SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge When will the coronavirus arrive in the US? (Disease: COVID-19; Virus: SARS-CoV-2)
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Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie |
Well, on that note, let's not leave out the contemptible douchebag Geraldo Rivera who also recently caught the Chinese virus in the last few days. Here's what he's been saying about the unvaccinated:  ~Alan Acta Non Verba NRA Life Member (Patron) God, Family, Guns, Country Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan | |||
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Frangas non Flectes |
From Washington state: https://justthenews.com/nation...legislative-traction
Meanwhile, Washington State Board of Health is going to be meeting next week. The agenda? This bit of legislation: https://apps.leg.wa.gov/WAC/de...spx?cite=246-100-040 Of note:
Of course, this is causing a bit of a stir, to which they've stated:
https://www.khq.com/news/misin...7e-cfb334712298.html Well, shit. That's not what that reads like to me. ______________________________________________ Carthago delenda est | |||
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| Member |
That's what I don't get about the people that think the unvaccinated are evil. He got Covid despite being vaccinated and just on numbers alone he probably got it from someone that is also vaccinated. It's not like everyone thought in the beginning that if you get vaccinated it dies with you. No you can get it and transmit it weather or not you are vaccinated. | |||
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Member |
Yep. Have we finally reached maximum trajectory when it comes to mental retardation over this issue? The stupid just never seems to stop or slow down. ----------------------------- Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter | |||
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| Peace through superior firepower  |
What's the most dangerous thing in the world? | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money  |
The Legal and Moral Morass of Mandatory Vaccination The COVID vaccines are experimental drugs. Even if the FDA were still functioning as intended and serving a productive role in protecting the public from dangerous products, these drugs are not approved. It is true that the FDA, after putting aside its normal procedures intended to better ensure safety, has approved a version of the vaccines known as COMIRNATY. But as all public health authorities admit, COMIRNATY is not available anywhere. The drug companies cannot accept any liability for the damages their products are causing, because they know full well they would be bankrupted. A fully approved drug would not have the complete liability protection that a drug under Emergency Use Authorization has. That there is an approved version means that under the law, the EUA must be pulled. This is just another law not being followed due to this "emergency." Without the protection of the EUA, there would be no liability protection for the manufacturers. The upshot is that there are no available fully approved COVID vaccines. That attempting to force me to take experimental drugs against my will is a violation of local, state, and federal law, everything from the state and local Human Rights Codes, to the federal ADA, and a blatant violation of my constitutional civil rights, should give you pause in attempting to deny me my assertion of this religious objection. Retaliating, or discriminating against me in any way, making it impossible or just difficult for me to do my job, is blatantly illegal, not to mention morally wrong. Furthermore, the bedrock of modern medicine is informed consent as an ethical principle, and I believe in ethics. I am now informed about the COVID vaccines. I do not consent. The right to refuse medical treatment was established in the internationally recognized medical code of ethics established in the Nuremberg Code of 1947. As a response to crimes against humanity of precisely this kind perpetrated by the Nazis, the Code established that every person must "be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior forms of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision." Even if these drugs truly functioned as a therapeutic for COVID, it is a legal and moral fact that our society has never compelled treatment. Well, unless you consider and support the infamous Buck v. Bell case where the Supreme Court sanctioned forced sterilization. Or if you view the Tuskegee experiment and the like as good things. But with those notable ignoble exceptions, we have had the right to turn down "care." This is evident in the healthcare directives people painstakingly create to make sure their intentions for treatment are honored even in extreme conditions -- in our right to refuse treatment in an emergency room. And in the millions of prescriptions that go unfilled each year. Why are these COVID vaccines any different? I don't understand why I am being compelled to discuss my personal, private medical situation with my employer. It is in fact a violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act, the ADA, for one thing, but here we are. The ADA prohibits employers from making invasive inquiries about an employee's medical status, including questions about diseases and treatments for those diseases. The only exception is if the information is both job-related and necessary. There is no evidence that vaccination status has any positive impact on preventing the spread of respiratory disease in the workplace. COVID is not any more of a threat than is the flu. It is not necessary. The best and only reasonable mitigant is requiring workers to stay home if they are symptomatic or feel ill. Treating an employee differently based on the employer's belief that the employee's medical condition (like being unvaccinated) is an impairment is discrimination based on a perceived medical disability. The employer must have proof that it cannot keep the employee, even with reasonable accommodations, before any adverse action