P220Smudge let me know when you get your tri lug review and analysis done. At this point I have like 6 different brands in use and they all work fine. But I need a couple more so let me know what I should buy.

Even after the gun, $200 for the SBR, stock, and accessories, you are still less than a lot of the competition PCCs and far less than an SP5. Awesome.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
But I need a couple more so let me know what I should buy.

Will do.

quote:

Originally posted by flesheatingvirus:
Even after the gun, $200 for the SBR, stock, and accessories, you are still less than a lot of the competition PCCs and far less than an SP5. Awesome.

Yeah, I had been pricing it out and I was thinking it was going to be more around a grand, eleven hundred. They have some around there that come with braces, but I'd rather skip that. When I saw $878 for getting into the platform, that was that.

Should have the Scorpion lower Tuesday, I'll get that built out with the binary and ready to go. With any luck, I may have it to the range in the next week or so.

Gen 1 Lingle lower showed up. Gonna build it out with my Franklin BFS III tomorrow. The Stribog was set to be delivered to my FFL today, but UPS tracking says "An emergency situation has delayed delivery. / Delivery will be delayed by one business day." Never seen that before. As of an hour ago, it apparently went back out from Goodyear over to my FFL in Gilbert, so with any luck, I may get to pick it up tomorrow. That would be nice. Really looking forward to it.

I'm going to just take it straight to the range and shoot it without a brace or anything. I was thinking about going the braced pistol route, but I don't want to mess with that. If it runs right, I'll get the Form 1 on it started and just get a stock or two lined up.

I need to order a 1/2x28 direct thread mount for my can. Ecco makes an ultralight aluminum mount I'm thinking I want to try. Any reason not to go with aluminum? I know if I reef on the threads, I can strip it out where it's probably less of a risk with steel. The answer there is probably "just don't reef on it." I have an 8oz suppressor, so a really light mount kind of appeals to me. I would like to eventually get with either the tri lug or EZ-Lok system for all my PCC's going forward, but a direct thread 1/2x28 direct thread adapter might be nice to have on hand even if I do that.

Speaking of that, I'm going to look around and price out having my Scorpion barrel threads cut down to 1/2x28 just to get on the same page. It's a Gen 1, so it predates them shipping with M18 for the barrel nut and 1/2x28 on the end, it's just straight M18. Even if I'm direct threading, I'd prefer to have the same mount in the can and just move it back and forth as needed.

Saturday afternoon edit - My FFL has it, got the first appointment available, tomorrow at 2pm. Pretty excited. Need to get off my butt and put this lower together today.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: P220 Smudge,

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
Gen 1 Lingle lower showed up. Gonna build it out with my Franklin BFS III tomorrow. The Stribog was set to be delivered to my FFL today, but UPS tracking says "An emergency situation has delayed delivery. / Delivery will be delayed by one business day." Never seen that before. As of an hour ago, it apparently went back out from Goodyear over to my FFL in Gilbert, so with any luck, I may get to pick it up tomorrow. That would be nice. Really looking forward to it.

I'm going to just take it straight to the range and shoot it without a brace or anything. I was thinking about going the braced pistol route, but I don't want to mess with that. If it runs right, I'll get the Form 1 on it started and just get a stock or two lined up.

I need to order a 1/2x28 direct thread mount for my can. Ecco makes an ultralight aluminum mount I'm thinking I want to try. Any reason not to go with aluminum? I know if I reef on the threads, I can strip it out where it's probably less of a risk with steel. The answer there is probably "just don't reef on it." I have an 8oz suppressor, so a really light mount kind of appeals to me. I would like to eventually get with either the tri lug or EZ-Lok system for all my PCC's going forward, but a direct thread 1/2x28 direct thread adapter might be nice to have on hand even if I do that.

Speaking of that, I'm going to look around and price out having my Scorpion barrel threads cut down to 1/2x28 just to get on the same page. It's a Gen 1, so it predates them shipping with M18 for the barrel nut and 1/2x28 on the end, it's just straight M18. Even if I'm direct threading, I'd prefer to have the same mount in the can and just move it back and forth as needed.

Saturday afternoon edit - My FFL has it, got the first appointment available, tomorrow at 2pm. Pretty excited. Need to get off my butt and put this lower together today.

Just go tri-lug. I never trust direct thread unless you loctite/rocksett it. Tri-lug cannot walk off or loosen.

Just my .02.

