I watched both a few hours ago. The first half-minute or so had no audio but then it worked fine.

the youtube videos work ok for me. Video and Audio

Doctors can also have opinions, and they're not always right.

I wanted very much to hear what the ED docs had to say.
However, they completely misinterpret the issue of the prevalence of disease. They extrapolate from the percent tested who are positive—remember they were tested mostly because they had flu-like illness—to the entire population of the state.
So they claim that 12.5% of the CA population, and 20% of the NY state population are positive.
This is such a fundamental misinterpretation of the data that it clouds whatever else they have to say.

quote:

They extrapolate from the percent tested who are positive—remember they were tested mostly because they had flu-like illness—to the entire population of the state.

I thought they were basing this on more widespread anti-body testing?

quote:

Originally posted by BigSwede:

quote:

Originally posted by sdy:
I watched both videos. Definitely worthwhile. thanks BigSwede

I didn't realize that while anyone stays in isolation, their immune system gradually deteriorates. Did I miss something ?

I believe what he is saying is, if you aren't exposed to these viruses and germs by isolation, your body is not building an immunity to them. Therefore, you are weakening your immune system

^^^^THIS IS CORRECT^^^^^

quote:

Originally posted by TVzombie:

quote:

Originally posted by BigSwede:

Link to original video: https://youtu.be/xfLVxx_lBLU

Link to original video: https://youtu.be/zb6j7o1pLBw

You tube is seriously crapping on this video. The doctors are being muted and the audio only comes up when the reporter ask a question. Then it gets cut when the doctor responds.

-TVz

I agree that it's distracting, but I think that's how the audio was set up in the room to avoid feedback if the doctors and questioners ended up talking over each other.

Here’s the funny thing. Dr Fauci and Birx we accept as the worldwide experts or something close. Why? In my experience the private sector has way more experts and the actual top minds. The military being a possible exception because there is no equivalent private military sector.

We are preached at by govt experts who probably are wildly outclassed by their private sector counterparts and whose jobs aren’t dependent on preaching the govt line.

And yet to this day we don't know exactly what is or is not supposed to be true about the disease. Even if it's not a hoax, it's a brand-new disease - which means that no "expert" is necessarily any more knowledgeable than any other expert and, since the "experts" are in many ways doing no more than taking educated guesses, there may not actually be any experts at all!

This bears repeating. Especially the last line

quote:

Originally posted by sjtill:
I wanted very much to hear what the ED docs had to say.
However, they completely misinterpret the issue of the prevalence of disease. They extrapolate from the percent tested who are positive—remember they were tested mostly because they had flu-like illness—to the entire population of the state.
So they claim that 12.5% of the CA population, and 20% of the NY state population are positive.
This is such a fundamental misinterpretation of the data that it clouds whatever else they have to say.

quote:

Originally posted by Il Cattivo:
And yet to this day we don't know exactly what is or is not supposed to be true about the disease. Even if it's not a hoax, it's a brand-new disease - which means that no "expert" is necessarily any more knowledgeable than any other expert and, since the "experts" are in many ways doing no more than taking educated guesses, there may not actually be any experts at all!

And these are the people that we’ve been listening to with regards to shutting everything down.

Here's my takeaway, which coincides with my opinion formed prior to seeing their video.

We were sold a scenario that was bad. So bad that it was worth taking the extraordinary measures to address it.

Now we have actual numbers, and it doesn't matter how you extrapolate them. What we were told is not what happened. Great! Based on the actual numbers, we need to make new decisions that reflect our current condition.

The accuracy of their particular version of the numbers is completely irrelevant, because their point remains the same. The numbers to justify our initial response aren't there any way you figure it.

Not knowing we had to do something But we're not modifying our approach to reflect the new information that's coming out. Below the interesting parts are- They tested pickers because people at the packing plant had it. 1/2 the pickers had it But showed no symptoms.

quote:

Half of workers test positive for COVID-19 at Wenatchee-area orchard

"Dozens of workers at a Central Washington orchard have tested positive for COVID-19 but were apparently not showing signs of the illness."

"The company says of the 71 agricultural workers who were tested, 36 were positive for COVID-19."

https://komonews.com/news/loca...natchee-area-orchard


Combined with the lack of information or conflicting information makes this more ridiculous everyday.

quote:

1/2 the pickers had it But showed no symptoms.

My father in law has twice tested negative, and twice tested positive. Completely asymptomatic, but his immune system is also completely shot. They're trying to figure out if they have issues with the tests, or if his body never developed antibodies to it in the first place.

I've seen other reports of mass testing where 50-60% of the positive are asymptomatic.

I bet there's a lot of people out there that have had it with no idea they were carriers.

Maybe they are testing for the wrong corona virus, one we all have. Or maybe we have already had this corona virus. OR MAYBE THIS IS A SCAM...

For what it’s worth, here’s my take.

From pretty much the beginning of health statistics the two leading killers in the United States are heart disease and Cancer.

Heart disease kills between 13,000-16,000 a week

Cancer kills between 11000-14000 a week

Two weeks ago Covid 19 killed basically 15,000 people. It may have been the leading killer in the United States that week

If we “extrapolate” like the two doctors like to do...if the death rate maintains its rate over 52 weeks it would kill more people than cancer becoming the number 2 killer of people in this country....that old joke, killed more people than cancer? If you use their extrapolation technique than this bug does that this year

(I’m not saying that’s going to happen...I’m just using the “actual data”, the same they have, and their extremely flawed mathematics to get there)


They keep talking about the really bad flu season or 2017-2018. They say it could have killed up to 60,000 over the 52 week period

According to a Johns Hopkins, Covid-10 has killed 52,000 in roughly 7 weeks.