can be taken. If an employer asserts that to be the case, they must prove with scientific evidence (not press releases from the CDC) that the employee poses material harm that no reasonable accommodation could mitigate. No court has yet found the scientific evidence in favor of discrimination to be compelling. One day, we will have courts and government officials that will protect our constitutional rights again. That will pursue justice and compensation for the evils being done during this extraordinary period. In the America I've known to this point, one did not need to explain one's deep religious convictions to one's employer for their review and sign-off. At some point, when the fever passes, people and organizations will be held to account. In prior cases concerning HIV and AIDS, when employers discriminated against employees based on their perceived dangerousness, the employers ended up paying millions in legal fees, damages, and fines. Finally, and to put it all together, I object on the moral grounds that my personal bodily autonomy is sacrosanct and cannot be violated by my employer. To accept the idea that my employer can determine what I am to put into my body is to accept the idea that my employer can tell me what to do with my body, which in practical terms means that my employer owns my body while I am employed. I refuse to accept that premise. I refuse to accept the yoke of slavery. In America, it is astonishing that I would have to assert that in this day and age, generations removed from the Civil War. These are my sincerely held beliefs. I do not submit to taking these drugs. https://www.americanthinker.co...ory_vaccination.html "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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| Ammoholic |
Government? | |||
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Nullus Anxietas |
Stupidity. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | |||
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| Peace through superior firepower |
The most dangerous thing in the world is a man with nothing to lose. | |||
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| Member |
The whole " I got all my shots but still got Covid. That made it less serious" is absolute fail. Analogy: You go to your Doctor to get Viagra. He prescribes you a pill that gives you a chubby but it only lasts 1 minute. Your problem is now "less serious"! End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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Happily Retired |
A "chubby" I haven't heard that in decades.  .....never marry a woman who is mean to your waitress. | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money |
Biden’s Vaccine Mandate Is Outrageously Unconstitutional. Why Couldn’t Lawyers Make That Argument To The Supreme Court? Truly, was it too much to ask for a defense of limited government, separation of powers, and federalism? Margot Cleveland All the petitioners needed was for the Supreme Court to enter a stay to prevent the Occupational Safety and Health Administration vaccination rule from taking effect, but, truly, was it too much to ask for a defense of limited government, separation of powers, and federalism? Apparently so, because on Friday, over more than two hours of argument in National Federation of Independent Business v. Department of Labor, lawyers pushing the Supreme Court to delay the regulation circled and sidled rather than state clearly that the rule, OSHA, the Biden administration, and the entire federal government represented a mockery of our constitutional order. On November 5, 2021, OSHA issued the rule under review, framing it as an “Emergency Temporary Standard” or ETS. The ETS required all employers of 100 or more employees to “develop, implement, and enforce a mandatory COVID-19 vaccination policy,” which required employees to either be fully vaccinated or submit to weekly COVID-19 testing and to wear face coverings at work. Congress authorized OSHA to issue “an emergency temporary standard to take immediate effect,” and without the traditional notice-and-comment process, if it “determines (A) that employees are exposed to grave danger from exposure to substances or agents determined to be toxic or physically harmful or from new hazards, and (B) that such emergency standard is necessary to protect employees from such danger.” Massive Overreach Immediately Challenged in Court The ETS was immediately challenged by individual Americans, religious groups, covered employers, states, and trade organizations, with the cases filed directly in federal courts of appeals throughout the country, bypassing the federal trial courts pursuant to the statute that authorized emergency rules. The Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals acted first, issuing a stay on November 6, 2021, preventing enforcement of the rule pending briefing. Less than a week later, a three-judge panel of the Fifth Circuit—consisting of Ronald Reagan appointee Judge Edith Jones and two Donald Trump appointees, Judges Kyle Duncan and Kurt Engelhardt—issued an opinion holding that the ETS remain stayed “pending adequate judicial review” of the lawsuit challenging the OSHA rule. The 21-page opinion, authored by Judge Engelhardt, analyzed the request for a stay and concluded that, for numerous reasons, the petitioners had a strong likelihood to succeed on the merits of their challenge and that without a stay the businesses and other petitioners would suffer irreparable injury. Shortly after the Fifth Circuit issued its decision, pursuant to the procedures controlling when multiple lawsuits are filed challenging an ETS, all of the cases throughout the various federal circuits were consolidated and assigned by lottery to the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals. Then, on December 17, 2021, the Sixth Circuit vacated the stay entered by the Fifth Circuit. Sixth Circuit Deadlocks Judge Jane Stranch, a Barack Obama appointee, authored the decision for the three-judge panel of the Sixth Circuit, which Judge Julia Gibbons, a G.W. Bush appointee, joined. Trump-appointee