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| Lawyers, Guns and Money  |
Flashlightboy: I disagree, vehemently, with your entire post. I'm tempted to argue with you over each point, but I don't really have the time. So I'll RSVP with my regrets to the "Flame away..." invitation. "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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| Peace through superior firepower  |
 You're brainwashed. Keep letting the Media Industrial Complex feed you that propaganda. Russia is not being "taken down". What's being taken down is the amount o funds in the US treasury. We have worthy causes all over this nation which are being neglected for the obscenity you support. Look at the people in Hawaii who lost everything and were given a few hundred dollars. You have no idea how much of a robot you sound like with this "we're taking down Russia" nonsense. The day you die, Russia will still exist as a nuclear superpower. | |||
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| Internet Guru |
Bizarre and unexplainable that there is still quite a bit of public support for funding the Ukraine calamity. Any application of logic to the situation indicates a negotiated settlement will be necessary. The only real question to be resolved is how many more people die and how much more treasure is squandered. It's truly sad to anyone looking at the conflict objectively and without emotion. | |||
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| Member |
Has it occurred to some of you that the whole point of this conflict from the start was to bait NATO and primarily the US into wreaking havoc on their own economies and military stockpiles. Russia has an endless pool of human meat, shovels, and anti-tank mines and it's willing to carry on for decades holding heavily-fortified positions of little value just so the collective West can bash their heads into them. For every trench the Ukrainians capture the Russians are digging 5 more in its place. Give Putin what he wants and be done with it. | |||
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| Staring back from the abyss  |
And when he wants Poland? Give him that too? How's about Hungary? ________________________________________________________ "Great danger lies in the notion that we can reason with evil." Doug Patton. | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money |
No one wants to "give Putin what he wants". No one has "given" him anything. But the fact is, he has already taken what he wants. Poland and Hungary are members of NATO and we have a treaty obligation. "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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| Member |
Operator Starsky is a YOUTUBE channel by a Ukrainian Soldier that posts 3 to 5 times a week. It's obviously from a pro-Ukranian point of view. However, I find it interesting. He provides a lot of information that is supported by cell phone videos, interviews and other data. I have heard him report Ukrainian setbacks on the battlefield which to me helps with his credibility. However he also shows many cell phone and other videos that make it very clear to me that the Russians are paying a very big price for their invasion. This latest edition covers a variety of issues, some which may surprise you. Worth a look if you are interested in what's going on in Ukraine. He often posts item that are really funny. This one has a clip where the Ukrainians call Russian tech support for help with a repair on a piece of Russian equipment. The Russians give them the information with no problem. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri694c6hNCM | |||
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Get Off My Lawn |
Zelensky is a gold digging whore.  "I’m not going to read Time Magazine, I’m not going to read Newsweek, I’m not going to read any of these magazines; I mean, because they have too much to lose by printing the truth"- Bob Dylan, 1965 | |||
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Irksome Whirling Dervish |
Taking Russia down isn't a literal phrase and you know it. Russia will be taken down as a world super power. It will still have nukes and a lot of land and resources but their nation will be a mess. Money and resources wins wars and they are running out of both. Their GDP is horrible and there's nothing on the horizon suggesting it's going to be better. They can sell resources but their capability to harvest and deliver them is finite. They can sell weapons systems but since they are being trashed in Ukraine, who would want to buy vulnerable equipment? They can't project power anywhere in the world except to a contiguous state. If your goal is let Russia expand into non-NATO countries then yes, stop supporting them but if you goal is damage them so they can't do it again and trash their economy so they can't afford to do it, then supporting Ukraine is something we should do. I suppose going turtle is a strategy but what does that accomplish? | |||
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| Member |
I am not sure I would say that Russia has endless supply of human meat, population is 143 million. Europe is 740 million | |||
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| Staring back from the abyss |
You're a pretty smart fella. I'm certain you got my point.  ________________________________________________________ "Great danger lies in the notion that we can reason with evil." Doug Patton. | |||
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| Banned |
So, what are we going to do about this little document the US signed back in 1994? Just admit that we took their nuclear arsenal and then simply threw them under the bus because 50 cents per day per US person for 18 months was too much pain?
