Rather than ban a whole topic, why not ban those who cannot control themselves from the topic? So far, that would be only one tantrum prone individual.

It is illogical to think that as the country has moved away from religion since Roe, that religion is responsible for the increase in abortion prohibitions. It’s more likely that unrestricted abortion, especially partial birth and fetus harvesting, has offended people’s moral compass. That hardly makes these people ideologically fanatics, but now the majority position. Rant, call names, and threaten them all you want, but the unrestricted abortion crowd is now the minority.

quote:

Originally posted by DougE:
I'm a Christian, so obviously pro life, but I'd like to think that if I weren't a Christian, I'd still be dedicated to protecting the most vulnerable form of life .... the fully human but yet unborn.

Amen! You would think ALL "intelligent" beings would think this way...preserve life. I guess this world is chock-full of the unintelligent.

Proverbs 6:16-19

16
There are six things the Lord hates,
seven that are detestable to him:
17
haughty eyes,
a lying tongue,
hands that shed innocent blood,
18
a heart that devises wicked schemes,
feet that are quick to rush into evil,
19
a false witness who pours out lies
and a person who stirs up conflict in the community.

Just a few wild thoughts.

Roe V Wade, 1973

365 days a year... 49 years... roughly 17855 days.

62,500,000 abortions

Averages 3494 abortions a day.... a day.

That to me is a staggering number.

That is like experiencing 9-11 daily.

I understand there are instances where it may be appropriate, medical for baby or mother, rape, incest etc.

But these numbers? This is overwhelmingly birth control.

I find it intolerable.

When people have absolutely no self control, this is what happens.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:
All over a bunch of kids none of you even give any real fucks about, and you know it. It's all posturing, ideology, and meddling.

What a complete fucking piece of shit you are. "Look"? "Polite"? Fuck you, you piece of shit.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
He says he would like it more if it was restricted at 20 weeks rather than 15 weeks...
BUT that really concedes the point: It should be left up to the people to decide in individual states.
Over-turning Roe v Wade would return power to the States and to the people through their elected representatives.

This is the right answer. Abortion isn't covered by the Constitution. Either way. The Constitution doesn't ban or allow abortion - it is simply not covered and the cases that got the Court to Roe, and Roe itself made that up out of whole cloth.

So it should be left to each individual state.

Which makes no one happy. Anti-abortion people will be unhappy because Massachusetts and California will permit almost all abortions. Pro-abortion people will be sad to see that Texas and Alabama ban almost all, if not all abortions.

But that is what the Constitution actually demands.

quote:

Originally posted…

Shameful, devisive, bullshit.

I truly can’t fathom how anyone can view being anti-abortion as shameful. That’s a truly kind-boggling stance. Not killing the unborn is shameful?

Just wow.

quote:

Originally posted by goose5:
I view the high court as being divided into thirds. 3 left, 3 moderate, and 3 right. How do the moderates usually break on tough cases?

That oversimplifies the court too much. Three labels for justices and talking about the two ends of the political spectrum is too simple. Different justices have differing views depending very much on the issues presented by any particular case.

quote:

Originally posted by jhe888:

This is the right answer. Abortion isn't covered by the Constitution. Either way. The Constitution doesn't ban or allow abortion - it is simply not covered and the cases that got the Court to Roe, and Roe itself made that up out of whole cloth.

So it should be left to each individual state.

Which makes no one happy. Anti-abortion people will be unhappy because Massachusetts and California will permit almost all abortions. Pro-abortion people will be sad to see that Texas and Alabama ban almost all, if not all abortions.

But that is what the Constitution actually demands.

Yup

Many times the best solutions leave both sides a little bit happy and a little bit uncomfortable. This should always have been decided at the state level as so much else should be as well. Federal government overreach should worry us all.

You want an abortion? Go get one in he couple dozen states that will allow it. If it’s that big of an issue to you then move to that state.

