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Bad dog! |
I'm trying to picture The Donald in those Rick Perry spectacles with the Trump hair. Now there's a comedy skit in itself right there. ______________________________________________________ "You get much farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone." | |||
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Member |
Ronald Reagan was not the establishment's candidate in 1980, either. My old roommate worked in the Reagan Administration, and as soon as Reagan wasn't President, the Republican establishment got busy cleaning house and getting rid of all the Reagan appointees, like my room mate. In the event Trump gets nominated and elected as a Republican, he may be able to make some temporary changes to the GOP, but it won't be long lasting unless a long-term and widespread purge occurs that is greater than Trump himself. Read about Stalin and his repeated pogroms and purges over 20 years. That is how he got rid of all the Trotskyites, Leninists, and Mensheviks. This space intentionally left blank. | |||
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Member |
Pod People. I haven't heard that in awhile.  No I just feel that there will be a shift in that direction by Trump. Trump is a first class business man and and has made mistakes along the way getting there. This may be one of them on his way to being a politician.There won't be a total transformation but I'm guessing part of the deal was to tone it down. Again, we shall see. "Fixed fortifications are monuments to mans stupidity" - George S. Patton | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process  |
Who is "the establishment" everyone keeps trashing? Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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| Oh stewardess, I speak jive.  |
given that a third Bush is not only running but has been considered a shoe in, when no one else seems to want any part of that, and another Clinton if she doesn't skewer herself, it's clear that the establishment on both sides is as resilient as the cockroaches they resemble. sadly. one can only hope Trump is not the end all be all, but merely the beginning of meaningful change. where words like hope and change can be spoken without ridicule, and the establishment is but a part of our history. I dare to entertain such dreams. | |||
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| More Human Than Human  |
He signed it because it doesn't matter. In the end he either has the votes of Republicans or he doesn't. What he has is the ability to say whatever he damn well pleases and the RNC can't do shit about it. That's his "leverage" and always has been. __________________________ They keep saying they just want "sensible gun laws" but they hold up countries where they are banned and confiscated as their ideal. Antis thinks guns are only good for killing people. I think guns are good for self defense. So I'm the one with the "problem"? The Bill of Rights affirms the Rights of the Individual Not the State. Anyone tells me different is a liar. “The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”― Christopher Hitchens | |||
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| Oh stewardess, I speak jive. |
are you being rhetorical, or intentionally obtuse? | |||
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Get Off My Lawn |
"Those who want to preserve the status quo because they directly benefit from it and don't challenge the political-media industrial complex" – Tony Lee, Breitbart "I’m not going to read Time Magazine, I’m not going to read Newsweek, I’m not going to read any of these magazines; I mean, because they have too much to lose by printing the truth"- Bob Dylan, 1965 | |||
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| Bad dog! |
A great thought. Because Trump is only half of the picture. The other half is-- us. Americans are fed up with the professional politicians. We were ready-- begging -- for a Trump. ______________________________________________________ "You get much farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone." | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process |
I suppose once you challenge the political media industrial complex and win, then you want to preserve that and become the establishment. Everybody wants to become the establishment. It seems to me that the eventual nominee will be the one who demonstrated, in primaries and caucuses that (s)he has the broadest support from those who identify with the party. It is a very complicated process, control of the convention, the drafting of the platform, etc. I'm suspicious of the claim that Reagan and his minions wasn't "the establishment" during his administration. Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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| Member |
Link "Fixed fortifications are monuments to mans stupidity" - George S. Patton | |||
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| Bad dog! |
