quote:

The (near)future is not just about electric vehicles, but autonomous electric vehicles.

That the government has full control over.

quote:

The (near)future is not just about electric vehicles, but autonomous electric vehicles.

quote:

Originally posted by Fly-Sig:

quote:

Originally posted by PR64:
I’m in a good situation for my EV.

House with a garage.

Solar on the roof.

Tesla power wall.

Charging station in the garage.

How much does all the solar generation, energy storage, and charging station cost? What does it amortize to across miles driven? Without government subsidies?

Around here, solar electric doesn't break even without the subsidies. In our home we do get plenty of passive solar warmth in the winter, and don't use air conditioning in the summer. There's no way to make an electric vehicle makes sense for us financially or in practice.

It’s not cheap for sure. Over 50K.

I live with my cousin and he put all the solar stuff on the house for his use. I didn’t have or want anything to do with it. He’s had a Chevy Volt for over a decade. We bought the house together 22 years ago. I thought that I would never get an EV and I’m against the mandate. Then when my Escape died on me in 104* heat because of a Rat’s Nest in front of my radiator, I got towed to a Ford dealership and saw the Mustang Mach E and fell in love with it.

Having the infrastructure already on my house made my impulse decision easier and possible. If I didn’t already have the equipment on my house I wouldn’t have bought my car.

I find myself agreeing with both sides of the discussion here…. Valid points each way.

I’ve said it before on this forum… most families have at least 2 cars and in most circumstances at least one of them can be an EV for banging around town and charging in your garage.

On our way back from Raleigh yesterday I tried the full self driving that Tesla has given many owners for a 30 test try for free and it did remarkably well. Is it ready for full scale adoption? Probably not at this point but in a couple of years? Absolutely! Mark my words, my 3 YO grand daughter will not need to get a drivers license.

California is in real trouble. 47% of their total taxes come from 200 guys. Just think if half of them left.



22:54

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fgJqRqWl0nk

thread, old, bumpity bumpity, et cetera...

The Mustang Mach E is becoming ubiquitous around here.

Funny going back and reading some of the stuff I posted about EV's and here I sit with two of them in the garage and no ICE vehicles for the first time in my life...

After driving my kids Civic hybrid, I don't know why someone would want an EV when you can get a lot of power and 50mpg out of a hybrid vehicle.

The Federal Tax credit expired at the end of last year, and Trump's tariffs are having an impact as well (e.g. Polestar 2). Only two months of car sales data since federal tax credit ended so too soon to tell.

Three of 10 slowest selling vehicles on the market are EVs and none of the 10 fastest selling are EVs:

VW's ID.4 for the 3rd month straight. At current sales rate, they have 1.5 years of inventory. It's been cancelled for 2026.

Mustang Mach-E. Used to be a Top 10 seller so people are wondering if this is the canary in the coal mine (too soon to tell). At current sales rate, they have 1 year of inventory.

Nissan Leaf. Newly redesigned but not selling well with nearly 10 months inventory sitting on dealer lots at current sales rate.

If you narrow it down to just trucks then 3 of the 10 slowest selling are EVs and none of the 10 fastest selling are EVs.

F-150 lightnight has about 8 months of inventory at current sales rate. It's been cancelled and replacement not coming out until next year.

Sierra EV & Silverado EV. At current sales rate 6.5 and 7.5 months of inventory on lots respectively. If you're pedantic and want everyone to know it please respond arguing the two trucks are different.

More cancelled EVs in 2026 (source Gemini AI):

Tesla has cancelled two of its former best selling car: Model S and Model X

Acura ZDX

Nissan Ariya & Leaf.

Genesis Electrified G80

Kia Niro EV

Hyundai Kona Electric & Ioniq 6

Dodge Charger Daytona SRT

Polestar 2. 100% tariff on Chinese built vehicles killed it.

EDIT: Fixed Leaf info. Leaf discontinued in '24 and brought back redesigned in '26.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: tatortodd,

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Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity

DISCLAIMER: These are the author's own personal views and do not represent the views of the author's employer.

quote:

Originally posted by Graniteguy:
After driving my kids Civic hybrid, I don't know why someone would want an EV when you can get a lot of power and 50mpg out of a hybrid vehicle.

I wish Toyota would get full self driving on their hybrid Corolla in the next 10 years. I would buy one but I may have to opt for another brand when the time comes.

Plenty of Tatortodds list were just bad designs, F150 limited range, Model S/X $100K vehicles, and who in their right mind decided that a classic muscle car line would be a good EV (Stellantis did).

Nobody wants an electric Charger, without a hemi, whats the point?.... I predict the Hurricane 6 will be a failure too, put a damn hemi

The big problem for EV's is China, if we let them in the USA all the domestic EV products will end, we cannot compete. Canada is doing that to get back at the US.

I do like the GMC/Silverado EV pickups, very cool and well built with plenty of range, but again $80K on average is just stupid, gas or EV.

I'm kind of waiting for either the bottom to drop out of the new EV market and/or for the glut of off-lease EVs coming soon to pick one up cheap as a 3rd car.

It may well be the future. but it isn't mine.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
Plenty of Tatortodds list were just bad designs, F150 limited range, Model S/X $100K vehicles..

The other theme of the fastest and slowest selling vehicles/Trucks is expensive/luxury vehicles are selling poorly. The model S was the trifecta with EV, expensive, and luxury.