As for the posts above, how about Para just nukes you? You haven’t been able to stay calm or even reasonable even with gentle hints from above. You also commit the grievous sin of assuming what you know nothing about. Telling moral people they don’t care about the unborn is comical coming from someone condoning their termination. You accuse us of religious zealotry but you are the only one exhibiting that kind of behavior.

And by the way, if standing up for principle loses an election then so be it. Enjoy voting with lefty.

Regardless what I think about abortion itself, Roe v Wade follows a terrible line of legal logic that was started in Griswald v Connecticut. For that reason alone, it and, Griswald also, should be reversed.

However, if this happens, look for huge new calls for the SCOTUS to be packed. Most of the female half of the populace of the country would be up in arms about it.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:

Most of the female half of the populace of the country would be up in arms about it.

Which is why conservatives are fooling themselves if we don't recognize that a big change in abortion law won't have a big effect on our ability to get candidates elected across the board. Many middle of the road voters will abandon the GOP over this issue.

You may think you are better off without these voters, but if we can't win majorities, we can't get anything we want. Nothing.

I get it, if your world view is that abortion is intolerable, you can't do anything else. But don't be surprised when this costs the right elections and huge chunks of the rest of our agenda.

Maybe. If I told you gay marriage was on a referendum in California you, like me, would probably think it would never not pass. Yet it didn’t. Only SC intervention saved it. This country isn’t as liberal as we sometimes think. Besides which we need to shift the momentum back to the states or big government will make the country not worth saving. I will take that bet.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:
...All over a bunch of kids none of you even give any real fucks about, and you know it. It's all posturing, ideology, and meddling.

Bullshit, in the simplest sense.

Shameful, devisive, bullshit...

Not that anyone needs to know, or that I can even prove it, but I say a prayer for the souls of "that bunch of kids" that supposedly no one cares about. I send out emails and participate in Pro Life events also, for those "kids" supposedly know one cares about.

Interesting that you use the word "kids" when describing babies that are aborted. Kinda difficult to use the argument lifeless lump of inanimate tissue and "kids" when attempting to justify the killing of the unborn.

According to you, I am now a zealot. Am I also a zealot for opposing anti-2A efforts, when I donate money, read proposed gun control bills and send out emails and post threads informing others, and knock on doors to try and stop them from becoming bad law?

Offensive hate-filled vitriol such as what you have displayed in this thread, is what is "divisive"...and explosive emotional grenades, such as what you tossed in this thread, are the same exact tactic used by the Progressive Marxist Radical Left when they can't use facts to justify their policies and positions.

Shut up, don't talk about what I don't like, and gimme what I want... or I'm gonna pick up my ball and go home if you don't do what I want.

I can go to Walmart and watch a 3 year old have a temper tantrum in a shopping cart, so I don't need to come to a forum to watch a meltdown.

I come to this forum for information, some good natured humor and fun...and discussion.

You've made it abundantly clear that you are Pro Abortion and hate anyone who is Pro Life, and you've gone so far as to threaten pulling your support for Republicans...but you still haven't explained why you support abortion, how it is a Constitutional right, or why the federal government should have a role in promoting, facilitating, or funding it...or even offered any supporting facts to your belief that the possibility of Roe v. Wade being overturned would lead to future losses for Republicans. Assertions are worthless without facts.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
46and2 is a Republican, who happens to be staunchly and dogmatically pro-choice. He's unwavering in his position. That's all it is. I don't think there's anything more to it than that.

After 46and2's first offensive emotional post, followed by an apology of sorts, I was going to skip mentioning this... but now that he has decided to jump back into the discussion with another offensive post making assumptions about members being divisive, I think it's worth knowing that he has made recent comments in support of teaching CRT.

Might be interesting to know where he stands on BLM as well.

Edited: spelling correction and added comment.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Modern Day Savage,

quote:

Originally posted by Dreamerx4:
Just a few wild thoughts.

