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Vaudeville Villain
Picture of ViktorVaughn
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
quote:
Originally posted by ViktorVaughn:
Gotcha. Thanks Rhino.

Do you have any ideas of what we can do to get this mess fixed? Contact our Senators or something? Do we have any legal recourse?
Not really, guys on some of the other forums are contacting their congressmen and think filing grevances, etc might help.

Honestly the people who are gonna get screwed are the manufacturers and shops that specialize in selling silencers (IMO). I think the booming business that they have done over the past couple of years is gonna take a big hit. Maybe they'll band together and start a lawsuit but you know that'll take years to get through.

Basically this is the only way Obummer and his band of fools can easily attack legal gunowners / gun businesses, by using an unconstitutional law (IMO) to inflict more pain via "rule making".

It sucks and I'm not sure what the correct avenue is. Unfortunately a large portion of America is already anti-gun and NFA items seem even more "fringe" to them and even gun rights supporters.
Yeah, even ardent 2A supporting politicians are probably ignorant regarding NFA laws and the current debacle.

I agree that the Suppressor manufacturers and maybe Gun Trust Lawyers will be key in fighting not only the proposed 41P rule change but the egregious wait times.

However, I think that the recent shenanigans might be enough to push NFA owners (many of which are wealthy) to the point of taking some sort of legal action. I was reading that it happened back in 2001 when the CLEO signature was challenged in court. I personally would throw $200 to the cause (cost of a stamp).

What I really want to know is if they have placed a moratorium on all approvals because it seems like that would be the only thing that could make the wait times jump like that.


___________________________________________________________________________________________
"Pine cones go in here. Party liquors come out here, and proceed to here. Fights begin, fingerprints are took, days is lost, bail is made, court dates are ignored, cycle is repeated." - Early Cuyler
 
Posts: 3435 | Location: Kansas City | Registered: April 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Staple Gun Extraordinaire!
Picture of sig-x
posted Hide Post
How many people do you think submitted extra forms and bought NFA that have been holding off because of the pending trust issue? People with trusts bought everything they could in the last two months hoping they would get grandfathered in if the trust route will require sign offs.

I myself purchased 2 items I had no intention to buy until I read about the trust issue and that's what I use.

They are more than likely over run with forms to process. Only so many examiners.
 
Posts: 9947 | Location: SE MI | Registered: November 24, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Vaudeville Villain
Picture of ViktorVaughn
posted Hide Post
I agree that a huge influx of forms might move the estimated date for a form sent today to 15 months but the NFA branch has been telling people (as of yesterday) that all forms have an estimated time of 15 months from receipt to approval, regardless of whether NFA received the form yesterday or six months ago.

Honestly, the more responses that I read today from people that have called NFA branch in the past 2 days, I am coming to the conclusion that they are saying 15 months as a way to simplify things.

NFA branch is telling everyone that they have done away with "Pending" and "Second Pending" and are now measuring by the date they receive the form and are estimating 15 months from that date. That may be somewhat accurate for a form received today, but they are telling that to everyone, regardless of when the form was received.


___________________________________________________________________________________________
"Pine cones go in here. Party liquors come out here, and proceed to here. Fights begin, fingerprints are took, days is lost, bail is made, court dates are ignored, cycle is repeated." - Early Cuyler
 
Posts: 3435 | Location: Kansas City | Registered: April 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of argolfer
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sig-x:
How many people do you think submitted extra forms and bought NFA that have been holding off because of the pending trust issue? People with trusts bought everything they could in the last two months hoping they would get grandfathered in if the trust route will require sign offs.

I myself purchased 2 items I had no intention to buy until I read about the trust issue and that's what I use.

They are more than likely over run with forms to process. Only so many examiners.


I agree with this. I bought 2 suppressor and submitted for 2 sbr's this past month because of all of nonsense.

From what I understand, they hit $1M in January for the first time (in a month) and that number jumped to $2M by February. Who knows how many have been submitted in the last couple of months. Early in the year they were 57,000 forms behind. That number has probably grown considerably. With 9 experience examiners and 11 new ones, it's going to take them a while to get through that many.