There are roughly 30-35,000 deaths from car accidents. In 52 weeks

This killed 52,000 in 7 weeks.


Seem what I am doing here? I’m taking the exact same data and presenting it in a very different way. For some of them I used their flawed math.

Beyond their flawed mathematics, their insistence that this is the flu was what killed it for me. If you keep spouting “look the flu killed 55,000 people in 2017-2-18...this has killed 51,000...see the flu!” And neglecting to mention that “this has killed 51,000...in pretty much less than a grading period “ then it’s very hard to take you seriously


I liked what a1abdj said: we did what we thought was right based on the data. Now we have new data and we need to change what we are doing based on what we know now


Was this as bad as the initial projections and models?


No, absolutely not. Thankfully.

Is it as minimal as these guys are trying to make out to be? As just a more serious version of the flu?

absolutely not. In fact if you used their flawed extrapolation and simply multiply the number of people killed over the last 2 weeks times 26 it has a chance to challenge cancer and heart disease as the reigning champions


Is it, as it usually is, somewhere in the middle?

Yep. We absolutely need to take what we know and responsibly open, employ, educate, etc....because we absolutely can

Like many here, I've been reading for hundreds of pages. We've agreed to disagree on some interpretations, we've seen the experts disagree. About masks, gloves, how long it lives, or what test or treatment even works. I believe more than anything else we've seen the early worst case scenarios turn and continuously march towards the early best case of a new and nasty flu. Not da'bola, not Andromeda, not zombies.

Been said before - It's not IF we get exposed it's when. Lets get careful with our most vulnerable. The rest of us - get back to living!!

Now that we've bent the curve and see how widespread it's likely become, I see no sense in tracing in heavily affected areas. Stop talking this shit as a condition of opening back up. It's a money grab. (Brand new unaffected areas, eh, OK, but it doesn't matter.)

I'm in strong disagreement in the stay at home orders being slowly lifted - contingent on <50 new cases in the county (PA rules for stage 1) You test enough people you'll find the cases to keep us locked up.

Lastly, Feds need to STOP SPENDING!! We simply cannot equal the damage done without waste or inequity.

My .02

This NYC nurse practitioner has much to say and it has the ring of truth.

https://theconservativetreehou...rk-city/#more-190115

quote:

Originally posted by Kevbo:
For what it’s worth, here’s my take.

....

Is it, as it usually is, somewhere in the middle?

Yep. We absolutely need to take what we know and responsibly open, employ, educate, etc....because we absolutely can

Pretty much my take on this as well. Problem is we don't have all the data needed to make good decision and they are being made on the fly. I sure as hell don't buy the current 60,000 deaths estimate, but I don't think the earlier 2,000,000+ estimates are right either.

I am no doctor or policy expert so I can't say what the best course of action may be, but I can say I wouldn't want to be in the room with those forced to make those decisions, no matter what they are wrong. They are working with incomplete date, and possibly flawed data and expected to be right. Especially with PDJT at the helm, no matter what he does, it will be viewed as killing people or the economy.

Personally, I am going to continue to treat is as an unknown threat, and take all reasonable cautions I can until better data comes in. I do fear we may have wrecked the economy for very little return on lives saved due the the silent nature of it in so many people. The time to lock down may have been before we recognized it was going to be bad.

I am left thinking right now there is nothing we can do, the old; people in poor health; and the unlucky are just going to die. If it happens all at once or spread out over the next year, it will still be the same amount of deaths. The only difference is that under one avenue we wreck the economy in the process, under the other we have a lot of deaths at once and we look like we sacrificed the old/frail/unlucky for our pocket books. It's a catch 22. The logical choice is to not wreck the economy, while at the same time locking down places in danger of having hospital system overrun. On a personal level I am going to do whatever I can to avoid getting this bug.

On a policy level it looks like it might be best to just let it run it's course, but how is PJDT supposed to say that on TV when people are seeing granny and paw paw dying?

Kevbo, I think you are conflating testing positive for COVID 19 and it killing you. Just as they said, thousands of people died that were positive with FLU, but the flu isn't what killed them, their lifestyle and genetics did them in. I would wager that if every single person that dies was tested for the flu it would explain what they were hinting at in the video, that it's nothing more than a padding of numbers. I get that people are scared but the lack of reasoning I am seeing is disturbing and ultimately self defeating. My 91 year old grandmother was diagnosed with hypertension 2 years ago. Recently, she has developed an issue where she retains fluid and has falling/fainting spells but flat out refuses to get treatment because she's afraid of catching the Wu Flu if she goes to the ER. How many thousands of people are doing the same? Enough to shut down entire wings of hospitals because there aren't enough patients coming in to get treatment.

To reiterate the Doc's points in the video, let me put it another way....ALL GUN DEATHS are harped on by the leftist gun controllers right? But we know that most of those deaths are suicides and therefore shouldn't be looked at when calculating data that impacts everyone's civil liberties. It's all agenda driven and putting a hash mark in 1 column is easy to do when there are no repercussions for being wrong.