Roe V Wade, 1973

365 days a year... 49 years... roughly 17855 days.

62,500,000 abortions

Averages 3494 abortions a day.... a day.

That to me is a staggering number.

That is like experiencing 9-11 daily.

I understand there are instances where it may be appropriate, medical for baby or mother, rape, incest etc.

But these numbers? This is overwhelmingly birth control.

I find it intolerable.

You perfectly laid out my issue with all of this. I'm not religious right, or wing-nut left. And though it would likely put me at odds with a few here, I would and could accept some minimal level of these procedures. But what is occurring today is utterly and completely ridiculous. Maybe if a person comes in for the second or third time seeking an abortion, they should get it and a sterilization procedure. I have all my dogs fixed because they have no impulse control, maybe these people should be treated no different.

And 46and2, there's significant debate and discussion going on in this thread between people with highly differing opinions, yet you are the only one lashing out hurling insults. Consider that for a moment.

I think the fears of abortion becoming this formidable wedge issue impacting 2022 are exaggerated. The actual killing of infants isn't as popular as the left would have you believe. Of course, I do realize they get billions of dollars in free issue specific advertisements from their activist giving us our evening news, but it's going to be a tough sell with the other issues currently demanding the voters attention. It's already routinely accepted by the folks living in their alternative reality that Republicans hate women...that only really plays to their base. The portion of this country that decides our elections probably aren't fanatical on the issue of abortion.

quote:

Originally posted by jhe888:

quote:

Originally posted by goose5:
I view the high court as being divided into thirds. 3 left, 3 moderate, and 3 right. How do the moderates usually break on tough cases?

That oversimplifies the court too much. Three labels for justices and talking about the two ends of the political spectrum is too simple. Different justices have differing views depending very much on the issues presented by any particular case.

Yep, I agree with this overview. However, there is one attribute that has underscored the operating of the court, regardless who's sat on it, for at least the last 20 years. That attribute is 'cowardice'. The court, especially under Roberts, has continually failed to uphold the tenants of the Constitution because of a perceived impact to society. So as the legislative branch has continued to shirk their responsibility and instead hand off issues to the high court to decide, the court in turn has refused to live up to their responsibilities as well in upholding the Constitutionality of cases put before it.

Did I read correctly that in Arkansas there is exactly one facility that performs abortions? For all practical purposes it won’t change much for the vast majority of Americans. I read 1 in 4 women have an abortion in their lifetime but in typical MSM nonsense I suspect those stats are large,y driven by individuals with high round counts. Not exactly 1 in 4.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:

But no, zealots can't not meddle.

All over a bunch of kids none of you even give any real fucks about, and you know it. It's all posturing, ideology, and meddling.

Bullshit, in the simplest sense.

Shameful, devisive, bullshit.

Let's focus on our commonalities instead.

Commonalities? Sadly, I doubt I have anything in common with you or your thinking.

I have "given fucks" about countless babies who would have been otherwise aborted.

My parents started a maternity home back in 1985. While they are both passed, it is still in practice today and has grown over the years. It offers an alternative solution to abortion and takes in women in crisis mostly. The women are given a home setting that includes classes about daily life, all the necessary medical attention, continuing education, and much more. They stay for free up to and after the birth of their baby.

The mothers either keep their babies or the home sets up adoption services. If they keep the baby, the home helps them with continued services and helps set up places to live.

While visiting my parents, I lived in this home...I helped in every aspect of this home... I held newborns that would have otherwise been thrown in the garbage. I took the mothers to appointments, talked with them, guided them, and stay in touch with many. I have seen the kids grown up, graduate high-school, graduate college, get married, etc etc.

Ya know what? Every mother who passed through and stayed in touch never said they wish they have gotten the abortion...NOT ONE. I wonder why?

Nuture, love, help, support...all work.

So don't fucking tell me I don't give any real fucks...or posture...or meddle.

YOU are the zealot! And your blathering is the only bullsit in this thread.