___________________________________
No, it's a cardigan... but thanks for noticing
 
Posts: 4345 | Registered: July 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of SIG Truth
Picture of C Swimm
posted Hide Post
I can't count how many guys I've heard at the LGS saying they would get a silencer if it wasn't for the 6 months wait. Then it went to 9 months. If it goes to 15, that will kill the market.

Shit, I can't even say I'll be living in this same state in 15 months. I can't say my dealer will still be in business in 15 months. A lot can change in that amount of time.

It's killing me to be waiting since early February. I won't be submitting any more forms until this mess gets sorted out. Sorry to say it, and I'm sure it's exactly when they are hoping will happen, but I can't take this BS.

This process needs to be automated. But without a larger pro gun majority it will never happen. Even the ones we can count as strongly pro gun will probably become a squish when talk turns to NFA devices. They can see the headlines in the libtard news papers now. "Sen/Rep So and So thinks people should be able to get machineguns, silencers and bombs more easily." You know that's exactly how it will go. And the idiot masses will eat it up as soon as Letterman, Leno, and the other late night "Talk show" hosts start making fun of it. No body will care what the true facts are either.


-Chris

... if the people come to believe that the government is no longer constrained by the laws then they will conclude that neither are they. -Michael Cannon, CATO Institute.
 
Posts: 10059 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: June 28, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
What would soncorn do?
Picture of soncorn
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Elpasotom:
Confirm 15 months I have 2 suppressors pending since January. TX NFA Branch spoke with "Linda" said status shows pending estimate 15 months to completion...going into a trust... my previous items all took 9 months to get back.


Pending as in you called before the shutdown and they told you that they were in pending status on some day in January?

Or you bought them in January and the forms were sent at some point? Do you know when the check was cashed?

If you were in pending status in January you should have your stamps in hand by now. If it is one of the others you will probably be receiving them in the next month or so. For existing applications the data on nfatracker shows that they were only delayed by a couple weeks.

I think they are just telling people 15 months so that people stop calling and that so people don't get unhappy when they don't get the stamp in 9 months or whatever.


Every citizen should be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and Romans, and must be that of every free state.
- Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826)
 
Posts: 1387 | Location: Fort Worth, TX, USA | Registered: October 20, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of swiss_seth
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I feel really bad for the dealers.

When I heard about this order I immediately went out and bought a new suppressor. I told the dealer that I would only but if they agreed to a refund if there were to be any issue with CLEO signoff and/or truts due the new rules coming down the pike.


I feel its about a 50/50 split as to whether my SOT has to refund that 800 dollars at which point many dealers are going to have some expensive paper weights sitting around.

Everytime I was at the store the customers that were interested in buying NFA were basically turned off when they heard about the 10 month wait. It it really is 15 months than they wont be selling any NFA and we are talking about a store with at least 50 suppressors not to mentions F/A pre-86 and SBR's/AOW.


It just makes be sick.
 
Posts: 1618 | Location: Steel City USA | Registered: October 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Staple Gun Extraordinaire!
Picture of sig-x
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I can't return the mgs I bought lol. Were all on the same sinking boat.
 
Posts: 9947 | Location: SE MI | Registered: November 24, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of swiss_seth
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I agree with what someone said earlier

We need to do what every red blooded American does in a situation like this...

Sue the shit out of someone/something. haha
 
Posts: 1618 | Location: Steel City USA | Registered: October 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of swiss_seth
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Luckily I got my paper in the mail today from the CLEO Sheriff and he signed.

Looks like he pretty much signs right away and sends them back.

I read his bio and he is a republican/conservative/constitutionalist

So I guess I never should have doubted he would sign off. The shitty part for me is that usually a Dem holds the sheriffs seat in my county.
 
Posts: 1618 | Location: Steel City USA | Registered: October 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
To Do What is
Right and Just
posted Hide Post
Talked to the ATF last week to make sure the latest purchase went pending. I mailed it in sometime in June or July, and it went pending August 1st. The lady told me the expected wait time is 15 months. I about shit my pants. I figured on 9. I don't see this as looking good for our class 3 sales.
 
Posts: 2365 | Location: Usually Somewhere | Registered: July 28, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Vaudeville Villain
Picture of ViktorVaughn
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I just got a stamp back last night that was send in late January, so they are still approving forms. I'm thinking the 15 month is a worst case, 41P disaster, scenario.


