quote:

Originally posted by Ripley:
From the sublime to the ridiculous. Who cares if this it true, it's out there now.

Good golly, Miss Molly

It just keeps getting better and better:



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...els-NYC-mansion.html

It’s clearly a photograph.

Autopsy finds broken bones in Epstein's neck, deepening questions around his death ...

Carol D. Leonnig and Aaron C. Davis, The Washington Post Published 10:26 pm CDT, Wednesday, August 14, 2019

An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.

Among the bones broken in Epstein's neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam's apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.

The details are the first findings to emerge from the autopsy of Epstein, a convicted sex offender and multimillionaire in federal custody on charges of sex trafficking. He died early Saturday morning after guards found him hanging in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan and he could not be revived.

Attorney General William Barr, whose department oversees the Bureau of Prisons facility where Epstein died, has described his death as an "apparent suicide." Justice officials declined to comment on the new information from Epstein's autopsy.

The office of New York City's chief medical examiner, Barbara Sampson, completed an autopsy of Epstein's body Sunday. But Sampson listed the cause of his death as pending.

Sampson's office did not comment on the injuries found in the autopsy.

The details add to the bizarre circumstances surrounding Epstein's death, which have launched a wave of questions and conspiracy theories about how he could have died in federal custody. Even President Donald Trump has egged on speculation, without evidence, that Epstein - whose alleged victims say they were pushed to have sex with his powerful and celebrity friends - might have been killed to keep him from spilling the secrets of others.

The revelation of Epstein's neck injuries follows reports that officers at the Metropolitan Correctional Center broke protocol and failed to properly monitor him.

Corrections officers had not checked on Epstein for "several" hours before he was found hanging in his cell, a person familiar with the matter said, one of a series of missteps in the hours leading up to his death.

Veteran prosecutors and law enforcement officials were shocked that one of the most high-profile inmates in the country wasn't more carefully watched. Barr said over the weekend he was "appalled" at serious "irregularities" in jail protocol, and later transferred the jail warden to another facility.

People familiar with the autopsy, who spoke on the condition of anonymity due to the sensitive stage of the investigation, said Sampson's office is seeking additional information on Epstein's condition in the hours before his death. That could include video evidence of the jail hallways, which may establish whether anyone entered Epstein's cell during the night he died; results of a toxicology screening to determine if there was any unusual substance in his body; and interviews with guards and inmates who were near his cell.

Jonathan Arden, president of the National Association of Medical Examiners, said a hyoid can be broken in many circumstances, but is more commonly associated with homicidal strangulation than suicidal hanging.

Arden, who was not involved in the Epstein autopsy, said that in general, a finding of a broken hyoid requires pathologists to conduct more extensive investigation. That investigation can include analysis of the location of the noose, how narrow the noose is, and if the body experienced any substantial drop in the course of the hanging.

The age of the deceased is also important, Arden said. The hyoid starts out as three small bones with joint-like connections but hardens during middle age into a U-shape that can break more easily.

"If, hypothetically, the hyoid bone is broken, that would generally raise questions about strangulation, but it is not definitive and does not exclude suicidal hanging," he said.

A handful of studies conducted over the past decade have produced conflicting results about the likelihood of a hyoid break in a suicide. In a study of 20 suicidal hangings in Thailand, published in 2010, one-fourth of the men who hanged themselves had broken hyoids. In a larger study of suicidal hangings of young-adults and middle-aged people in India, conducted from 2010 to 2013, hyoid damage was found in just 16 of 264 cases, or six percent. The study addressed the discrepancies in academic reviews, saying wide variations in findings of hyoid breaks are "possibly due to factors like age of the victim, weight of the victim, type of suspension and height of suspension."

Hyoid fractures have previously sparked controversy in jailhouse and other contentious deaths.

In 2008, Ronnie White, a teenager accused of killing a police officer, died of an apparent suicide in a suburban Washington jail cell. But two days later, the cause of death was changed to homicide when a Maryland state medical examiner discovered the teen had a broken hyoid.

The incident fanned racial tension and fueled conspiracy theories about the suspect's death in Prince George's County, Maryland.

Medical examiners concluded White was probably strangled with a sheet, towel or "crux of the elbow." The officer who moved his body pleaded guilty to obstruction. But no one was ever charged in White's death. A federal judge said in 2013 that it remained a mystery whether the inmate was slain or took his own life.

The hyoid bone played a central role in a heated dispute last year over another high-profile death in New York, that of Eric Garner. A New York police officer was accused of using an improper chokehold while trying to arrest Garner and of causing his death. A police officers' association claimed that an autopsy from Sampson's office found there was no break of Garner's hyoid bone, and that this proved that the officer could not have strangled Garner and caused his death.

This "demonstrates conclusively that Mr. Garner did not die of strangulation of the neck from a chokehold," the Patrolmen's Benevolent Association said.

But Sampson rejected that claim, saying she stood by her conclusion that Garner died of "compression of neck (chokehold), compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police." Sampson's office said Garner's bronchial asthma, obesity and high blood pressure were contributing factors.

In a widely circulated video of the 2014 incident, the officer was seen grabbing Garner around the neck, pushing him and his face into the pavement. Garner is overheard pleading several times: "I can't breathe."

Two weeks later, Sampson's office concluded the officer's actions were the primary cause of his death.

- - -

The Washington Post's Julie Tate contributed to this report.

