Unfortunately, it's all about winning, not justice.

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
...if Kyle is convicted then no citizen is safe to defend himself with deadly force, instead having to analyze fleeting circumstances to satisfy the legal class.

Umm...no. I don't know what they do in UT, but that "no citizen" nonsense ain't happening in a lot of places.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
...if Kyle is convicted then no citizen is safe to defend himself with deadly force, instead having to analyze fleeting circumstances to satisfy the legal class.

Umm...no. I don't know what they do in UT, but that "no citizen" nonsense ain't happening in a lot of places.

While I totally agree with you that that BS will not work in many places it doesn't change that the left is pushing for you to not be able to legally defend yourself.

When I saw the below I had to laugh and yell....exactly this is what the 2nd is about dumbass! They re scared of all the "right wing" kooks and our firepower and need to make us scared of ever using it to defend ourselves

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
This proves that the state can just tell lies and convict you.

Did I miss a conviction?

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
This proves that the state can just tell lies and convict you.

Did I miss a conviction?

No, this is a general statement.

I sat on a jury once and all the state did was lie about the offender, which we let go because they lied.

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
I sat on a jury once and all the state did was lie about the offender, which we let go because they lied.

Wouldn't that just be an example of the opposite of the point you're trying to prove, with the prosecution lying but then not getting a conviction?

quote:

Originally posted by 220-9er:
Unfortunately, it's all about winning, not justice.

Very true and very sad. Last week I thought to myself that the prosecutor is "just doing his job". As I thought more it seems that the job should be justice, truthful and fair justice, not a conviction at all costs.

Listening to his closing he sure plays fast and loose with the facts and I think this may be the first time I heard a pedophile referred to as a hero.

If this wasn't such a high profile jurisdiction with an AR "machine gun" involved, in other words, a more typical shooting, charges wouldn't have been filed.
If he is found not guilty and the protesters/rioters show up, I'd bet a guy with a an AR in a sling or holstered handgun will get a different level of respect.

How many men have been jailed or put to death because the prosecution just outright lied?

Kyle is lucky the Judge is pushing back, but Kyle's counsel is dropping the ball in a lot of areas.

Our trial had great counsel and called out the cops and PA on every detail. It's WHY we let him go on a DUI.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
...if Kyle is convicted then no citizen is safe to defend himself with deadly force, instead having to analyze fleeting circumstances to satisfy the legal class.

Umm...no. I don't know what they do in UT, but that "no citizen" nonsense ain't happening in a lot of places.

My perspective is based on the nature of progressivism. All they need is a precedent established and they work from there. You and I may be safe where we are now, but when the Left changes the culture far enough and in enough States then our safe sense is left vulnerable. I’m done with it. No more progress toward captivity in a pseudo free country. Not one more step.

If the Prosecution is lying during summation and final argument, doesn't the Defense have the right to object???

It’s aggravating when Court TV censors, by silencing audio, for long periods of time.

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
My perspective is based on the nature of progressivism.

As you point out, it's called progressivism for a reason.

quote:

Originally posted by erj_pilot:
If the Prosecution is lying during summation and final argument, doesn't the Defense have the right to object???

No, I don't believe they are allowed to object during closing arguments.

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
This proves that the state can just tell lies and convict you.

I find the general amount of lies, deception, and bullshit (before even getting into straight corruption) that's allowed by and generally systemic in our system, on the government side in particular, by "the State" itself, to be outrageously appalling.

From Traffic Court to Murder Cases to Congress and the rest, at all levels, across all parties, our system is more fucked up than a proverbial Football-Bat, barely not a banana-like republic in one hundred ways. It "looks" nice and civilized, but...

To be fair, I understand that it's better here than, say, Guatemala, or Iran, and so on, obviously, but damn, we're so messed up, institutionally, wherein most of it, good parts included, seems to survive based on sheer mass and momentum alone.

This "peace" and "civilization" and "law and order" and "truth and justice" we all more or less enjoy here is barely hanging on, a razor thin veneer in so many ways, hardly no clear "good guys" anymore - institutionally bankrupt, almost all of it.

I trust certain ideas and ideals, certain individuals and small groups, but the rest, the rest is a hot mess, and "monsters" like how this case is being prosecuted are everywhere. Lies and Bullshit, at all levels, treated as right/normal.

It's a Freight Train with no brakes nearly careening off steep cliffs, civilization.

It's wild, annoying, and disheartening to watch, again and again.

One can only really hope to avoid most of it.

(This is my excited face.)

Wish I could watch this today. Too noisy and busy here.

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
...if Kyle is convicted then no citizen is safe to defend himself with deadly force, instead having to analyze fleeting circumstances to satisfy the legal class.

Umm...no. I don't know what they do in UT, but that "no citizen" nonsense ain't happening in a lot of places.

My perspective is based on the nature of progressivism. All they need is a precedent established and they work from there. You and I may be safe where we are now, but when the Left changes the culture far enough and in enough States then our safe sense is left vulnerable. I’m done with it. No more progress toward captivity in a pseudo free country. Not one more step.

Sounds like a defeatist mentality to me. Oh that's the way it is. It's gonna happen anyway. I get it. There are times I feel that way, too. But, I came to my sense. Freedom, liberty and the right to self preserve are worth fighting tooth and nail with these commies for. And dying for. They take a mile, we take back two.

Going last in closing arguments is a distinct advantage.

quote:

Originally posted by Ogie:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by erj_pilot:

No, I don't believe they are allowed to object during closing arguments.

^^^
You can object it doesn’t happen often but it does happen.

I can't watch this Gary Oldman look-alike.
Just can't stomach it or his closing lies.