Judge Joan Larsen dissented from the decision, concisely capturing her concern with this opening line: “As the Supreme Court has very recently reminded us, ‘our system does not permit agencies to act unlawfully even in pursuit of desirable ends.’” Two days before the Sixth Circuit removed the stay, thereby setting the ETS to go into effect this month, the federal appellate court denied a request by the challengers of the OSHA rule for the court to hear the case initially en banc, or as a full court. To obtain en banc review, a majority of the active judges on the Sixth Circuit needed to vote for the full court to decide the case together, but the 16-member court deadlocked 8-8, leaving the three-judge panel in charge. In voting to hear the request for a stay of the ETS en banc in the Sixth Circuit, Judge John Bush, a Trump appointee, opened with the closer: “Whether it uses a clear statement or not, Congress likely has no authority under the Commerce Clause to impose, much less to delegate the imposition of, a de facto national vaccine mandate upon the American public. Such claimed authority runs contrary to the text and structure of the Constitution and historical practice. The regulation of health and safety through compulsory vaccination is a traditional prerogative of the states—not the domain of Congress and certainly not fodder for the diktat of a federal administrative agency.” Sidelining the Constitution With all of the ammunition provided by the dissenting judges in the Sixth Circuit, as well as the Fifth Circuit’s original opinion entering the stay, one would think that when the Supreme Court fast-tracked the case for oral argument, the attorneys seeking the stay would stress the grave attack the ETS represents to our constitutional republic. But they didn’t. Instead, Scott Keller, counsel for the National Federation of Independent Business, argued “OSHA’s economy-wide one-size-fits-all mandate covering 84 million Americans is not a necessary, indispensable use of OSHA’s extraordinary emergency power which this Court has recognized is narrowly circumscribed.” Likewise, Benjamin Flowers, the solicitor general of Ohio, arguing on behalf of the slew of states that joined in challenging the ETS, stressed “so sweeping a rule [as the vaccine mandate] is not necessary to protect employees from a grave danger as the emergency provision requires.” Throughout the argument, Keller and Flowers also focused on the so-called “major questions” doctrine, which stems from a series of Supreme Court cases that stressed that if an agency’s regulatory action “brings about an enormous and transformative expansion in regulatory authority,” Congress must speak clearly that “it wishes to assign to an agency decisions [such issues] of vast ‘economic and political significance.” The petitioners weren’t wrong. The OSHA rule, which is, in essence, a vaccine mandate given the shortage of tests and the federal government’s decision to force employees to pay for the cost of testing, is not “necessary” to protect employees from a “grave danger” for many reasons. This Is Obviously Unconstitutional First, COVID is only a grave danger to a small segment of society, while the ETS adopts the de facto vaccine mandate for all employers of 100 or more employees. The ETS also makes no distinction between employers where working conditions create a higher risk of COVID infection from those facilities where employees have limited risk. Nor, after two years of COVID, with OSHA waiting that time period to issue the ETS and the latest mutation less severe than the former ones, does the ETS fit within the concept of an “emergency” standard. Also, far from providing the OSHA clear authority to mandate vaccinations (or a weekly medical test) in response to a virus such as COVID, the statute authorizing OSHA to issue an ETS speaks of grave dangers “from exposure to substances or agents determined to be toxic or physically harmful or from new hazards.” Thus, the major question doctrine supports the petitioners’ challenge to the ETS and their request for a stay. Yes, advocates must be pragmatists, and the petitioners’ attorneys didn’t need a home run; they just needed a rain delay. But so much more could have been said, and indeed needed to be said—and forcefully so—about limited powers, federalism, and separation of powers. Yet in their desire to win the stay, there was barely any mention of these important constitutional principles. Major Opportunity Lost Consider this notable exchange between Ohio’s top attorney and Justice Sotomayor. JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR: “So, if it’s within the police power to protect the health and welfare of workers, you seem to be saying the states can do it, but you’re saying the federal government can’t even though it’s facing the same crisis in interstate commerce that states are facing within their own borders. I — I’m not sure I understand the distinction why the states would have the power but the federal government wouldn’t.” MR. FLOWERS: “The federal government has no police power, if we’re asking about that.” JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR: “Oh, it does have power with respect to protecting the health and safety of workers. We have — we have — accept the constitutionality of OSHA.” MR. FLOWERS: “Yes. I took you to be asking if they had a police power to protect public health. They — they absolutely have the –” JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR: “No, they have a police power to protect workers.” MR. FLOWERS: “I would not call it a police power. I think the Commerce Clause power allows them to address health.” “I would not call it a police power” is as much as the Ohio solicitor general could muster for a pushback. But Congress has no “police power” no matter what it is called, and the federal government cannot “pretextually relabel” a federal de facto vaccination mandate “commerce” to gain what is, in effect, a novel police power of the national government. The breadth of the OSHA rule and its effects on two-thirds of private businesses also threatens