Is it a coincidence that news is filled with vaping epidemic/crisis stories and big tobacco is saturating the airways with ads for their Juul and Blu ecigs? I think not, somebody wants their monopoly back.

Here's a non-vaper whose only dog in the fight is what's known today and personal liberty --




Link to original video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxcieZTDoSM&t=1s

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by RAMIUS:
Pretty sure the only people getting sick are the ones using the weird ass Chinese stuff, or the cartridges that made by highly questionable sources.

The whole vape hysteria reminds me of anti gun people talking about firearms issues when they have no first hand knowledge and just listen to the media.

Nailed it.

I find it fascinating to see people who distrust government and the dominant "news" media for essentially everything, then, here comes something they don't do, don't understand, maybe do not like, and they're right lock step

Makes me want to go right out and buy some flavoured vape juice. And maybe a new vape mod. Not because I particularly want them. I stopped vaping a couple years ago, after a brief experiment, but just because I still can. And because it'll annoy people.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
Also, it would be nice to know how safe it really is, and what it actually is made from.

Depends.

Here's a Reader's Digest version of what constitutes most vape juice from reputable makers: What is e-juice made out of?

There've been actual real studies done. Those studies have found vaping is about ten times less dangerous than cigarette smoking. You can find them if you're truly curious.

The "popcorn lung" thing is old, very old news. Nobody legitimate uses the chemical that was responsible for that any more. Haven't for years.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
Vaping is dumb

I think a lot of things people do are dumb. Doesn't mean I think they should be blanket banned.

Very well said and I agree 100%

Most of the stories of people having issues with vaping are from some underground THC cartridges of unknown origin. The problem with vaping is the quality of the juice can be all over the map and their is no regulation to it. If you use some drug dealers THC juice, or Chinese crap it could be horrendous. Quality juice, the verdict is still out on the long term effects of vaping, but I can't see it as not having any negative effect on your health (long term). Is it a healthier alternative to cigarettes, again, who knows...….Keep in mind, everyone thought cigarettes/tobacco wasn't bad for your health for almost a century.

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Originally posted by jimmy123x:
Keep in mind, everyone thought cigarettes/tobacco wasn't bad for your health for almost a century.

No one with two brain cells ever believed that smoking two packs a day wasn't bad for your health.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
Vaping is dumb

I think a lot of things people do are dumb. Doesn't mean I think they should be blanket banned.

So who in this thread has actually called for an outright ban of vaping products? Must've missed it.

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Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

So who in this thread has actually called for an outright ban of vaping products? Must've missed it.

Well that's what the government has effectively done. Only tobacco flavored vapes will be allowed which no one wants. It will cost millions of dollars to get FDA approval so all those small business little vape shops will all go under.

The tobacco company wins. The government and media get to pay themselves in the back for saving the children. Meanwhile, black market will take over and everyone will be worse off....

Incredible the people who support government intervention and regulation ONLY when it supports or reinforces their worldview.

quote:

Originally posted by Scurvy:
The media is helping conflate a handful of deaths related to vaping thc into an outright ban of 99% of vaping products.

This is a movement being pushed by the tobacco lobby to help them corner the vape market and force more people back into smoking.

Just shocking to see so many people on a pro-freedom forum be totally cool with outright banning a product millions of people use safely because a couple idiots misuse said product and it kills someone.

I don't vape, but agree with this 100%. Yet another fine example of greedy-ass power mongers in big gov, big business, and big media working in concert to manipulate the masses.

No one here is suggesting a ban. Bans don't work. Alcohol. Guns. Abortions. Etc.

A safe and regulated market, or a black market. There is never no market.

I suppose we could argue about what people actually thought about cigarettes, but there was strong advertising and other pushback against the notion that they were dangerous to smokers’ health up until at least the 1960s. As I mentioned above, sometime in the late ’40s or early ’50s my father convinced my mother to start smoking to “calm her nerves.” There were countless advertisements featuring men dressed as doctors claiming how this or that cigarette was extra mild and smooth or less irritating. Other cigarette advertising was heavily endorsed by athletes with the obvious implied message that they had no adverse effect on their performance. Old Gold cigarettes in particular featured the tag line “Not a cough in a [train] carload” as part of almost every advertisement.

One of the great ironies about cigarette smoking was that the first significant attempt to warn of its dangers was by German researchers during the Nazi regime. Hitler was a nonsmoker as were some other top Nazis, but although they discouraged the practice, they didn’t ever ban it among their followers. At one time it was far more common for doctors to advise their patients to give up cigars rather than cigarettes.

These billowing clouds of vapor reeking of candy coated rainbows tell me everything I need to know. The fact you put that in your lungs first verifies you brought this on yourself.

Moderation in all things, be it vaping or rolling coal.

quote:

Originally posted by Jager:
The deaths are from those ingesting THC that contains a blend with Vitamin E acetate (whatever that is).

Any of the other illness related cases are likely using Chinese imported fluids on which there are no controls.