I was kind of surprised at the Miata being on the slow list with nationally having 315 days of inventory as locally they're about 41 days inventory. Perhaps nationally it's the Northerners not buying convertibles in the winter .

Speaking of Miata, it's the EV that I desire. I think EV's make great 2nd cars and having an AWD convertible torque monster with 50/50 weight distribution would be awesome. I saw a video today where Mazda's European head of design unfortunately said it's 2 to 3 years off and part of the reason is they can't decide on powerplant (hybrid vs pure EV).

My gracious of the top 10 fastest selling cars 9 are from Toyota!

I can't say never.

I would love to buy a Spéirling, but I can't find a local dealership or a 1.3 million dollar tax credit from the government.

My wife's accident in the Pacifica left us with a rental car for the last couple of weeks. My daily drive is a Flex and she was able to use that with the kiddos since Enterprise didn't have any minivans available the day we went to get them. Given the choices available we opted for Tesla Model 3 Long Range... I've always wanted to drive one.

I love it, mostly. We've swapped it out twice for different Tesla models to try them... so a 2025 Model 3 Long Range, a 2023 Y, and a 2023 Model 3.

The 3's are hoot to drive, for sure, especially the long range. Charging isn't a big issue, at least in these parts. There are convenient options, though if I had one I would surely want a charger at home, but that would drive the per-mile cost even lower than the 40% or so it is in the Flex or the Pacifica.

In the end, of the current offerings there isn't a viable EV option for her car... we use that for road trips and carrying all the stuff that goes with it. It would work for me 95% of the time, though. And would save us money.

Yea, if I had something like the Model 3 and a beater of a pick-up, I'd be set. I don't know how that translates to non-California, though. I imagine we have more charging infrastructure than many other locales.

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
More cancelled EVs in 2026 (source Gemini AI):

Nissan Ariya & Leaf

Just goes to show you AI doesn’t know everything. The Nissan Leaf isn’t cancelled for 2026. Just the opposite, they made an all new one, and the all new one is awful to me. They went from a hatch to a CUV. FMC. Same name, the Nissan Leaf. Your AI needs to do some pushups or something.

And that worked out well for me. Just sold mine, after 12 years of use and virtually no maintenance, and basically free juice. And bought another one. A ‘24 with 3000 miles on it for $19.5k still under b2b factory warranty for 18 months. Just like my last one I’m taking advantage of the depreciation on them. My previous one was bulletproof reliable. Newer one has double the HP, 36 more ft lbs of torque, and triple the range. I did not get no federal rebate or tax incentive on either.

Some of us have been at this game for over a decade. Not real big news that expensive EV’s depreciate like this. It was the same story over 12 years ago when I originally got one so it’s far from “news” now. I leased it first, knowing I would be able to buy it from them at lease turn it for pennies on the dollar. I bought it from them for $6500, at 36 months, drove it for another 9 years, and sold it for $5500. Ironically, from down payment on the lease, every lease payment, buying it from them, putting it on a short 3 years loan, adding a 7 year b2b warranty from Nissan to make it 10 full years of b2b warranty, $19.5k. The irony makes me I laugh because the bitching over these 12 years has been hilarious. The gotcha stuff, finger pointing, etc. And what really wets my noodle is my previous one was built in Japan, which is my preference. Japanese make, Japanese built. To me nobody builds as well as they do providing you buy the right model. Well the newer one was built here, in Tennessee. Same thing on my truck, JDM brand but built here in the USA, providing jobs to Americans.

Smart buyers can turn the table on the house. A smaller, inexpensive EV makes a lot of sense if you live in a major metro, or if it has enough range for you to get basic errands done living rural. I was 12 years in and wanted a change, but I couldn’t deny the smart money. This newer one will last me until retirement and it has enough legs to work when I can pull off my move to rural land. It’ll work there too. I just got an almost brand new vehicle for $19.5k in this market and in these times. It’ll need tires, and in-cabin air filters like the last one. Only maintenance I ever had to do in 12 years was flush the brake fluid out with new fluid. And I thought the HVAC system broke one time. Nope, just out of refrigerant. It’s Satan’s ass hole hot here so I used up all the AC juice.

Expensive shit depreciates like mad too. Plenty of European ICE vehicles depreciate like mad. Fancy this and that. Nothing is new in this space, literally. Nothing new under the sun. If it’s a stupid image type vehicle, with an expensive price tag, and it’s not a Ferrari or Porsche GT model, chances are there will be steep depreciation.

quote:

Originally posted by bigwagon:
I'm kind of waiting for either the bottom to drop out of the new EV market and/or for the glut of off-lease EVs coming soon to pick one up cheap as a 3rd car.

It dropped out over a decade ago. Used, they’ve always been cheap to acquire. Depending on where you source your data, 55% to 70% of new EV’s are leased. Always been deals on them, even Teslas. I would stick to the smaller and lighter ones. The bigger the range, the heavier they are, which equals shittier handling IMO. The bigger and heavier they are the more the insurance is as well. Some of them are overly complicated, while others are actually pretty simple and straight forward designs. You can hit the forums up, do your research for reliability, but the problem is many of the current new ones just don’t have the long term track record to learn from. Stick to models that have been around quite some time, and buy used, and you can do well.