quote:

Because they depend so much on tourism, I was thinking maybe a Social Media campaign of some type

This is what we can do to help, I'm not savvy enough or have enough info to get to the target audience. I would do what I can to help


Good luck Dave

Here is my .02. The American Consulate or Embassy wont be able relieve Dave of his current predicament (get him released). No letter campaign to Congress or to the Ambassador in Nassau, assuming that is the AMEMB that handles T/C, is going to help Dave in the short term. Sounds harsh but any reliance on AMEMB is not going to be fruitful to get him released him from Jail IMHO. BTW, it appears there is no Ambassador assigned to the AMEMB in Bahamas and instead the mission is headed up by a capable career FSO, Chargé d’Affaires. The Embassy in the Bahamas can only provide very limited services to Dave.

The strategy should be to get the best local legal counsel ASAP for Dave to help mitigate his situation while in Jail. Another strategy is to have a friend or family member provide regular on site visits to support Dave and provide food, medicine etc to him, similar to what SBF was provided by his parents during his Bahamas incarceration.

Thank you for the replies and prayers. I am out on bail currently staying at a resort, for two more days, and then moving to a longer term location until the case is resolved. I have retained a lawyer who I was told, by multiple people, is the best on the island. My mistake entirely. Problem is I never use my travel backpack to go to the range, ever. I have separate bags for that very reason, chain of custody. I cannot remember ever throwing these rounds in this bag. I sat up every night of the 6 nights in jail trying to recall how this happened. You can bet I will never let this happen again. As to the random number 44, when I go to the range I take out JHP and replace with FMJ. I almost always take 4 guns, 10 in the mag (NYS limit) and one in the chamber. 4 guns, eleven bullets each. We are working hard to find a solution to this. I reached out to Para because I thought that by some slim chance someone on the forum would have experience with this or know someone but mainly as a cautionary tale. Know what you are carrying. I will try to keep you updated. Thank you for the kind thoughts and thanks Para for putting this up for me.

quote:

Originally posted by RogB:
Any info on the facility where he is being held?

Reading the original post from Para…My understanding is he spent a few days in jail but has been released but has no passport and can’t leave the country

quote:

Originally posted by 2PAK:
Here is my .02. The American Consulate or Embassy wont be able relieve Dave of his current predicament (get him released). No letter campaign to Congress or to the Ambassador in Nassau, assuming that is the AMEMB that handles T/C, is going to help Dave in the short term. Sounds harsh but any reliance on AMEMB is not going to be fruitful to get him released him from Jail IMHO. BTW, it appears there is no Ambassador assigned to the AMEMB in Bahamas and instead the mission is headed up by a capable career FSO, Chargé d’Affaires. The Embassy in the Bahamas can only provide very limited services to Dave.

The strategy should be to get the best local legal counsel ASAP for Dave to help mitigate his situation while in Jail. Another strategy is to have a friend or family member provide regular on site visits to support Dave and provide food, medicine etc to him, similar to what SBF was provided by his parents during his Bahamas incarceration.

Dang, 2Pak... Acronym much?



AMEMB (x3) = American Embassy
T/C = Turks and Caicos
IMHO = In My Humble Opinion
BTW = By The Way
FSO = Foreign Service Officer
ASAP = As Soon As Possible
SBF = Sam Bankman-Fried (of FTX/Alameda fame)

That's great news to be out on Bail and to be able to stay at the resort or other location. Congrats Dave! All the best for a positive conclusion.

Rogue, now is not the time.

Dave, please check your voicemail

44-rounds, yikes, thats more than a couple of magazines worth. Hope the prosecutors aren't hard up to make an example, foreign country politics are always dicey, the US tourism dollars are strong.

Long ago, I used to have a business bag I used for both range usage and actual work usage. A few times going through the airport I found a couple of spent brass inside a pocket or, in the bottom. While brass is nothing to get alarmed about, I made sure to have a dedicated bag just for range usage to avoid any future complications, not to mention I can keep all the tools and gear for shooting all-together, and not have the hassle constantly transfering gear.


late add...glad to see you're out on your own and have secured the services to a top lawyer.

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
I agree with the poster that indicated social media may be the trick. If we have any members that are versed in “the spin” this would be the time to employ it.

Just instinct talking, but I would think to only go negative once most/all 'positive' avenues have been explored and discarded.

There are many social media pages where people get ideas about where to take vacations. That would be a great place to spread the news of possible sudden capricious arrest and imprisonment. That not only can it happen, but has happened in T&C. I'm certain there are other examples of this kind of Mickey Mouse money grab in Turks and Caicos.

A sudden decrease in tourism? Ooh yeah, I can't imagine them being happy about anything like that.

If all civilized efforts fail, it's time to rain toads on 'em. Every possible means.

Wishing the best for Dave. In my prayers.

Obviously no criminal intent with Dave and I would hope that the T&C justice system would know that. I hope for the best for him.

quote:

Originally posted by old rugged cross:
I would think it be best to keep this under the radar so that it can be worked out by the fewest number of key cogs as possible. Rather than blowing it up in to some kind of an international incident. That is not going to help imho.

As a general observation, this. Judiciary systems don't like being told by other nations in public how to treat someone because he's one of theirs. Particularly if it's some vastly bigger nation; the locals might then feel the need to be extra tough to prove they won't be pushed into bending the rules for some damn foreigner.

To me it sounds like he has done the most important thing already by getting a well-recommended local attorney. He is obviously entitled to consular support. Where the help of Congressional representatives might come in handy is keeping embassy staff on their toes, but they will be better acquainted with local conditions.

Overall, the Turks and Caicos are of course a British Overseas Territory with a legal system rooted in that tradition. Can't say I have experience with that, but as I assume he has a clean record and a good reputation, believably representing to the court that it was an honest mistake should hopefully result in waiving the draconian mandatory prison terms they have introduced in response to escalating armed gang violence.

A quick search yields a 2019 precedent where a US citizen who ran his boat aground in their waters with 15 guns and 8,000 rounds of ammunition on board was let off with a fine. The last thing you want to do is making this a media circus à la Amanda Knox.

My plan would not be legal

Hire a Boat to the Bahamas, and if needed again to Miami, then to a waiting car. Never go to T&C again

Good to hear from you, Dave.

You gotta make it back soon; it's almost baseball season and you have to watch the Yankees kick some Red Sox ass!

Very sorry to hear about the troubles. One would think they’d rather have some $$ to smooth things over rather than another mouth to feed in jail.

Hopefully you can catch your breath at the resort the next few days.

quote:

Originally posted by MikeinNC:
My plan would not be legal

Hire a Boat to the Bahamas, and if needed again to Miami, then to a waiting car. Never go to T&C again

I would bet that crossed Dave’s mind once or twice; it certainly would mine if I were in his position.

That said…

They have his passport; it looks like the islands fall under Great Britain and their extradition treaty with the US.

Random thought-

Is there a way to appeal directly to Great Britain and get someone there to intervene?

My wife's first reaction was essentially bribery. She may not be that far off actually. I would think offering to pay a sizable "fine" should get most Americans out of what should be obvious to most was an innocent mistake.

It makes me angry that an honest man who made an honest mistake and who is willing to face up to accusations in a foreign land may face penalty when illegals in this country often disappear when on bail. I commend you for doing the right thing and fighting this legally rather than hopping on a boat bound for Florida.

I hope this all works out for you. I will pray if you don't mind.

Prayers for a good outcome.

Don’t want deeper trouble, but I kinda like the boat ride to FL idea.