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| Member |
fritz, do you have your steel hung from a single point or two? How long are the straps? Hope to see you at a steel match soon. The Trigger Time (T3) match in Weldona and Sporting Rifle Match in Raton are my favorites, glad to have you shoot with me. I believe the T3 match is the tougher of the two, smaller targets, positional stuff, mover, wind... jlemmy, congrats on putting together a 223. Several guys I shoot with have SPS Tactical 223 for cheaper trainers. Consider the Berger 73 BT. | |||
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| Steel banging beer snob  |
Thanks for the tip on the bullet. I have been pondering what it may like with the 1/9 twist. Happiness is having to climb in your car to change your target. | |||
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Member |
jlemmy, other good bullets for "reaching out" in that new .223 SPS Tac are the Sierra 69gr Match King, as well as the 75gr Hornady BTHP. Good luck find either of these, though  (I'm still waiting for a backorder of 1200 Hornady 75gr BTHP from 12 months ago. Can find them in the 100 pack every once in a while, but getting the 600 pack is next to impossible.) | |||
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| Steel banging beer snob |
My current inventory in .22 cal is about 400 of the 69gr. Sierra Match King and 400 of the Berger 77gr. OTM. I'm concerned the 77's may be a tad heavy. I'm going to whip up a batch of 69's for the maiden outing. Then I'll start experimenting with others. Thanks for the tips ! Happiness is having to climb in your car to change your target. | |||
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| The Constable |
Fritz, Take a look at the brackets JC sells that use five pieces of 1/2" rebar for legs and the center piece to hang steel. I've been using a few of the brackets and have only knocked one over once and that was from a pair of well timed hits as a piece of steel was swinging. Easy to throw a few plates on belting, and the rebar in the back of the SUV and away you go. FN in MT   | |||
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| Member |
The JC Steel conveyor belts are 3.50" to 3.75" wide, and 30" long. Both the 12" square and the 8" square plate have two holes, the 5" circle has one hole. I have a picture of the 12" square plate on page 16 of this thread, after I hung it on the saw horse. I look forward to a steel match. I've backed off my sporting clays tourneys a bit this year.
I'm seriously considering JC's rebar stand, although in 3/4" bar. In addition to the 470 yard target berm, I'm looking at developing a 700 yard target location. For this I saw a few 16" to 20" gongs on the web -- I figure I need some burly bar for a gong that heavy. I like JC's bracket for the T-post. I cut an old bent t-post in half and sunk the halves in the face of a small runoff dam berm. I figure it's a pretty permanent location, so I will just leave the posts in the ground. Furthermore, the cattle roaming the land never wander on the face of that berm. | |||
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| The Constable |
Fritz, Another thought for belting would be to use the belts that convey hay to the baler assy on a round baler. They change them out occasionally and the tractor dealerships usually throw them out. I picked up two belts and they are like 20+ feet long and 16" wide. Easy to cut with a sharp razor knife too. Don't hold up as well as the JC belts , as they are thicker and more HD....but free and easily tailored to any length or width. | |||
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| Member |
fritz, I prefer hanging target from a single point. The matches around here do the same. A left or right hit will clearly spin the steel giving you somewhat of a wind call. I've made several stands in the last few years. This is about as simple as it gets. T-post, 4-5' 1/2 or 5/8 rebar with a slight bend, 2" hose clamps. Put a few of these stands at the Chaffee County DOW public range, idea was to make them as cheap as possible in case some Richard Noggin snagged them. Still there after 4 yrs. Have one at 285yds, it's been hit by my 7SAUM and a few 300WM's, holds up well, the long strap absorbs lots of the energy. Fellow SF member Alpine and I have had several pieces of 1/2 AR500 cut at Dencol in Denver, for a large plate they might be as cheap as anyone w/o shipping. http://www.dencol.com/   | |||
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| Member |
FN in MT, you put one through the 2nd hole yet on the large plate? "man I had to have gone right through that hole, no way I missed!" | |||
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| The Constable |
LOL. Those plates are like 25+ yrs old...used for pistol for many years. AR500 though, so finally took a few of the pistol plates down and using them for rifle now. I DO go through that 1/2" hole quite a bit....especially when it's WINDY. FN in MT | |||
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| Member |
