quote:

Originally posted by Jimbo Jones:
And take these all with a grain of salt/assumption that the number of cases reported is in line with the actual number of cases.

That's the thing for me- I cannot trust the numbers being given us.

quote:

Originally posted by SIG228:
Arresting a guy for paddle boarding while turning real criminals loose. This shit is getting old in hurry.

I'd argue he wasn't arrested for paddle boarding. He was arrested for ignoring a police order. Had he complied with the lifeguard, or with the police when they arrived, it may have been different. He decided to stay out in the water for over 30 mins, forcing the police to send a boat to retrieve him.

The details shape the story a bit more ..

quote:

Originally posted by zipriderson:

The details shape the story a bit more ..

Not really.

quote:

Originally posted by zipriderson:

The details shape the story a bit more ..

No, the details don't shape the story, the Idiocracy does.

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:

quote:

Originally posted by frayedends:
Are reported cases taking over a week for CDC to show in their data or am I missing something? The CDC data link shows 213K as of today (cumulative, so that includes people that have recovered). But the bell curve near the bottom of the page shows number of reported cases drastically dropping. It does note that not all cases would have been reported. But are they that far behind or is the curve lowering?

https://www.cdc.gov/coronaviru...YkOjevOMRI8WuKYnZsuE

Testing is taking upwards of a week from the time the specimen is collected, to the time the lab is able to process it and report the results. There are only 25 laboratories (aside from Government ones) that are capable of doing the testing, since it has to be done by molecular testing. A good friend of mine and customer of over 10 years owns one of them that is doing the testing for 7 states, they can only do 1500 tests per day.

Very fortunately, we're getting to the point now that that isn't the case anymore.

As has been posted about in this thread before, Abbott has developed a COVID-19 test for their in-office "instant" (really 5-15 minutes) testing platform (the sort of thing doctor's offices use to run while-you-wait flu and strep tests).

Right now they're expecting to manufacture ~50,000 of the test kits per day and ramping up from there.

https://www.abbott.com/corpnew...le-as-5-minutes.html

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:
...There are only 25 laboratories (aside from Government ones) that are capable of doing the testing, since it has to be done by molecular testing. A good friend of mine and customer of over 10 years owns one of them that is doing the testing for 7 states, they can only do 1500 tests per day.

There are 65 labs that have processed 50 or more test just for the state of Florida and another 275 or so that have processed between 1 and 50 tests, but who is counting?

quote:

Originally posted by SIG228:
Arresting a guy for paddle boarding while turning real criminals loose. This shit is getting old in hurry.

Well it's probably safer because the paddle boarder probably doesn't have the virus.

A town nearby had to have a block party a few weeks ago to get everyone out of their house. 200+ people (who assumedly don't work for NASA) showed up and was there all day.

One farther down the highway couldn't miss out and had a block party last weekend so almost everyone (who can't spell CDC) came.

Today they issued a shelter in place lockdown for the state. You can't fix stupid. Not even with duct tape.

^^^ What state is that?

Georgia.

Aside from the college stupidents leaving, there are many that don't have an IQ above room temperature (Celsius) to be found. I just don't know why it is so hard to grasp such a concept for so many.

Turns out several had the novel coronavirus at the first one, and some went to both.

Doctors, Doctored Numbers, and Democracy

Many of our so-called health experts are acting less like good doctors and more like bad politicians.

Angelo Codevilla • April 2, 2020

The New York Times on Tuesday reported: “The numbers the health officials showed President Trump were overwhelming. With the peak of the coronavirus pandemic still weeks away, he was told, hundreds of thousands of Americans could face death if the country reopened too soon.”

These numbers, many millions of infections, hundreds of thousands of deaths, were ones that “health officials” had been spreading through a sensation-hungry media for some time. Together with a poll question that framed the choice just so, they had already helped produce another set of numbers: “Voters overwhelmingly preferred to keep containment measures in place over sending people back to work prematurely.”

This, the Times crowed victoriously, had stampeded President Trump to abandon his goal of restoring normal life by Easter.

Trouble is, though, these numbers come from just some doctors—they reflect neither reality nor broad medical opinion. They are synthetic products that hide the (often ignorant) assumptions that they reflect, substitute for reason, foster panic, and ruin the country.