___________________________________________________________________________________________
"Pine cones go in here. Party liquors come out here, and proceed to here. Fights begin, fingerprints are took, days is lost, bail is made, court dates are ignored, cycle is repeated." - Early Cuyler
 
Posts: 3435 | Location: Kansas City | Registered: April 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Recondite Raider
Picture of lizardman_u
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I just wrote Greg Walden (R) House Representative about the wait times being preposterous as the ATF could adopt the same programs used by the states for the background checks we all go through when purchasing a firearm from a dealer.

I doubt it will do much good, but one never knows.


__________________________
More blessed than I deserve.
http://davesphotography7055.zenfolio.com/f238091154
 
Posts: 3427 | Location: Boardman, Oregon | Registered: September 19, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Administrator
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by lizardman_u:
I just wrote Greg Walden (R) House Representative about the wait times being preposterous as the ATF could adopt the same programs used by the states for the background checks we all go through when purchasing a firearm from a dealer.

I doubt it will do much good, but one never knows.


Depends, did you explain that it was to get evil gun stuff, or that the gov't was missing out on a huge revenue source?
 
Posts: 17733 | Registered: August 12, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Recondite Raider
Picture of lizardman_u
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by LDD:
Depends, did you explain that it was to get evil gun stuff, or that the gov't was missing out on a huge revenue source?


I hit the revenue side with the mention of the $200.00 check we pay in a special tax to own NFA items and that by delaying us by not using an instant system like is used when we go through a dealer for non NFA items they are de-facto denying us our rights as Americans as stated by federal law and state law.

Dave


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More blessed than I deserve.
http://davesphotography7055.zenfolio.com/f238091154
 
Posts: 3427 | Location: Boardman, Oregon | Registered: September 19, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of SIG Truth
Picture of C Swimm
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Well, my form 4 with tax stamp finally came back yesterday for my AAC SDN-6 suppressor. I mailed it off on February 6th so it took about 9.5 months on a trust.

Probably the last one I will see within the same calendar year unless things improve.

Just think, if you send one off now you probably won't see it back until 2015. Frown


-Chris

... if the people come to believe that the government is no longer constrained by the laws then they will conclude that neither are they. -Michael Cannon, CATO Institute.
 
Posts: 10059 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: June 28, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Official forum
SIG Pro
enthusiast
Picture of stickman428
posted Hide Post
C Swimm,

I have two suppressors that started the long wait at the end of Feb.....hopefully anyday now.

I planned on getting a SWR SpecWar 5.56 suppressor but now with the wait times I will likely pass.

I hope the silencer manufacturers look into challenging the legality of such wait times...if they do not I fear they will all be driven out of buisness.
 
Posts: 18730 | Registered: April 16, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of corey4
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by swiss_seth:
I feel really bad for the dealers.

When I heard about this order I immediately went out and bought a new suppressor. I told the dealer that I would only but if they agreed to a refund if there were to be any issue with CLEO signoff and/or truts due the new rules coming down the pike.


I feel its about a 50/50 split as to whether my SOT has to refund that 800 dollars at which point many dealers are going to have some expensive paper weights sitting around.

Everytime I was at the store the customers that were interested in buying NFA were basically turned off when they heard about the 10 month wait. It it really is 15 months than they wont be selling any NFA and we are talking about a store with at least 50 suppressors not to mentions F/A pre-86 and SBR's/AOW.


It just makes be sick.


which dealer was that? i am in pittsburgh too.
 
Posts: 172 | Location: Pittsburgh, PA | Registered: November 07, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
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FYI, the class 3 dealer goes thur the same process and wait time as the end buyer does.
 
Posts: 269 | Location: Central Nebraska | Registered: April 28, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
I'm in the same boat as many of you, I just mailed a form 1 beginning of September for my 2nd SBR. I am expecting a 1 year wait. On a SBR I don't feel as bad about the wait because I can take my time researching, and acquiring the lower and upper parts, and it allows me to space out the expense over time. I however will not be purchasing another suppressor until this mess is straightened out if ever. I can't afford to throw down $1K for something that I wont get any use out of for over a year.
 
Posts: 103 | Location: Clearwater, FL | Registered: April 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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