Originally posted by Scooter123:

quote:

There is only one way to bring this pandemic to an true and lasting end. That is for a large enough portion of the population worldwide to become immune to this virus. Getting there can take two paths. One is the Natural path and not treat anyone for this virus. That will genetically weed out the "weak" as did the Black Death. The second is to develop a safe and effective Vaccine, which is estimated to be a year or 2 years out.

There's a third path which is developing treatments for those who get sick... which is already happening and far more likely than developing a vaccine.
There's no guarantee that an effective vaccine will ever be developed.

quote:

Originally posted by Scooter123:
I don't give a damn about some supposed Constitutional Rights here, this is truly about the Right To Live.

My rights don’t end where your selfishness begins.

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Originally posted by PowerSurge:

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Originally posted by Scooter123:
I don't give a damn about some supposed Constitutional Rights here, this is truly about the Right To Live.

My rights don’t end where your selfishness begins.

The logic is proven to some.

Scooter believes that he doesn't need to have a gun to keep him safe.

Scooter also believes you shouldn't have a gun....to keep him safe.

Sound familiar?

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:....

Scooter believes that he doesn't need to have a gun to keep him safe.

Scooter also believes you shouldn't have a gun....to keep him safe.

Sound familiar?

Not exact, but a couple of statements (roughly) seem to fit. Those who sacrifice liberty for security will lose both liberty and security. Also, a government that can give you everything you want can also take everything you have.

How many people support increasing gov't power, believing they will be served rather than harmed; and sadly learn the opposite is true.

I started reading Scooter’s post and chuckled as I thought it was satire. As I kept ready I was like, oh, I see.

It does give light to the OP though. At what point does the ability of states to police in the name of public health cross into tyranny.

Scooter seems to think so long as his personal life is at risk. Jones thinks any state action is tyrany. I’m in the middle.

I think we’re going to start discovering that a not insignificant portion of our society has already been exposed and were/are asymptomatic. As we learn more, I think the justification for such stay at home orders and the closing of private businesses will begin to erode. The push has already started, and I think rightly so.

Do I think this was all unnecessary? I don’t know. At first I thought it was. As I watched the situation in New York unfold, I’m not so sure it didn’t help. Northwest Ohio is very different from NYC, so maybe we would have never gotten to that point?

People made calls based on what information they had. Now what? Now we need to save the business and lives that we’re crushed in this. The same people who made the calls need to fix what was damaged. That’s the burden of leadership, now live up to your role.

Going forward, we need to damage as little as possible. We have learned a lot. Revisit your decisions in light of new information and make new decisions. Protecting your past decisions is stupid. Move forward and don’t worry about trying to prove yourself right. If our leaders can do this, I think we’ll be fine.

We’ll never know if this was all for nothing or not. But we can make sure that we save those who were crushed.

Most importantly, the question asked in this thread is a very important one. What can and can’t the state do? The taking of guns during Katrina was total bullshit to me And nothing was ever done about it. I’d love to take this opportunity to get some very good and clear case law on the books that clarify this line for the next emergency.

Just leaving it open for tyranny in the future would be a horrible idea. Now that we’ve given them closing businesses and taking guns in emergencies, they’ll try something more the next time. We need to get a ruling on this and make it clear for next time.

quote:

Originally posted by esdunbar:
Jones thinks any state action is tyrany.

No. I don't. Some state actions are necessary. Only tyrannical disregard to the Constitution is tyranny. Funny how it works.

It's the same tactics as the gun grabbers use. I guess we shouldn't be really surprised by it bleeding over into other Constitutional over reaches. An Executive order does not top the Constitution no matter how much we try to pretend that it does under the 10th. I wonder when the next democrat is in the White House, how many 'Rona appologists will cave if a President (or a governor for that matter) bans guns by unConstitutional executive fiat. They turn up their palms and go "Shit boys, he's got us. The Constitution isn't absolute". And then further they'll make fun of those pointing out the over reach as people rat on their neighbors with guns "for the public good".

If that makes me hard line, I'll take it. We have seen how quickly society will cave to totalitarian rule if presented in the right fashion. People like Scooter aren't just a few.....

Right now, the health department is working double shifts going neighborhood to neighborhood and reporting people to the police if they have more than 5 cars in the drive way as potential violators. Yeah, I'm sure some will be along to defend this "If it saves one life....."

Scooter, it's easy
STAY INSIDE.

I understand that some people have health problems and are at a higher risk when it comes to "Da Rona" (as they are calling it on the street). Stay inside, stay away from people. You can do that.

While you're inside, read that Constitution. Toss in a good American history book too. Hopefully you'll realize the WHY behind some of those Amendments.