The following shows how “soft” and hence divorced from reality these numbers are, what it would take to produce “hard” numbers—i.e. ones reflective of reality—and the manner consistent with self-government in which such matters should be debated and decided.

All admit that the numbers that are scaring the sense out of the country are mathematical projections. All projections are based on assumptions about the ever-changing numbers of “confirmed cases” of COVID-19, as well as of deaths resulting therefrom. But few—and here it seems we must include many “health officials”—consider that the latter numbers are themselves “soft” and tell us next to nothing about how much, how little, or what kind of dangers the virus poses to us.

Certainly, they give no guidance about what restrictions any of us should apply to ourselves, never mind what the government should do to the country.

How’s that? Because the number of “confirmed cases”—meaning cases that have come to the attention of the medical profession—tells us nothing about the number of people infected. Nor does that number tell us what happens to the gamut of those infected. Nor is the number of deaths “hard,” because it does not distinguish between those who die of the virus and those who die merely with it (that is, they might have died even without it).

To make intelligent decisions about countermeasures, we would need have hard data about all these matters. Yet, for two months, doctors such as Anthony Fauci have messed up millions of lives and commandeered trillions of dollars while scaring the hell out of people and watching curves based on projections based on meaningless numbers. Watching the several curves resulting from the testing that is now ongoing and that is projected to continue as the country suffers will provide only more guesses, that will feed more models and more disputes.

The most important fact about COVID-19, its true mortality rate, is the number who die of the virus divided by the number infected by it. No algorithms. Simple arithmetic.

In short, Fauci, et al., are showing themselves to be typical of our bureaucracy: over-credentialed, entrusted with too much power, and dangerously incompetent.

Learning the true figures about precisely what danger the virus poses to whom must begin by taking into account one thing we know for sure about COVID-19: that many, if not most, of those infected by this unusually contagious virus show few or no symptoms. This suggests eventual near-universal contagion.

But we don’t know how many of these asymptomatic people there are. Hence, meaningful epidemiological testing must include a random representative sample of the population, regardless of whether they are presumed to be infected or not. The numbers resulting from monitoring what happens to the health of individuals in this sample over a few weeks would tell exactly what percentage of people in each category and subcategory suffer what consequences from whatever contact with the virus they happen to have.

As it happens, a sizable chunk of such data is about to come into existence. The virus is rampant among the 5,000 or so personnel aboard the aircraft carrier USS Theodore Roosevelt. Everyone aboard is being tested. By the time that is done, as the ship sits off Guam, and it returns to the United States, we will have a good idea about the rate of infection and some factual notion of what happens to those infected—at least among the sailors’ demographic group.

The question of lethality is not resolved by mere counting of individuals who test positive and die. We have some data showing that COVID-19-positive people who suffer from certain diseases are likelier to succumb than others who suffer from other diseases or who are otherwise healthy.

Sorting out causes of death is properly a medical judgment. The doctors who are scaring the hell out of the country in general might better spend their time using their medical skills to sort out the virus’s specific consequences—and recommending what currently available drugs may keep the sick from dying.

President Trump, as well as the governors of some states, have been stampeded out of their common sense into shutting down the country until further notice. The bureaucratic-media complex has done this on the supposed basis of medical authority. But the doctors have not been speaking as doctors on the basis of knowledge of the human body while offering cures or even palliatives. No. Their judgments are based on speculation about the meaning of mathematical models.

They are not acting like good doctors but rather like bad politicians.

Fauci showed how thoroughly he and his cohorts have subordinated common sense to bureaucratic authority. Having strenuously campaigned to deny the usefulness of hydroxychloroquine, having been confronted by the fact that physicians on the front lines of the battle against the virus are using it themselves, and having been asked whether he—were he to come down with illness from the virus—would use it, he weakly conceded that he would but only as part of an approved study. He cared less about describing what the drug can do and can not do than about affirming his agency’s and the FDA’s prerogatives.

Backed by the media, Fauci and company have contended that actions by anybody, ordinary citizens, elected officials, or physicians that do not follow proper bureaucratic procedures are illegitimate. Who the hell do they think they are? We belong to ourselves. Not to them.