https://policymemos.hks.harvar...emo.pdf?m=1645824948 | |||
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| Member |
Doesn't matter much to me. That's 50 cents I could spend on coffee. Anything that hurts Biden's (or whoever fills his shoes) chances of re-election is a victory for us. Biden staked a big part of his foreign policy platform on defending Ukraine and we can undermine that if we cut the purse strings. | |||
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blame canada |
Delusional. Did you believe we weren't in Cambodia also? We're not even trying to cover it up nearly as much as we did then. WE, as in, US troops, ARE in Ukraine. We are taking casualties. Don't be nieve. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "The trouble with our Liberal friends...is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan, 1964 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Arguing with some people is like playing chess with a pigeon. It doesn't matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon will just take a shit on the board, strut around knocking over all the pieces and act like it won.. and in some cases it will insult you at the same time." DevlDogs55, 2014  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ www.rikrlandvs.com | |||
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| Made from a different mold  |
Flashlight Boy, if every US Politician no longer made money because of the Ukraine, would we still be sending US tax dollars there? You brazenly claim that it's not costing any US lives but you seem to forget that all of the money we are dumping into Ukraine could be better put to use here to stop Fentanyl coming across our southern border. How many lives has that cost US since this boondoggle started? CDC has 109,680 overdose deaths for 2022 alone. Ask your other Leftist friends why the US is worried about Ukraine's border and not our own! (hint: $$$) We get it, you're lazy and it's easier for you to have someone else do your thinking for you. If you can't see that $150 Billion could be better used within our own borders, you're beyond help. ___________________________ No thanks, I've already got a penguin. | |||
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Frangas non Flectes |
I'm sorry, but three generations spent in Iraq and Afghanistan is more than enough. No more. I don't give a fuck who signed what. Everyone keeps wanting to go back to the Budapest Memorandum, like the buck stops there, when these people have been butchering each other over the same strip of land for the last two thousand years. It's just not our fucking business, period. ______________________________________________ Carthago delenda est | |||
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| Savor the limelight |
What nuclear weapons have been used or threatened to be used against Ukraine? There’s nothing in the entire text you quoted the requires the United States to do anything as far as Ukraine’s current problem with Russia goes at this point. If the Russians decide to use nuclear weapons or threaten to use them in Ukraine, the gloves will really come off as we seek the United Nations Security Council’s help. | |||
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Member |
How many have looked at a world map to see that the USA is at a distinct strategic and logistical disadvantage in supporting the Ukrainian government? And why support a government which has been corrupt for years? From a Google search: "still ranked the second most corrupt country in Europe, after Russia, according to Transparency International." Russia has been in a weakened state since the collapse of the former Soviet Union. One can argue that Putin's dictatorship and his kleptocratic supporters have only weakened and impoverished Russia further. Best to remember former President George Washington's admonition to avoid foreign entanglements. I agree with the sentiment that US dollars could be better spent at home. | |||
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| Member |
Western ammunition supplies 'are at the bottom of the barrel' with the war in Ukraine showing no sign of ending, NATO warns NATO's top official said ammo reserves were at the 'bottom of the barrel' The UK's minister for armed forces said the West needs to build its support capacity It comes as cracks in the West's support for Ukraine have begun to show https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...ding-NATO-warns.html NATO has warned that western supplies of ammunition for Ukraine are rapidly depleting, as Russia's invasion shows no sign of ending. The warning comes as Ukraine's allies urged the besieged country to continue the fight, despite waning support from major military partners. NATO's most senior military official Admiral Rob Bauer said on Tuesday at the Warsaw Security Forum: 'The bottom of the barrel is now visible.' 'We give away weapons systems to Ukraine, which is great, and ammunition, but not from full warehouses. We started to give away from half-full or lower warehouses in Europe,' Bauer said, adding that even these stores were getting low. NATO officials weren't the only ones who admitted that ammunition stockpiles were low. More at link AND: https://www.breitbart.com/euro...ve-ukraine-warns-uk/ Britain Warns West is Running Out of Weapons to Give Ukraine _________________________ "Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." Mark Twain | |||
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| Peace through superior firepower |
No, I don't know anything of the sort. I took your remark at face value, and if it's only metaphor, perhaps you should consider making your points clearer. If you want mind-readers, you're in the wrong forum. Let's talk about realities. You're making bold predictions about a nuclear superpower which you have no way of proving. It's merely speculation and wishful thinking on your part. Here's the reality: it is a fact that billions upon billions of dollars have been taken from the US treasury and disappeared into a demonstrably corrupt country involved in an Eastern European border conflict. This is taxpayer money, and it's gone, and that is a fact, not some Goddamned wet dream about crushing Crazy Ivan. Quite frankly, it's laughable that all this talk about what wasting all that taxpayer money is really doing came after those who support this obscenity needed to mount a defense when taxpayers had the audacity to object to the way their money was being spent; it comes across like puerile rationalization. This attitude that Russia is evil and our greatest enemy seems to be a Cold War hangover. If you want to guard against danger, look to China. Russians have always evinced cynicism at their communist system, but the Chinese Communist Party seeks to crush all dissent. Forget the Russians and the tantrum-throwing government of North Korea; China is the greatest threat to the world, and here we are, depleting not only our treasury, but also critical stockpiles of weaponry. If you think the CCP isn't paying close attention to our folly... But, you can take comfort in knowing that you're in fine company with your outsized fear of Russia: all the ladies on The View, just about every major news agency in the country, all the Ukrainian flag-waving imbeciles on Facebook and Twitter and wherever else, all the mindless leftists, and every gullible soccer mom ever to drive an SUV. They're all stupid and brainwashed. What's your excuse? | |||
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