The only direct thread can I have is a thunderbeast and it is not true direct thread. tapered mount so there is some good interference when I hand torque the can on.

Tri-lug is simple, solid and goof proof.

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Tri-lug is simple, solid and goof proof.

Yeah, I've been using plumber's tape on the threads of my Scorpion and my can absolutely hasn't moved, but I want a solution where I can move it back and forth between the Scorpion and the Stribog and direct threading and screwing around with plumber's tape isn't the way. That's for cans that are just going to live where you mount them. Tri lug is a known quantity.

One of the guys in my NV group is a machinist. I was talking to him earlier about re-threading my Scorpion barrel for 1/2x28 and he said to bring it by the shop any time in the next few weeks while they're in between big jobs. He's only a fifteen minute drive, so that makes it easy.

Ordering two Kaw Valley Precision tri lug adapters and their mount. So that'll be that for suppressing the both of them, and still gives me flexibility later on with other pistol cans.

Went to my FFL yesterday and did the 4473 dance. Delayed. Need to get a UPIN, I'm so tired of this.
Got a proceed this morning, but he was already booked up for the day. I pick it up in the morning. I did get to look it over while we were waiting, and it seems well-built and very solid. It has three of the straight mags with the steel reinforced lips, so it's a newer one, but not the newest-newest they're shipping with the curved mags. Supposedly those are really good.

I got the Lingle lower put together with the binary. Function checks ok, but only one minor issue - the outer dimensions of the lower are narrower than an AR lower and while the safety/selector works when it's all assembled, there's a gap under one of the sides. The safety detent holds it in position, but it feels a little janky. If it runs right, I'm gonna have to do some tinkering with some nylon shims, see if I can't get that a little more solidified. Not something I would've thought to check until it was all put together, but oh well. Not entirely unexpected to have a minor hiccup and need to fit a trigger into a system that wasn't meant to accept it.

Got it home. First impression is this is a really well-made firearm. Machining is clean, everything fits together nicely, no rattle - snug, and smooth.

HBI’s B&T MP5 stock retrofit kit is probably going to be the way to go. I like the way it looks, I like the length of pull, and the hinge mechanism will accept the SBT Bren 2 brace I have sitting on a parts shelf. That can hold me over until I’m ready to paper it I guess.

The hammer my binary uses won’t fall correctly when mated to the upper. Going to need to see if the other, smaller style will work with the whole system. If not, I’m gonna need one of those anyways to go in the lower and yank all the binary stuff out and go with a decent AR trigger. I have a spare ALG QMS in a bag of parts somewhere that’ll work for now. Would be nice to have a binary in it, but it’s looking like a lot of hoops to jump through to make this particular one work. We’ll see.

My tri lug stuff shipped out today, waiting to see what the tracking info looks like. Hopefully that stuff shows up quickly and I can get it to other range some time in the next week. Is a tri lug torque wrench super critical? Didn’t even know that was a thing until last night. Might just Rocksett that bitch and crank it down with some padded vise grips.

what the heck is a tri lug torque wrench? A tri lug wrench is absolutely needed if your chosen tri lug does not have wrench flats on it (and many don't). I didn't look at the KVP adapters you spec'd but if they have wrench flats you don't need anything. I use red locktite as I hate rocksett but go with something.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
what the heck is a tri lug torque wrench? A tri lug wrench is absolutely needed if your chosen tri lug does not have wrench flats on it (and many don't). I didn't look at the KVP adapters you spec'd but if they have wrench flats you don't need anything. I use red locktite as I hate rocksett but go with something.

Yeah my tri-lug mount (Rugged)has wrench flats on it.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
what the heck is a tri lug torque wrench?

There's a bunch of variations of this in the $25-50 range.

https://angstadtarms.com/product/3-lug-wrench/

These are the tri lug adapters I ordered:
https://kawvalleyprecision.com...-suppressor-adapter/

No wrench flats in the 1/2x28 flavor, so I guess I need the torque wrench adapter.

I'm probably just going to order one of these, then.

https://sdtacticalarms.com/product/3-lug-tool/

As an aside, this is the tri lug mount I ordered as well:

https://kawvalleyprecision.com...vp-mach-3-lug-mount/

Was $140, shipped, for the mount and two muzzle devices from Gunmagwhorehouse. Not bad!

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
I use red locktite as I hate rocksett but go with something.