offgrid -- Two of my three plates are two holers. For now I'll go with the fixed attachments to T-posts, but I do like the concept of seeing the plate spin a bit. I like your t-post and rebar hanger -- it may just be the ticket for a bigger piece of steel. I will contact Dencol for options. One observation from the weekend was contrasting hits on steel at 470 yards with the different .308 rounds. No difference in splash among the 168 and 175 grain bullets. However the 155's were different -- Corbon and Southwest load the Scenars pretty hot and the audible "thwacks" were more noticeable. I also noticed the difference in timing from trigger break to impact. According to JBM, the heavier bullets impacted in about .60 to .63 seconds and the lighter Scenars in .55 seconds. Not a huge difference, but enough to detect visually. | |||
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| Member |
Here's my first go at 700 yards at the ranch, using a 17" Shoot & See target. It was late in the day, crosswinds from 3-4 o'clock were increasing & variable, and the target backstop isn't as high as I'd like. I guestimated the rifle needed 17.25 to 17.50 MOA elevation, and went with 17.0 to minimize a high miss error. The top 4 holes (11:00 to 12:30 o'clock, 8 and 9 rings) were at 17.0 MOA. Hmmm, shouldn't be that high. Thinking my zero might have gone south, I ran the elevation turret down to zero stop (all good), then back up to 16.75 MOA, to see if a slight change occurs. Yep, two shots at 1-2 o'clock in the 8 and 9 rings, slightly lower on the target. So down to 16.25 MOA, 5 shots just above center line, from 8 ring on the very left to 8 ring on the very right. I don't understand why JBM would be that far off, but I've never shot at this high of DA, either. It is possible that my laser measurement was off -- I must confirm for next time. Factory FGMM 175 .308 doesn't have the best reputation for consistency, but that's what this target was shot with. Maybe I got a good box of ammo.  The first four shots show only 1-5/8" of vertical variation. The last five shots show only 1-1/2" of vertical variation. Of course those last 5 shots had 16" of lateral dispersion, but thats my inability to judge shifting winds while holding 2-3 MOA off the right edge of the target.  This is where a big gong or plate might help my learning the wind.  | |||
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| Member |
Hey, that's not bad shooting for someone not using the SCAR-17. | |||
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| Member |
Thanks. I couldn't afford a SCAR-17, so I looked into a SCAR-16. The SCAR-16 was still a bit pricey, so I checked on the FN-15. The FN-15 can't be ordered with a Hello Kitty stock from the factory, so it was out. I finally settled on a Mini-14. I'm still learning to shoot it from the hip. | |||
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| Member |
Yeah, the Hello Kitty stock is so last decade. You should have specified the Dora The Explorer stock; much more up to date. With the Mini-14, what I found some decades back was that if you sprayed a lot of rounds downrange you were almost sure to get a hit or something close to it on a smallish barn door at 100 yards. I also discovered that if I fired it from inside the barn on the second floor, I was guaranteed to hit the barn. Not too many barn shooting competitions though so I gave that up, sold the Mini-14 and got a real rifle. I won't tell you which one but the initials are AR. | |||
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| Member |
Dude, that's awesome! I've heard that Alpha Romeo makes a great rifle. | |||
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| Steel banging beer snob |
Got the .223 trainer picked up and assembled  Happiness is having to climb in your car to change your target. | |||
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| Member |
They do? What caliber? Maybe a 3 liter magnum? Or is that a jeroboam? I can never remember. Talk about taking a rifle for a spin, or gunning the engine. | |||
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| Member |
fritz, were you able to spot your impacts on the above target? | |||
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| Member |
I saw most of the first six through my scope -- the ones on the top part of the shoot-n-c. My scope was definitely on target by the time the bullets impacted, but 700 yards is a long way for my eyes to see a .308 hole with my 22x rifle scope. I was able to spot all holes afterwards with my 40x spotting scope, and I was able to make mental notes on prior impacts. I saw only one or two of the final five shots. The combination of lateral dispersion (not really knowing what the wind was doing) and tall prairie grass in front of the target made spotting holes as they occurred a challenge. The backstop was a pile of old wooden fence posts, so I had no visual cues from puffs of dirt. | |||
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