I understand that the economy is messed up, and people are out of jobs, and to get this country back on track, there's going to be a lot of sacrifices and heavy lifting in the near future. Does that mean we get to have people work for us? Maybe if we BUY a person or two to get shit done we can make them work harder, and not worry about paying them. After all, we bought them, they are OURS. Hell, you even get to whip them if they're not working hard enough. (At this point, you better pray that you're not in the 3/5ths of a person category)

How about when the National Guard takes over, you can stretch out on the floor in the garage because the Sgt (whose real job is a bartender at Applebee's) think's your bed is comfortable.

What happens when someone, let's say jljones and I don't like the cut of your jib? We're really not liking what you're saying, or putting on the Internet. We get to lock you up! I specially say jljones and I, because guess what- WE'RE THE GOVERNMENT!

Just because there's a crisis, DOES NOT mean the Government gets to whip out their dick and piss all over the Consitution!
If things get that bad, the Govmt needs to sign a piece of paper that makes their wishes "A Law". I think there's already a term for that... Martial law.

CPD SIG.

You make a lot of sense. Historically, many dictatorships start as a promise to help the people. But those given power only serve themselves.

Yeah, scooter's logic is the exact same as the gun control idiots.
"I'm scared and dont understand reality. I want someone to make me FEEL safe.".
Some of you guys need to look at what the fuck is going on. The time for your silly high road virtue signaling is over. Our bill of rights has been completely raped by many state governors and you're picking the fly shit outta the pepper on the minutia of their laws?
Wake the hell up.

Wow, someone needs a breath of fresh air, couple fingers of scotch, and a cigar.

One of my concerns is once the pandemic is over, will those who grabbed power restore rights, ie, relinquish their power. Or will they realize "tis good to be the King".

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Originally posted by Scoutmaster:
One of my concerns is once the pandemic is over, will those who grabbed power restore rights, ie, relinquish their power. Or will they realize "tis good to be the King".

What do you think?

Sadly, sometimes freedom is wasted on the free.

Back to the topic... yes, I'm perfectly willing to tell King Ralph and his fan club that they're overreaching (and full of bull). Frankly, I'd love to get an hour's sit-down with him.

Let's get after it.

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Originally posted by vthoky:
Back to the topic... yes, I'm perfectly willing to tell King Ralph and his fan club that they're overreaching (and full of bull). Frankly, I'd love to get an hour's sit-down with him.

Let's get after it.

I don't go to church/synagogue so I have been unaffected by his EOs. The only thing that has been a hindrance to me are store policies. Now there are a huge number of non-COVID things I'd talk to him about if I got a sit down with him.

Granted I do not go to bars or restaurants except for birthdays and such, but I wouldn't set foot in one now anyways. So other than my wife's Bday celebration, haven't missed a thing. Her Bday is 3/9, so it was my choice to not go out for it, not a government mandate.

How has his EO's made a change in your life?

Ralph's general political direction makes changes in our lives.

On top of that, I get a bit annoyed every time I see his smug face on the TV.

EO or no, Ralph's a jerk.

Pushing out the primary two weeks and attempting to discard already-cast ballots? Jerk move.
Attempting to push out the local elections to November? Jerk move.
Attempting to make it unlawful for us to disparage him, his party, and others like him? Jerk move.

Ralph's a jerk.

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Originally posted by Scoutmaster:
One of my concerns is once the pandemic is over, will those who grabbed power restore rights, ie, relinquish their power. Or will they realize "tis good to be the King".

This is probably the most important aspect all of us should be focused on and pondering right now. Huge overreach and unconstitutional behavior has been all but the norm for the past few weeks, and there will be no reckoning for that behavior when this is all over. So in the end, when the virus has passed, what will we really have lost along with jobs, businesses, livelihoods, and savings? I fear a whole lotta freedoms we will never get back. Those in charge almost nationwide have fully exploited the "Don't waste a crisis to get done that which you could not normally accomplish".

So who's actually going to do something real about all this tyrannical overreach and totalitarian rule instead of just bitching and bloviating about it on the Internet? What are you actually going to do? Give me realistic things.

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Originally posted by Chris17404:
So who's actually going to do something real about all this tyrannical overreach and totalitarian rule instead of just bitching and bloviating about it on the Internet? What are you actually going to do? Give me realistic things.

Well, for starters I and 10,000 other citizens are heading to the state capital and the governors mansion tomorrow to tell him to knock this shit the fuck off.

What are you doing?

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Originally posted by PowerSurge:

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Originally posted by Patriot:

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Originally posted by kramden:
It is now becoming obvious that the "models" of dire consequences from the virus are off......WAY OFF. And it is also obvious a number of governors are going to make this as painful as possible in the hope of hurting Trump. These shutdowns are going to cause more damage than any virus. Peoples lives and business' are being destroyed. If you're in the government your paycheck is still there and your pension isn't touched. It's time for We The People to take our lives back.

Dude, what’s the matter? Did you get to the end of Netflix and run out of beer & Fritos?

Obviously you think all of this is a joke.

Yup...

We the people take back our lives? Just what does that mean? Violence?

Ridiculous...