- - -

You don't have to read it in the Washington Post. Here is an alternate link ... https://www.lmtonline.com/news...-s-neck-14305473.php

The cellmate previous to Epstein’s last one was Ex-cop, Nicholas Tartaglione, who has been charged with murdering four men in a cocaine conspiracy.

That seemed like a bad idea, putting an ex-cop charged with murder in the same cell with a pedophile.

Who was the cellmate which was removed just prior to Epstein’s death?
I haven’t seen much mentioned about the last pairing.

Rumor is that painting was made from a photo taken at a Halloween party, when Clinton came as J. Edgar Hoover.

You should see the one with ole joe biden added to the painting sniffing bills hair.

quote:

Originally posted by Hobbs:
An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings,

Hobbs, I gotta tell ya, man- you're so persistent on this, you're so convinced that he was murdered, I almost hope that the slimy SOB was murdered. I'm rootin' for ya, Hobbs. Let's just ignore the parts of that article which say that these injuries can be sustained in a suicide, and hope for the best, huh?

We need the grassy knoll, Umbrella Man, and those too-well-dressed "hobos" to complete the picture, though. Might take a while. Either way, conspiracy theorists must be elated this morning, to actually have something factual upon which to hang their beliefs, which is something of a new experience for them, no doubt.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Hobbs, I gotta tell ya, man- you're so persistent on this, you're so convinced that he was murdered, I almost hope that the slimy SOB was murdered. I'm rootin' for ya, Hobbs. Let's just ignore the parts of that article which say that these injuries can be sustained in a suicide, and hope for the best, huh?

We need the grassy knoll, Umbrella Man, and those too-well-dressed "hobos" to complete the picture, though. Might take a while. Either way, conspiracy theorists must be elated this morning, to actually have something factual upon which to hang their beliefs, which is something of a new experience for them, no doubt.

Just the facts. Why you think I'm persistent in and so convinced that he was murdered is beyond me. I've said all alone. Keep an open mind to possibilities until the reports are out. Do you have an open mind? Besides, if I hadn't posted the article, someone else soon would have. Don't shoot the messenger.

quote:

Originally posted by Hobbs:
Just the facts. Why you think I'm persistent in and so convinced that he was murdered is beyond me. I've said all alone. Keep an open mind to possibilities until the reports are out. Do you have an open mind?

Analysis finds element of truth in the conspiracy surrounding Jeffrey Epstein's death, fueling speculation.

Washington TP Roll, William Watterson, Thursday on some date.

Experts studying the theories surrounding the mysterious death of billionaire pedophile Jeffery Epstein have found a single isolated fact in the theory that Epstein was murdered (EWM), in conflict with the government's assertion that he committed suicide. Historian Dr. Calvin explains, "Facts are occasionally found in crackpot conspiracy theories, but they are most commonly found in well-documented truthful accounting of events." Calvins associate, Dr. Hobbes, added, "Clearly the existence of this single, isolated corroborating fact bolsters the credibility of the EWM theory. What was once easily dismissed as gibberish must now be taken more seriously. Had the fact been discovered with a cluster of other corroborating facts, it would look suspicious and not be as meaningful. But, coming as a singular fact, it makes its existence even more stark and difficult to ignore." Furthering the EWM theory, Calvin offered this irrelevant, but seemingly evidentiary anecdote: "Remember, when Wegener first proposed plate tectonics, his theory was dismissed by mainstream scientists, only later to be accepted as real science. We can firmly expect the EWM theory to ultimately be proven correct, regardless of what ridiculous assertions the government's so-called investigators report."

artist identified!

My mind is not so open, that my brains are spilling out, which is the case with all the conspiracy theorists.

Yes, Hobbs, I believe that you believe the man was murdered. And I believe that you are looking for a way to prove that he was murdered. And I believe, also, that more than a few people would like to see ol' Para eat a large portion of humble pie, and that can be quite a motivator.

quote:

Originally posted by DrDan:
Analysis finds element of truth in the conspiracy surrounding Jeffrey Epstein's death, fueling speculation.

Washington TP Roll, William Watterson, Thursday on some date.

I was just about to ask you to post a link.

Not my intentions Para. Just trying to have an open minded discussion based on fact until the reports are out. That's it. I've always valued your opinion and most time you're spot on and I've supported you in many discussions over the last 11 years. I'm not after you to eat anything.

quote:

Historian Dr. Calvin explains, "Facts are occasionally found in crackpot conspiracy theories, but they are most commonly found in well-documented truthful accounting of events." Calvins associate, Dr. Hobbes, added, "Clearly the existence of this single, isolated corroborating fact bolsters the credibility of the EWM theory. What was once easily dismissed as gibberish must now be taken more seriously.

Calvin and Hobbes?

quote:

Originally posted by Hobbs:
Not my intentions Para. Just trying to have an open minded discussion based on fact until the reports are out. That's it. I've always valued your opinion and most time you're spot on and I've supported you in many discussions over the last 11 years. I'm not after you to eat anything.

Thank you. Look at it this way- we've gotten to know each other better in this thread.

Yes sir. It's a contentious thread as you pointed out. I applaud your efforts to keep it focused. Thank you.

I could be convinced that he was murdered.
So what? Is anyone surprised?

The guy spent a lifetime collecting dirt on people in positions of power and wealth - no real conspiracy at work here. Not to mention all the other shit he did.