The shops mixing fluids are using vegetable oil, propylene glycol (which is FDA approved and is in food and medicines everywhere), nicotine and whatever flavor is chosen. Other than the nicotine, which is a poison, there's not much there to place blame on.

Those trying to ban or restrict or regulate (tax) vaping products are intentionally blurring the line between the THC/Vitamin E problematic vaping with the other vaping products.

Pretty much like the gun control crowd claims there is an 'assault weapons' problem - when its not 'assault weapons' (actually semi-automatic rifles, but they purposely blur that line, too) that are being used in firearm related crimes.

From what research I've done (not extensive), I concur. Very few people are getting sick from vaping nicotine, but someone must have decided it would make a great headline.

I can pretty much guarantee you that everyone who has gotten ill was vaping (what they thought was weed oil), but in reality was possibly weed oil cut with vegetable or mineral oil.

I read an article this morning about a 17 year old suffering from COPD, whose parent's were blaming nicotine vape juice. Pretty sure if they drug test the kid, he'll be positive for marijuana, because as House M.D. stated, everyone lies.

People are just jumping on the bandwagon.

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Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
Vaping is dumb

I think a lot of things people do are dumb. Doesn't mean I think they should be blanket banned.

So who in this thread has actually called for an outright ban of vaping products? Must've missed it.

Nobody here calling for an outright ban, but I'm seeing a lot of people joining the anti-vaping chorus being promoted by the Usual Suspects (the left and the dominant media).

Michigan Chief Nanny Whitmer has banned flavoured e-juice as of October 1, 2019. The Federal government is discussing doing the same. All because some chuckleheads vaped inadvisedly and a bunch of teens have been vaping nicotine.

Here's a wild thought: How about just plain regulating it? Start with restricting sales to adults. Just like smoking materials and alcoholic products. Instead Whitmer, and many others, want to destroy an entire industry.

As I mentioned before, I used to smoke & I figured it was nobody elses business. I feel the same about those who vape.

"The things most in need of regulation are other peoples habits." Mark Twain
(I may have misquoted slightly, but the meaning's the same.)

I have no objection to people smoking or vaping - as long as they use their own air.

Put a dam bag over your head and knock yourselves out.

DO NOT use MY air and we'll get along fine. Your health - your death - your choice.

This morning I wrote letters to my State Rep., thanking him for supporting a House bill to counter Gov. Whitmer's and the State's DHHS' attempt to usurp the state's legislative process, and a letter to my State Senator, urging the Senate to introduce parallel legislation.

I agree completely with Steven Crowder, although I had to turn off that video when he was imitating some kid with that "Maaaaaaaaaaaa!" crap. Goddamn, man, that is so freaking annoying, I couldn't even make it through the video.

Be that as it may, the point he made is entirely correct- if you support bans on vaping, you're not a true conservative. Leave people alone. Don't meddle in their affairs. Mind your own business.

If an individual wants to put chemicals into their body, it's perfectly fine to make the aware of the dangers involved, but when people who know almost next to nothing about a subject (basically, whatever the corporate news media tells them) start offering up opinions and then try to push lawmakers to ban activities which harm only the user, well, that's just plain bullshit.

Ask those who wish to ban self-loading rifes for the definition of an "assault rifle" and they simply cannot tell you, but their ignorance doesn't slow them down at all. I see the same thing happening with this vaping controversy. People allow the corporate media (who manufacture crises at every opportunity) to lead them around like sheep. Don't be part of the herd.

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Originally posted by parabellum:
Goddamn, man, that is so freaking annoying..

Yep, I don't usually point people to Crowder for his tendency to get shrill and hysterical. I did appreciate him doing his vaping homework before posting his vid but yeah, take a pill.

A couple of us old boys eat lunch at a local Mexican restaurant on Thursdays. Immediately to the West is a vapor shop. Not to judge, but, when we eat outside, we see a stream of tattooed, pierced, blue/green/red haired, etc looking kids going in and out. All of em driving junk cars/trucks/SUVs. What am I missing?
Mike

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Originally posted by braillediver:
Breathing water vapor isn't healthy.

Actually when you go in to the hospital or doctor, etc. and they give you what is called a breathing treatment it is pure oxygen with water vapor. God Bless

Oh, I definitely think it's stupid and needs to be regulated, but I fall very much on the side of "you do whatever you want with your body." I just cannot stand rude vapers who seem to pride themselves on blowing huge clouds in proximity to others. If I can smell and breathe what was just inside your body, then you might consider modifying your behavior, for the very reason people don't going around blasting farts all over the place. Nobody wants to breathe the vapor that just came out of your ass for a lot of the same reasons they don't want to breathe your mystery vapor you're doing your best impression of Puff the Magic Dragon with. Maybe you know what's in it, but I don't. So maybe keep it all to yourself and roll the windows up in your Plasti-Dipped Impreza and hotbox yourself in sickly sweet smells.

And unless the relative humidity is zero (and perhaps even then), we breathe in water vapor with every breath.