^^^

Debating fretboard radius now. When I went to the shop the other day, I played a Fender American Ultra that had a progressive 10"-14" compound radius. But I'm considering a few that have a straight radius, 11" or straight 7.25 radius.

I'm guessing I'm not a good enough guitarist to notice.

Same with weights. I'm not sure I'd notice a 6 or 8 ounce difference in my lifetime. But it seems the better Fender guitars are a little lighter. I watched a recent 5 Watt World where they said the Custom shop woods are a higher grade, lighter tone wood.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Debating fretboard radius now. When I went to the shop the other day, I played a Fender American Ultra that had a progressive 10"-14" compound radius. But I'm considering a few that have a straight radius, 11" or straight 7.25 radius.

I'm guessing I'm not a good enough guitarist to notice.

So, where this principally comes into play is chording vs bends. Any kind of bend, and a flatter radius is better. Smaller radius necks, you're pushing the bend "uphill," as it were, and the note tends to choke out at a certain point. The rounder the radius, the faster a bend will choke out. The flatter the radius, the further you can push a bend, with a 12" or 14" radius being super flat and you can bend a string all the way across the damn fretboard. Rounder radius necks are generally more comfortable to fret chords, so if you know you're just a stummer or bar chord slammer, a round neck is fine. Lead guitarists will tend to stick with flatter necks, which is why you'll never see someone like Vai mess with anything less than a 12" radius.

Now, compound radius is where things get interesting. That 10" radius is essentially the radius from frets 1-10 or 1-12, where most of your chords get played. From fret 10 (or 12, depending), the frets flatten out to 14" radius, which is super flat, and you can bend notes up there really easily without them choking out. It's a compromise where you can get the best of both worlds, easy chording down where you're doing all that and easy bends further up the fretboard. You can take a guitar with a standard 10" radius and give it a compound radius by running a flat file in a fan pattern up at the tenth fret, then crown and dress the frets. I have done several compound radius fret jobs on guitars. It's pretty simple (if you have the tools and know-how) and gives you some solid benefits. Before I left Lollar, I was talking to one of the sales guys who was excited to go to a luthier friend's shop and get taught to do a fret dressing on one of his guitars. It was a rounder radius, I think 9.something" and I asked him if he was going to do a compound radius on it. He said "no," and stated a reason I cannot for the life of me remember, but for his purposes, it made a lot of sense. So I don't know of any but one reason not to do it, and I can't remember that reason, but for him, it was a good one. You may buy a compound radius guitar and never see the benefit, and you may never see the drawbacks. Just the nature of the beast. However, should you turn into a guitarist who goes from a thumb-over-the-top at one end of the neck to dropping your wrist and getting parallel to the fretboard to light it up past the twelfth fret, you will see a benefit.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
I watched a recent 5 Watt World where they said the Custom shop woods are a higher grade, lighter tone wood.

Lighter doesn't necessarily mean higher grade. Fender Custom Shop does select high grade woods, and they made have a weight range they'll select for, but understand those are two different metrics rather than directly related. Swamp ash is a very light wood and has excellent tonal properties. Swamp ash for a Tele with the traditional arrangement of pickups that are medium or low output is a very classic sound. A 12lb Les Paul studio with a solid chunk of mahogany and no maple cap is also a very classic sound. Again, it's all in what you're looking for, and there's more to it than just types of woods. Back in the 70's, both Gibson and Fender were pumping out instruments with woods that weren't properly dried, so a lot of guitars and basses from that era were really heavy and still are today. Modern kiln-drying is dialed in pretty well, so they can get the woods to the exact humidity content they need to be pretty reliably. One result is lighter guitars. Another thing that plays into that is that a lot of the traditional tonewoods have been damned near logged to the point of extinction. Mahogany, rosewood and ebony just about can't be harvested anymore (some smartass will probably chime in with "nuh uh") and manufacturers have been looking at viable and previous untested alternatives for a long time now, close to 25 years. My Taylor has Tasmanian Blackwood back and sides, part of a twice-a-season limited run Taylor used to do with a standard model with new and unusual tonewoods just to try things out. Instead of spruce tops, sapele is now the norm. My Les Paul Smartwood Exotic was part of Gibson's early attempts in the late 90's to do the same thing, and of the six wood types offered in the picture, mine is like the second from the right here.