"The establishment" is a somewhat dated term. I think that right now "the elites" better describes the situation, or even "the Washington cartel." And to me it means a separation from the American people, "leaders" who no longer represent the wishes and the interests of those they are supposed to represent. They live in a privileged world, quite unlike the world of working Americans, and they themselves are untouched by what they unleash on ordinary people. The invasion over the southern border is a good example. Obamacare is another. The list is long. RINOs, the MSM, lobbyists, Wall Street-- a multifaceted corruption that is destroying America. Jeb is its poster boy. Trump represents opposition to all that. ______________________________________________________ "You get much farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone." | |||
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Info Guru |
Here is an article with a great explanation of how the establishment works. I tried explaining this when Corker introduced this bill, but did not go into the detail that this article does. The establishment wanted the Iran deal - one point Dr. Hamada doesn't mention is that it gives the establishment republicans a chance to go home and rail against what a bad deal Obama's Iran deal is, but they could have stopped it by simply doing nothing, and that's not an exaggeration. http://omarhamada.com/2015/08/...ed-obamas-iran-deal/ Tennessee’s Sen. Corker Saved Obama’s Iran Deal NASHVILLE, August 27, 2015– As a Major in the United States Army Special Forces, I learned a thing or two about strategy. One of the strongest tactics you can use on the battlefield is to confuse your enemy. Unfortunately, Senator Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) seems to view Tennessee conservatives as the enemy. I have to give it to him. For someone that has never stepped foot on the battlefield to serve his country, Corker sure knows how to confuse his enemies. One may ask why someone that has never worn the uniform of America’s armed services is the Chairman of the US Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Perhaps it’s because Corker is nothing more than a brilliant politician– they also know how to confuse their enemies. Corker has used every weapon in his arsenal to mislead Tennesseans on the details of President Obama’s Iran nuclear deal. Whether you support the deal or not isn’t my focus. My intent is to expose how a Washington politician has been fast at work deceiving Tennesseans for months. The truth is, Obama needed Corker to save his Iran deal and Corker delivered. It should be noted that Corker and Obama have a very close relationship. They have teed off on the golf course and enjoyed dinner together on more than one occasion. They aren’t exactly enemies. In fact, many in Washington would even say they are quite close. Therefore, when Corker introduced legislation earlier this year to “give Congress a vote” on the Iran deal, eyebrows should have been raised. Initially, Obama said he would reject the bill, but quickly flipped and said he supported Corker’s bill. As Obama has said, he has a pen and a phone. He has no qualms when it comes to sidestepping Congress. So, why would Obama support a bill by Corker that supposedly gives Congress the power to kill his negotiations with Iran? Again- the stated purpose of the bill was to stop Obama’s Iran deal, but Obama couldn’t wait to sign it. Odd- Is it not? The plain and simple truth is that Congress had a vote before Corker’s bill and Obama never actually rejected Corker’s bill. In fact, Obama wanted and needed Corker’s bill, and his brief “rejection” was nothing more than political theater to help Corker trick Tennesseeans into believing the bill was bad for Obama’s agenda. Now the bill is law. Here’s what really happened. Obama’s Iran nuclear deal was considered a treaty. Plain and simple. No way around this fact existed. Of course, that was until Corker’s bill. It’s important to note that all treaties require 67 votes from the Senate for approval. The Senate is currently composed of 44 Democrats, 54 Republicans and 2 Independents. In order for Obama’s Iran Nuclear treaty to pass, he would need every single Democrat, both Independents, and at least 21 Republicans to vote in favor of it. As of today, every single Republican and 2 Democrats stand against the deal. That’s 56 no votes and 44 in favor. So, the deal is dead– right? Wrong. Corker’s bill legally allowed Obama’s Iran deal to be presented as normal legislation instead of a treaty. Even worse, Corker’s bill allows for Obama’s nuclear deal to activate unless Congress disapproves the deal. This means Congress must pass a Resolution of Disapproval to kill the deal. Democrats have enough members to prevent a Resolution of Disapproval from ever even being voted on because 60 votes are required to force a vote on legislation. Because Republicans only have 54 votes (maybe 56 if the two Democrats opposing the bill stand with them) they do not have enough votes to force a vote on the Resolution of Disapproval. Without the resolution, the deal is set in stone. Even if Republicans can get 4 more Democrats to flip, Obama now has the power to veto the Resolution of Disapproval. To override the veto, 13 Senate Democrats and 43 House Democrats have to stand with Republicans against Obama. It won’t happen. Obama knew this going in, and that’s why he couldn’t wait to sign Corker’s bill. Some, including Corker, have argued that Obama wasn’t going to present the deal as a treaty, but as an “Executive Agreement”. That argument is all part of their marketing scam. The Obama administration cannot arbitrarily not call a treaty a treaty. Even if they had tried to, the Court would strike it down. In fact, the Court has already ruled on this subject. In its 2008 Medellin decision, the