the “system of government ordered by the Constitution,” that gave all legislative powers to Congress. The resulting “nondelegation doctrine constrains Congress’s ability to delegate its legislative authority to executive agencies.” Yet when provided an opportunity to hammer these points, Flowers served up the vanilla point “that although our non-delegation doctrine is not especially robust today, there are limits on the amount of authority that Congress can give away.” The justices—and Americans—needed to hear these points because COVID has become both the excuse and the case study for authoritarianism. And from OSHA’s most recent rule, we might divine the civil corollary to the “Show me the man, and I’ll show you the crime,” motto, and it seems to be, “Provide me a public interest, and I’ll find the power.” Or, elsewise said, “Cut me a mouse hole, and I’ll squeeze in an elephant.” https://thefederalist.com/2022...o-the-supreme-court/ "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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| Get my pies outta the oven!  |
 Covid wanted to date her... | |||
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| Frangas non Flectes |
Just heard from the guy who told me they decided not to have me join the band because I’m “unvaccinated.” Good-hearted man, but a bit misguided. He just couldn’t understand why someone would choose not to. Well, he has covid. Had what he thought was a cold that he got over about a week ago, then he started feeling shitty again. “Those tests suck.” I asked if he meant accuracy or the swab. Accuracy. I mentioned the CDC recently admitted they couldn’t tell the difference between flu and Covid, and the member here a few pages back with multiple false negative tests in a house with three adults who tested positive. He stopped replying. I’m fighting the schadenfreude like a boner in ninth grade Spanish class with Ms. Hotstuff… and having about the same degree of success. ______________________________________________ Carthago delenda est | |||
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Member |
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but I wouldn't put it past AOC, and the other whack job Dems to fake a positive covid test, and then make a big deal about how Desantis/FL covid policies are bad. Even IF they do actually have covid, there's going to be alot of drama. ------------------------------------------------ "It's hard to imagine a more stupid or dangerous way of making decisions, than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." Thomas Sowell | |||
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| Get my pies outta the oven! |
My sister was telling me over the weekend that friends of hers throw a big Christmas party every year where everyone dresses in PJ's and they do a lot of drinking and having a good time. The party host informed her she wasn't allowed to attend this year because she was unvaccinated (her husband is I believe). They both said "the hell with them then!". She found out that EVERY PERSON who went to that party ended up with a nice case of Covid...  The biggest casualty of this goddam pandemic is going to be friendships  | |||
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| Nullus Anxietas |
Except that's not what the CDC said. Poor wording on their part, but what they were saying was they wanted a new test that could detect both from one swab, rather than people having to be swabbed, separately, for each.
Were they rapid tests? Those are known to produce a relatively high rate of false negatives. That's why the urgent care clinic to which my wife and I went for tests swabbed us for both rapid and PCR tests on the same visit. As for the unvaccinated Nazis: Screw 'em. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | |||
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Member |
This is interesting... oh, the irony: https://thecovidworld.com/vacc...as-infertility-risk/ What a corner into which to be painted. | |||
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| Thank you Very little  |
No doubt they will try and spin it against FL and Desantis in some manner. Still no matter how she tries, the fact is she went to Florida to party, did it unmasked, which there is no law here that says you can't mask up, and who's to say she didn't have it and bring it here with her, catch it on the plane on the way down. There are so many people here from the great Covid States up north, it's no wonder FL numbers are up, increasing our number of population and probably bringing it with them as well. You can't toss a rock without hitting someone from the yankee hoards fleeing the north! | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money |
the Chinese want NOTHING to do with mRNA Covid vaccines. (Xi, I wonder why.) https://alexberenson.substack....ant-nothing/comments China has been treating with Ivermectin at pennies a dose. Covid is way down there now. As it also is in India, which specifically cited Pfizer's demand for no liability as the reason. ****** Never relent, never keep quiet, and always speak against the state and its false narratives. Never sit idle in the face of tyranny, and never allow apathy to invade your psyche. Do not quit writing, making podcasts and videos, and spreading all factual information so that others, even those with closed minds, have at least the opportunity to see the light. The truth is our salvation, so the more of us exposing the lies, the more of us with the courage to speak out, the more of us willing to disobey orders and mandates; the more chance that others may follow suit. “The masses have never thirsted after truth. Whoever can supply them with illusions is easily their master; whoever attempts to destroy their illusions is always their victim.” https://www.lewrockwell.com/20...th-will-set-us-free/ "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge When will the coronavirus arrive in the US? (Disease: COVID-19; Virus: SARS-CoV-2)
Main Page The Lounge When will the coronavirus arrive in the US? (Disease: COVID-19; Virus: SARS-CoV-2)© SIGforum 2024