It's Curupay, also called Patagonian Rosewood, and it's native to central America. Super dense, hard, and medium weight for it's size. I forget the exact weight, but mine is close to 7lbs, and lighter than my Les Paul Double Cut, which is a chambered semi-hollow made from mahogany with a maple cap.

It also varies from tree to tree, depending on what kind of soil it grew in and what minerals it sucked up into the tree, what the weather was like while it grew, etc. The Stradivarius violins that are mostly highly sought after, last I read, they'd discovered that it wasn't simply because he built them, it was the woods he used as the trees he worked from were grown during a particularly cool period of history and were very dense, with tight growth rings. That's my loose recollection anyway. The point is, it can vary widely from guitar to guitar, depending on the exact chunk of wood used. Some are absolutely gorgeous duds made out of tonally dead wood, and some beaters just resonate loudly. The only way to tell is to get your hands on it and play it. If at all possible, pick one you like unplugged. If it doesn't speak to you unplugged, then it's not worth amplifying. I bought that Smartwood at the Tacoma Guitar Show in 2014. The table it was at was right across from the Lollar booth and I eyeballed it All. Damn. Day. Went over when he was starting to pack up at the end of the day and asked to play it. The guy was really pushy about me having to plug it in to hear it since he was proud of the Duncans he'd put in it. I told him it wasn't necessary, because I was going to gut everything electronic out of it as soon as I took it home. He was offended, my shop supervisor just grinned. The only reason I waited was to give my boss a chance to play it plugged in before we swapped in some Imperials I wound... along with all new primo pots, switch, jack, and cap. The difference was absurd. Still my favorite guitar.

In general, a Fender type guitar is going to be lighter than a Gibson type guitar, but there are 7lb Les Pauls and 10lb Strats out there in the wild.

Awesome explanation Smudge, thank you! The only drawback to the compound radius I'd read of was that the setup is more important and you have to split the difference in what you're shooting for, and thus it's a bit of a compromise. I'm probably going to bend a bit, but not crazy huge bends. Still, that 11" radius guitar is gorgeous. But my gut tells me to stay more traditional. I need to get more hands-on. Hell, John Mayer plays a 7.25. Do I need to bend longer than he!? But then, Nile Rodgers strums on a 9.5.

But really, I just need to initially to get my legs (fingers) back underneath me, and do some of these online master classes. Get way out of my comfort zone and do a lot of new stuff.

This is maybe 1985-86? Had gigged a tele deluxe for 4-5 yrs, then bought this Ibanez for the hotter hamburger pups.

Black face fender, super reverb combo with 4x10 and a sunn 2x12 on top. Super beamy! Horrible for the person in front of it lol.


Long time ago. Peddleboard of boss and mxr plus crybaby.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
The only drawback to the compound radius I'd read of was that the setup is more important and you have to split the difference in what you're shooting for, and thus it's a bit of a compromise.

That's news to me, and I've been paid good money to set up a ton of guitars lol. I can't see a reason why this would be the case, honestly. That sounds like the kinda thing you'd hear from a guy who uses feeler gauges to set up a guitar instead of just adjusting until it's right.

One thing you will encounter in the guitar world is tons of opinion represented as fact. I try really hard to not do that because I've made a living on the retail side of it, but a lot of people haven't and as a result, have zero compunction saying whatever it is they think is the case about something as if it's just the truth from the blue, blue sky. Lots of "trick of the week" and "I know something you don't." There was a time Billy Gibbons actually had some people convinced he got his tone from soaking his strings in BBQ sauce if that illustrates the point any.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
I'm probably going to bend a bit, but not crazy huge bends. Still, that 11" radius guitar is gorgeous. But my gut tells me to stay more traditional. I need to get more hands-on. Hell, John Mayer plays a 7.25. Do I need to bend longer than he!? But then, Nile Rodgers strums on a 9.5.

