbing up on it would break down their wall of stones!”

4 Hear us, our God, for we are despised. Turn their insults back on their own heads. Give them over as plunder in a land of captivity. 5 Do not cover up their guilt or blot out their sins from your sight, for they have thrown insults in the face of[b] the builders.

6 So we rebuilt the wall till all of it reached half its height, for the people worked with all their heart.

7 But when Sanballat, Tobiah, the Arabs, the Ammonites and the people of Ashdod heard that the repairs to Jerusalem’s walls had gone ahead and that the gaps were being closed, they were very angry. 8 They all plotted together to come and fight against Jerusalem and stir up trouble against it. 9 But we prayed to our God and posted a guard day and night to meet this threat.

10 Meanwhile, the people in Judah said, “The strength of the laborers is giving out, and there is so much rubble that we cannot rebuild the wall.”

11 Also our enemies said, “Before they know it or see us, we will be right there among them and will kill them and put an end to the work.”

12 Then the Jews who lived near them came and told us ten times over, “Wherever you turn, they will attack us.”

13 Therefore I stationed some of the people behind the lowest points of the wall at the exposed places, posting them by families, with their swords, spears and bows. 14 After I looked things over, I stood up and said to the nobles, the officials and the rest of the people, “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord, who is great and awesome, and fight for your families, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.”

15 When our enemies heard that we were aware of their plot and that God had frustrated it, we all returned to the wall, each to our own work.

16 From that day on, half of my men did the work, while the other half were equipped with spears, shields, bows and armor. The officers posted themselves behind all the people of Judah 17 who were building the wall. Those who carried materials did their work with one hand and held a weapon in the other, 18 and each of the builders wore his sword at his side as he worked. But the man who sounded the trumpet stayed with me.

19 Then I said to the nobles, the officials and the rest of the people, “The work is extensive and spread out, and we are widely separated from each other along the wall. 20 Wherever you hear the sound of the trumpet, join us there. Our God will fight for us!”

21 So we continued the work with half the men holding spears, from the first light of dawn till the stars came out. 22 At that time I also said to the people, “Have every man and his helper stay inside Jerusalem at night, so they can serve us as guards by night and as workers by day.” 23 Neither I nor my brothers nor my men nor the guards with me took off our clothes; each had his weapon, even when he went for water.[c]

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Originally posted by corsair:
Sure haven't seen IDF soldiers dragging around women bleeding profusely from between their legs ...

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This is a good post.

While I don't know what the solution is, IMO Israel needs to take a long hard look at their internal situation and make some adjustments. The reality is that they're always living on the brink of war, and they can't stand easy, not even for a second.

How Hamas managed to execute a low-tech incursion of this magnatiude without some kind of forewarning from the Israeli intelligence service and border security is mind-boggling.

The fact that a mini-Burning Man type festival full of intoxicated 20-somethings was going on in the desert within easy striking distance of the Hamas border is also ridiculous in itself. The people over there want to kill you, and you just gave them thousands of easy targets.

Also, that a nation that requires compulsory military service and training does not allow it's citizens to own weapons without an onerous application process is beyond stupid. Your entire population is a trained fighting force, but then something like this happens and thousands are helplessly victimized because you denied them the means to defend themselves and their country. What's the sense in that?

This isn't the first time in Isarel's history that they've had to consider this:

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Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
Every time they murder a hostage, one random square mile of gaza gets flattened, civilians and all. DOn't stop until every hostage is returned. Repeat until they comply.

Then flatten a square mile for each victim regardless as reparations.

Then erase that ugly wart off the temple mount.