That's funny, I'm the exact opposite. I used to have to remove stuck bolts at work in a machine shop where we used to absolutely slop red Loctite on stuff. If it got built wrong, or if it came back for service, I had to go after them damn things with welding gloves and work my way up from propane torches to MAPP gas to even having to weld new nuts and such on in order to get stuff apart. I fucking hate Loctite red.

Conversely, you can chemically deactivate Rocksett with penetrating oils like PB Blaster. Drizzle some into the threads, give it a half hour, and it turns it into the consistency of wet toothpaste. Comes off super easy. No heat, no boiling, no problems.

Either of the tools you show will get the job done. The one I have has an actual handle of adequate size (don't remember vendor) so you don't have to go find a 3/8 drive wrench to use the thing.
My experience on muzzle threadlockers is exactly the opposite. With red loctite I grab a torch and an IR temp measurement meter. Heat to 500f (easy on a gun barrel threaded device) and remove.
On Rocksett I boil bake spray try incantations and pray and it never works well...
What suppressor are you using, I got lost in all the various threads on this.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
On Rocksett I boil bake spray try incantations and pray and it never works well...

Well, hopefully my method holds. I Rocksett the direct thread mount into the can, so I guess we're gonna find out soon. All the tri lug stuff arrives Saturday, so I need to pull apart the Scorpion and take the barrel off to my buddy's shop, may as well get the mount out of the can while I'm at it.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
What suppressor are you using, I got lost in all the various threads on this.

This one, in the 6.5" ten baffle version.

quote:

Conversely, you can chemically deactivate Rocksett with penetrating oils like PB Blaster. Drizzle some into the threads, give it a half hour, and it turns it into the consistency of wet toothpaste. Comes off super easy. No heat, no boiling, no problems.

That sure sounded like the voice of someone who had done that a bunch of times successfully. But then we get "Well, hopefully my method holds" Which is it? huge difference... I'd switch to Rocksett if it was easy to get off but I have never seen an easy description like that nor anyone with actual experience saying it works. So I'm waiting to see how it goes on your can.

It has worked for me every time I've tried it, so I'm confident it'll work, but I try to be a little more conservative in my claims. I'll let you know.

You're a Bren 2 owner, but I don't recall seeing whether you've swapped out the handguards. If you have, you know the threadlocker CZ uses is some really stout stuff, and they use a lot of it. Stripping out those bolts is almost a rite of passage for guys changing out for the HBI rail. Everything on the subreddit said to get them smoking hot and then go at it, but when I tried it, I found they didn't want to budge any more than they did without it. I started to round one out, and stopped. Went back to the drawing board, and came back with some PB Blaster. I applied it for two days, morning and night, to each bolt holding the handguard on. I stretched a rubber band over the Torx bit and started with the one I had started to round out, went slow, and it came out with ease. The successive bolts all came out with ease once I broke the torque. Zero damage, no need to bear down on them. The threadlocker was white, and had the consistency of toothpaste. I was shocked.

I did this with my factory Scorpion barrel nut, same result. I slopped a lot of Vibratite Hot Lock (same concept as Rocksett: silica-based threadlocker) on there when I changed to the Pakse handguard, and used PB Blaster, this time letting it sit about a half hour. Same result. I changed the mount in my Polonium that I had used Hot Lock on and it came out with ease using PB Blaster.

So, call it a dozen fittings of varying types tested on so far. My results have been consistent. I'll let you know either way.


Speaking of HBI, I freaking love those guys. That Bren rail I mentioned, I had problems with it coming loose (and was going to use Hot Lock) and decided to email them. They told me the anchor plates were an older version and they wanted to swap me out. I told them I was a twenty minute drive from them and asked if I could swing by. They said "Your parts are waiting at the front desk!" Swapped out my stuff, had a brief but nice chat with the dude at the desk, who had a Glock 19 sitting on the desk next him. Yesterday, I ordered the MP5 retrofit stock kit and their short stroke buffer. They shipped a half hour later, and they're out for delivery today. I will absolutely recommend them to anyone for anything they offer. What a great company.

* Edit- Short stroke buffer installed. The B&T stock seems nice. I got it off the hinge plate and the SB brace I had sitting around from my Bren swapped on there. This is a really light, handy little package. Looking forward to doing a Form 1 on this one. The tri lug stuff arrives tomorrow. Time to start stripping the Scorpion and can down. I'll get a picture of the Stribog once I get my can on it. Really liking the dimensions: It's just enough of everything it needs to be with no extra. That said, I think I'm gonna try to run down a JTAC rail extension to get one more Mlok slot and bring it up even with the threads on the barrel.