Honestly, this is one thing someone could definitely overthink. It truly isn't a huge deal. I'm happy to discuss whatever I know or remember, but I don't want to lead you too far into the weeds on this. Coming back to playing, and especially starting off with electric, it's far more important to get something that you'll be excited to play so that you actually do start logging some time doing so than a given fretboard radius or scale length, or any of that. Just like every gun thread on every forum on the internet where some clown comes in and says "Just buy the (cheap one) and spend the rest on ammo and training!" the responsible thing here would be to suggest something similar. You could do no worse with a Mexican Strat of any era of production with any combination of features but in a color you really like than a Fender custom shop anything at this point. Truly. If you find something comfortable and start pounding scales, you'll be in a place to better discern what it is you actually like or don't like in six or nine months from now. We all love gear, though, so we're going to indulge you.

I like the affordable SE line at PRS. They make a superb hollow body electric.


I have the SE "Paul's Guitar". It's really fun to play.
Here's an old pic of my gigging days with my ESP. That thing is a flame thrower.

quote:

This is maybe 1985-86? Had gigged a tele deluxe for 4-5 yrs, then bought this Ibanez for the hotter hamburger pups.

Nice guitar! Mine is a Black 1980 AR-50 with the Super 70s pickups. It's a great sound!

quote:

Originally posted by Ogie:

quote:

This is maybe 1985-86? Had gigged a tele deluxe for 4-5 yrs, then bought this Ibanez for the hotter hamburger pups.

Nice guitar! Mine is a Black 1980 AR-50 with the Super 70s pickups. It's a great sound!

Very cool Ogie! …

I just found this one on reverb.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:


Honestly, this is one thing someone could definitely overthink. It truly isn't a huge deal. I'm happy to discuss whatever I know or remember, but I don't want to lead you too far into the weeds on this. Coming back to playing, and especially starting off with electric, it's far more important to get something that you'll be excited to play so that you actually do start logging some time doing so than a given fretboard radius or scale length, or any of that. Just like every gun thread on every forum on the internet where some clown comes in and says "Just buy the (cheap one) and spend the rest on ammo and training!" the responsible thing here would be to suggest something similar. You could do no worse with a Mexican Strat of any era of production with any combination of features but in a color you really like than a Fender custom shop anything at this point. Truly. If you find something comfortable and start pounding scales, you'll be in a place to better discern what it is you actually like or don't like in six or nine months from now. We all love gear, though, so we're going to indulge you.

I have a G&L Legacy (Strat) which has as 12" radius and I have a Fender Mexico Strat, which my son left behind, with a 9.5" radius. You can tell there is a difference, but it doesn't much affect my playing. Smudge is right, don't get too hung up on it.

And those Made-in-Mexico Strats are quite nice, especially for the price.

And in another of the long list of things that tells me I am getting old is that I paid about $250 for the MIM Strat new about 18 years ago. THey are $850 now. (I think the G&L was about $850 20 years ago.)

It's not just you, in the last 15 years, people figured out what a value the Mexican Fenders are and they've gone up in price. I had a Fiesta Red Mexican Strat that I bought off a friend in high school. Paid $100 for in in 2000, sold it in 2005 for $100. At the time, it was the guitar I kept forgetting I owned, and I still keep forgetting that I owned it. Wish I'd just kept it. Yes, they're $800 something now, and back when I owned mine, that's what the American Fenders were going for.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:

quote:

Originally posted by Ogie:

quote:

This is maybe 1985-86? Had gigged a tele deluxe for 4-5 yrs, then bought this Ibanez for the hotter hamburger pups.

Nice guitar! Mine is a Black 1980 AR-50 with the Super 70s pickups. It's a great sound!

Very cool Ogie! …

I just found this one on reverb.

Thanks! I have to make a correction though. The Ibanez AR-50 that I have is a 1982 model. My Yamaha SBG 2000 is a 1980 model that I purchased new. A funny story with that one. It left Japan with a truss rod cover that stated "SG". When it got to the US they changed the truss rod cover to state "SBG" due to a lawsuit that Gibson had filed. They are both great guitars and have gone up significantly in the used market since I purchased mine, especially the Yamaha.