justices held that the president cannot usurp the constitutional authority of other government components under the guise of his power to conduct foreign affairs. Moreover, even a properly ratified treaty can be converted into domestic law only by congressional lawmaking, not by unilateral presidential action. Plain and simple, the President does not have the authority to impose an international agreement via fiat. This is a narrative that Obama and Corker have put out to make it seem like Corker’s bill was “the only hope”. Now, with Corker’s bill, there will be no Court challenge and no way to stop it through Congress. Corker’s bill added absolutely no protection. It simply stripped the Court’s and Congress’ protection. Corker now has the audacity to visit Tennessee and tell his constituents that the Republicans won’t be able to stop the Iran deal, but he tried so hard. He should be ashamed of purposefully misleading his constituents when he knows it was his actions that guaranteed Obama’s and Iran’s success. A chance exists that Corker didn’t mean to pave the road for Obama’s Iran deal. Perhaps he did it on accident. I’m not sure what’s worse. Corker saving Obama and blatantly lying to Tennesseans about what he did, or the off chance that the Chairman of one of the Senate’s most powerful committees didn’t know what he was doing when he gave Obama exactly what he wanted. Regardless, Corker’s actions have put American lives at risk. Tennesseans are not receiving the representation they need and deserve.  “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process |
As I understand it, the President can make international agreements as he choses, but could not lift the sanctions which is the only part that required congressional approval. The agreements are not treaties, and can be abridged at will. Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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| Banned |
"It seems to me that the eventual nominee will be the one who demonstrated, in primaries and caucuses that (s)he has the broadest support from those who identify with the party. It is a very complicated process, control of the convention, the drafting of the platform, etc." I think you know better than that. The nominee is often (almost always) the person supported by big business, big money sponsors, chosen thru an overly complex nominating process, weighted for the benefit of those sponsors (cronies). | |||
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| Get Off My Lawn |
Excellent link Bama. "I’m not going to read Time Magazine, I’m not going to read Newsweek, I’m not going to read any of these magazines; I mean, because they have too much to lose by printing the truth"- Bob Dylan, 1965 | |||
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Lost Allman Brother |
Precisely. Chris Cillizza at the Washington Post wrote two articles today astutely explaining why this is a win for Trump (excerpted): Donald Trump just won. Again.
Remember that Donald Trump’s loyalty pledge means almost nothing
_________________________ Their system of ethics, which regards treachery and violence as virtues rather than vices, has produced a code of honour so strange and inconsistent, that it is incomprehensible to a logical mind. -Winston Churchill, writing of the Pashtun | |||
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| Info Guru |
If Corker had done nothing, the sanctions would have remained in place unless a bill was introduced and passed to lift those sanctions -it could not be done via executive order. With control of both houses of Congress, no such bill could have been advanced, let alone voted on and the sanctions would have remained in place. The GOP could have literally done nothing and this deal would have gone down the tubes - there is no agreement without the lifting of sanctions. Obama had to have this bill or there would be no deal with Iran. “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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| Member |
Of course, and the word establishment is only a pejorative to those within the party that are on the outs.
According to my roommate, when administrations change, but the same party is in charge, many of the lower-level appointees and minions are retained, or offered other jobs in the new administration. This is how career bureaucrats can exist. Cabinet positions often change, though Robert Gates managed to survive a change of both administrations and parties. In the case of Reagan, even though he was still very popular at the end of his term, when Bush took office, there was an almost complete elimination of any remnant of Reagan people. A rather perplexing occurrence, given Reagan's popularity and one would have thought the GOP would want to capitalize on Reagan's formula and retain those the implemented it. But, again, according to my roommate, they did not. This space intentionally left blank. | |||
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| Bad dog! |
I just watched the first 2 minutes of The Kelly File, which opened flogging Jeb, who is "fighting back" against Trump! I turned it off when Krauthammer gushed, "It sounds like he really had his Wheaties this morning!" Hahahaha! Pathetic. ______________________________________________________ "You get much farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone." | |||
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