It occurred to me that the B&T stock should fit on the hinge plate for the Bren brace, and sure enough, it does. I need to run a file along the inside edge of the hinge to get it to close, but that done, it should work just fine. Should be interesting to try on the Bren.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: P220 Smudge,

Well, I had used some snap ring pliers to get the Silencerco direct thread mount into my can in the first place, just hand tight. Yeah... I know.




It doesn't wanna get it backed out because it's not the right tool. Mount has no wrench flats, which... is wonderful. Ordered a variable pin size spanner wrench, should be here in the morning. I'll get it wrapped up in a scrap bike inner tube in the vise and see if it'll come out easy. I think if it had wrench flats on the base, it'd already be a done deal.

On that note, the Kaw Valley Precision stuff showed up. I'm suitably impressed. The tri lug is mounted on the Stribog and the tri lug mount goes on smooth with zero play, locks up the way it ought to. Can't wait to get it mounted in my can. Taking my Scorpion barrel to my buddy's machine shop tomorrow, hopefully that doesn't take long. It'll essentially have the tip of the tri lug flush mounted with the 6" handguard when he's done, so the can will be a little recessed. An improvement, to be sure.

Handling the Stribog with the brace and red dot mounted, it's striking how much slimmer, lighter, and handier it feels compared to the Scorpion. I have to drive to NY and back starting next week, so it'll be a little bit before I can really try it out, but when I do, I'll get to shoot it suppressed and compare it to the Scorpion pretty much straight away. I'm gonna yank the binary out of the Lingle lower and just see if it'll take the ALG trigger I have sitting around. If it'll function check with that, I'll be a happy camper.

quote:

Mount has no wrench flats, which... is wonderful

Doesn't it take a 12pt wrench?
In any case I gathered and made the parts from my P220Smudge rocksett challenge. I made up a couple of threaded rods with 1/2-28 threads and found a couple of muzzle devices I will never use. Tomorrow I'll rocksett them and then we shall try a few different removal methods. In this case I don't have a very valuable barrel in the mix to I'm going to be more aggressive than I have been. Report to follow in a few days.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
Doesn't it take a 12pt wrench?

Nah, it's one of these. The holes measure about 4mm. Hopefully I can get it loose myself, but if not, I'll take it to my favorite shop and ask them to help me out. Probably bring the whole shebang and have them check it with an alignment rod.

https://silencerco.com/shop/al...thread-mount-copy-2/

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
In any case I gathered and made the parts from my P220Smudge rocksett challenge. I made up a couple of threaded rods with 1/2-28 threads and found a couple of muzzle devices I will never use. Tomorrow I'll rocksett them and then we shall try a few different removal methods. In this case I don't have a very valuable barrel in the mix to I'm going to be more aggressive than I have been. Report to follow in a few days.

I hope it works the way it has for me! I've been thinking I need to dig around and find my bucket of scrap nuts and bolts and do some more experimenting on my own as well.

I thought you had the ecco mount. Pin wrench options really, really suck if you need a decent amount of torque. I've had to make one to solve that on an outboard project. Why would they pick that option for a mount tightening option, its silly and expensive to machine. Mcmaster may have a heavy duty one that fits but without measurements be a guess on my part. luckily not too hard to make something that will fit.

Well, I'm emailing my NFA shop to see if they can get it out.

Pin wrench fits in there great, I can get plenty of torque on it. I can't get enough grip on the can that it doesn't turn in the vise and I don't have a tube clamp thing, so I'm stopping before I ruin something. Never going to use a mount like this again.

*Edit - NFA shop says they recommend against using Rocksett on mounts for this reason and to ask the manufacturer, but they'd be willing to take a crack at it. I sent Ecco an email. Hopefully I'll hear back soon.

In the meanwhile, I pulled the binary out of the lower last night and threw an ALG QMS I had sitting around in there. Function checks fine now. I think I'll want something with a physically lighter hammer, though. It feels like a long lock time for a gun this little. I need to get a better optic setup eventually, I can't stand low mounts anymore, but it's a dot I had sitting on a shelf to at least get started with. Since threads are worthless without pics....

First the idea than anyone would design a product that requires one to thread one part into another and they don't give you a way to hold the parts is an idiot. Especially in a universe where carbon fouling is a known issue. And in the suppressor world there are a lot of them.
But I would also then conclude your methods of rocksett removal were also not successful (I've been to busy to work on my test samples).