I'm on my way! I tried a few types of guitars and decided that the Strat was a good platform for me to restart this thing. I narrowed to the American Vintage II 1961 Strat. Many modern/new Strats are "relic'd", meaning pre-beat up, faux wear. I just don't like it. It's fake. But most that aren't relic'd are somewhat lesser urethane 3finished. I wanted a rosewood fretboard. I wanted Olympic white. I wanted nitrocellulose finish. And I kind of like that it has a 7.25" radius fretboard. Good for where I'm at right now.

Finally I arrived at this model, but most shops don't have it in stock yet (new model) and don't expect it until Spring. Fender has them on their site, and they offer 10%-off for newly registered users.

I expect to have to spend some time to get it setup right. I'm guessing Fender direct will not have spent the TLC in intonation, and action setup.

Now, to the Amp!

[video set to where the Vintage 61 starts.]

Just picked this on a trip to GC for some strings… 2009 and BEAUTIFUL wood on this no longer made model!!
https://imgur.com/a/oRzB4DS

Punches SOOOO much higher than it’s price point!!!!!!!! Enjoy the journey!

Here you go, r0gue, Wildwood Guitars has exactly one American Vintage II Strat in olympic white (under 8# too). I’ve bought two guitars from them. They’ll probably move on the price for you as well.

Link

Nice choice… A lot of people are talking about these lately.

Because of this thread, I reached out to a luthier I like in Maine, who has more of that Nootka Cedar and figured torrified maple … Will probably start tele build next March.

Enjoy!


Last 4 days, I just learned two or three J Satriani songs (ten words, tears and … uggh?) along with a John Mayer tune (heartbreak warfare… Super easy just a few chords.). So much fun to pick up new jams.

Was just letting Spotify roll through tunes, force myself to play them in random order and then stopped on a couple I really liked.

Now, onto the next topic … lol … plectrums; take your pick. What’s your favorite?

Also, extra credit for ID on blue pick. Who, and how.

For electric guitar, a heavy celluloid pick is fine - I find that feel and the right stiffness is most important and I like heavier picks. On an electric, I don't hear too much difference between any pick. I also like the same ones I mention for acoustic guitar. I can hear some difference in the attack from pick to pick, but less on tone. Some of that may be feel that my brain tricks me into thinking I can hear.


On acoustic, you can hear the pick more. I like the heavier gauge Dunlop Ultex picks and Clayton Ultem and Acetal picks.

On mandolin, I have a very strong preference for Red Bear Trading's originals. I can really hear the difference in tone of these. I like the large triangle with three different points. They are crazy expensive, though.

I have a few real tortoise shell picks made from old combs, and they do feel and sound good, but I don't think they have any holy grail properties. They are a very good pick, but not the be-all-end-all. I have a couple of ivory picks made out of old piano keys, and that is also a nice material.

I also have dozens of other picks of all sorts. Some are just ordinary celluloid or other plastic picks. Others are made out of something a little unusual or shaped oddly (finger grips, extra thick, perforated). None of them stand out for me, but I am sure there are people that think they are the bees knees.

This video shows a local pup gig in Maine iirc.

The guitar player and bass player (Laurent Brondel (guitar)and Chuck Thornton (bass), respectively) are the luthiers that built my strat-type.

quote:

Originally posted by TMats:
Here you go, r0gue, Wildwood Guitars has exactly one American Vintage II Strat in olympic white (under 8# too). I’ve bought two guitars from them. They’ll probably move on the price for you as well.

Link

Got mine ordered direct from Fender already. I'd have bought from Wildwood had I known they had it. Would have appreciated the free setup. But also, yeah, under 8# is good. Who knows?, maybe I'll get luCky.

And as for piCks -- I'm a Dunlop guy. Though I'm overdue for trying something new. In fact, that's what this whole guitar reboot is, -- lots of new stuff to try!