Decisions affecting each and all of us rightly belong to ourselves directly and indirectly through elected representatives. Congress and the legislatures should be making decisions on the basis of open debate and recorded roll call votes.

Surely, President Trump’s low point came when he supported bypassing roll call votes in the passage of a $2.2 trillion bill as part of his and other executive officials’ decisions to shut down the country. Making decisions on the basis of meaningless curves and bureaucratic authority rather than through open debate about hard facts followed by roll call votes is not just undemocratic. It’s stupid.

https://amgreatness.com/2020/0...mbers-and-democracy/

data from NY

100,000 confirmed cases in a little over 3 weeks

Death rate rising to 2.9%

quote:

Originally posted by zipriderson:
I'd argue he wasn't arrested for paddle boarding. He was arrested for ignoring a police order.

So, explain to me why the police gave him an order? Wasn't because he was sitting in his house. The way some people suspend all reason is starting to help me understand how the left is taking over so easily. The herd mentality is so ingrained in our society now that it doesn't take much to get an entire group of people to contradict their own beliefs even if they are generally conservative.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

quote:

Originally posted by Jimbo Jones:
And take these all with a grain of salt/assumption that the number of cases reported is in line with the actual number of cases.

That's the thing for me- I cannot trust the numbers being given us.

This this and this!

Politicians are making monumental decisions with questionable data.

I keep hearing the mortality rate go from 2% to 5% given the source. We have no idea what the mortality rate is. It is likely that hundreds of thousands of people have or have had COVID-19 and don't even realize it. These people will never get tested. These people will never go to a doctor. They aren't incorporated into the models. There isn't enough reliable testing, period.

Many of these models are incorporating Chinese data (not trustworthy) or Italian data (unreliable at best.)

This is the crux of my argument, and the argument of many others. I supported flattening the curve - telework, closing schools for a few weeks or even a month, etc. But 2-3 months of isolation and a total shutdown of society is an extreme measure with no reliable supporting data.

They should have left the Paddleboarder alone, period. All else is what caused the problem. Getting a boat involved to screw with one person out there hurting nothing, hurting no one, infecting no one, is abject stupidity in plain sight. Just move along and leave the dude alone. It is not that important. It's not.

So dumb.

Anyway. Moving on.

Candace Owens just reported that the infant death in Hartford was not in fact caused by the virus. Apparently there was some kind of tragic accident and the baby died from injuries related to that. The governor used the positive Covid test for political reasons. It apparently had nothing to do with being positive for the virus. She is going to post her video that was live, in a few minutes. I don’t know where she got this information. She has many posts suggesting that the death rates are not true because every death of a positive Covid person is attributed to the virus no matter what actually caused their death.

I can’t say one way or another if her facts are true. Just reporting what I’m seeing.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:
They should have left the Paddleboarder alone, period. All else is what caused the problem. Getting a boat involved to screw with one person out there hurting nothing, hurting no one, infecting no one, is abject stupidity in plain sight. Just move along and leave the dude alone. It is not that important. It's not.

So dumb.

Anyway. Moving on.

Totally agree. What a waste of time, resources, and all they got out of it was fucking up one guys life who was just out minding his own business.
Jackbooted thugs.

quote:

Backed by the media, Fauci and company have contended that actions by anybody, ordinary citizens, elected officials, or physicians that do not follow proper bureaucratic procedures are illegitimate. Who the hell do they think they are? We belong to ourselves. Not to them.

I think they belong to big pharma.
Why use existing and proven drugs when we can spend billions investing in research using our money.

Rule number 1: follow the money. Right?

NY Cuomo is taking all ventilators around the state not being used for NYC. They'll be returned when not needed or the hospital / entity compensated for it.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:
They should have left the Paddleboarder alone, period. All else is what caused the problem. Getting a boat involved to screw with one person out there hurting nothing, hurting no one, infecting no one, is abject stupidity in plain sight. Just move along and leave the dude alone. It is not that important. It's not.

So dumb.

I agree. I've already expressed my displeasure that the Florida Fish and Wildlife Commission has claimed the authority to designate entire state a boating restricted area and COVID 19 a hazard to navigation. The Sheriff's and FWC boat are out in full force. I've never seen this many of them in such a short period of time.

We are setting some pretty dangerous precedents during this 'crisis'.