NYPD...with 40,000 officers (well, supposed to be), how much hand-to-hand and firearms continuation training do you think these guys get after their initial academy training?

Remember the Times Square crossfire shooting fuck-up? Idiot waves a toy gun, cops surround the perp, and end-up in a circular firing squad dumping a ton of rounds into the perp, killing a detective, while wounding three bystanders and six more get hit with shrapnel.

That man wanted so badly to be shot by the police but they were quite reluctant. No doubt brought on by a failure in training, hiring and probably the fear of potential riots and blowback over a police shooting.

This is what policing in a liberal democrat controlled big city has become. First, both female but not minority female. Secondly this is a week after George Floyd, the atmosphere for doing your job in NYC is not the same as say in red states. Both officers retreated, one of the counter the other out the door, given DiBlasio's attitude toward police can't necessarily say I blame either. The politicians and anarchist crowds in NYC have made it a stark reality that if you do your job and put this perp down you're in for hell on earth. The Mayor, DA and host of others will make you their cause of the moment. The media will eviscerate you, and you will face prosecution with a philosophy that puts PCness and mob rule above rule of law.

The PBA will defend the officer for criminal charges, civilly on your own. House, assets, pension and mental well being, suck wind. This case the perp looks to be an ethnic minority, media will drag cops through mud and label racist, and there is no hope city and department will stand by them.

Tactical wise the NYPD along with most blue urban cities put more effort in the academy on social issues, gender issues, diversity training, and de-escalating; not on weapons and tactics.

Months ago there was a thread on here kicking the jack wagon out of a Sgt. from the Central Park Pct. who was carrying a revolver in beat up leather. The old timer dollar to donuts would've dropped him, the moment the knife came out. A revolver was pre 1992 on NYPD and the city had a different approach to policing and the department like most big blue cities hadn't taken the teeth out of the police.

The more we have the defund the police crap, and the likes of pandering Democraps to these anti-police agendas will see more and more.

Sorry these lefties are getting what they're pandering too. Personally two women together in a big city, recipe for disaster, I may be sexist and God knows what other "ist" but I'm old school.

Maybe they don't belong on the job, or maybe they're afraid to act and the consequences of acting.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

quote:

Originally posted by P210:
Some supervisors are good enough to not saddle real cops with them so they pair them up so they mostly just jam each other up. This looked like such a team.

I wasn't aware of this, but it certainly would explain much of what we see in that clip.

Starting next week, Missy will work on gripping the gun even lower.

You don’t force people to trust cowards with their lives, but other cowards are a different story.

I’d love the backstory on this incident, and audio of the full encounter would be great too!

quote:

Originally posted by Scoutmaster:
I am amazed at how many people believe if the police cut back, back off, (disappear?) there will be less violence and crime. That's like saying if police stop giving speeding tickets, people will stop speeding.

To be fair, if the police were to disappear, there would be less police involved violence.
Overall violence would likely go up, it would suck to be an unarmed, law abiding, target, but there would be less police involved violence.

What you invest in recruitment, selection, training, and discipline determine the quality of police service. There is a direct relationship between those four pillars and positive outcomes in confrontations. Obviously not enough of those resources were applied to the officers involved-they were poorly prepared for that situation and are arguably not suited to the job, but then no one is without proper training and guidance. This is exactly why the "de-fund police" concept will have the opposite effect expected.

I fear that big city departments continuing to be de-funded will enter a death spiral without a correction of course.

I only could watch the first few seconds of this before I had to turn it off

Welcome to the new normal of policing and I believe it will get worse

Welcome to the new military also.

The other forum members have already posted my thoughts and feelings.

I have had the exact opposite experience of what P210 stated. I have always seen crap officers get saddled with good officers.

After watching this it does piss me off that every white male who goes for an interview or sits for a Law enforcement test will be at a disadvantage because of who and what he is. I have an interview this afternoon and guess what I am already in the hole because of being a W/M and now add in that I am 48. I lose.

This is what inclusive, AA etc.. hiring gets you.

The other half asked me why I still want to go back into LE especially after watching this video.

To me the saddest part of the whole video is when the "partner" stepped outside of the store.

Well that and the store owner acting like he is the only one with common sense and a backbone.

Nothing like displaying Officer presence and command authority when you are panicked and screaming like a banshee.

quote:

I have had the exact opposite experience of what P210 stated. I have always seen crap officers get saddled with good officers.

With 36,000 cops you can hide a lot of dead wood in relatively harmless posts and dusty basements and if that’s what it takes to let real cops get the job done, which is actually everybody’s goal, so be it. You do the best you can with what you have. Unfortunately smaller jobs have more limited options which explains your experience. Also, with 36k there’s places to stash useless bosses as well and that’s a big thing.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Starting next week, Missy will work on gripping the gun even lower.

She’ll be safely ensconced in a booth outside the Russian diplomat housing building in Riverdale, Heaven in the Bronx, or someplace equally critical to the departments needs.

My eval:

+P Gold Dot did a fine job, in spite of the cops not taking indicated action:

1. Armed suspect is an imminent threat.
2. Unarmed suspect is grabbing at your sidearm.
3. First two cops clearly not capable of decisive actions, in the face of lethal danger.

In addition to the CF of poor tactical and life choices, once she does shoot there’s another officer in her line of fire just behind the target. Lucky she didn’t accidentally shoot a fellow officer.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: arabiancowboy,

The political correctness is not just in large departments. My former employer was for a city with ~50,000 people. We had 130 cops. The hiring practices over the last decade were so far from the actual need, that the hiring committee literally said “hey, this one checks two boxes” (female and minority). I know this is actually said because I happened to walk into the room when they were going thru new hires folders.

Guess who got hired? Yup, and it doesn’t end there it’s a drain right from the start. Follow me on this. During the basic school applicants are told to bring 1000 rounds of pistol ammo. During one week the applicant is taught how to shoot and typically they only shoot 500-800 of that ammo and return the leftover to the department.

Well the aforementioned “two box checker” used all 1000 rounds, used all the leftovers from the other applicants from my department (about another 1000).

Somehow passed the block with a 70% ...the state mandated minimum. (Which many of us think was fudged based on the rest of the story)

When she graduated, she was taken to the range to qualify and literally failed the state course for over one week...shooting the course up to five or six times a day...I know she shot over 3000 rounds in a two week period as she was attempting to pass the course and qualify. All this ammo is expensive. Added to that, word gets around. No one wants her on their patrol team or worse being in a car with her for her FTO time....

But, the dept is so diverse!!!! Oohhhhh. Awwwww.

She wound up getting promoted above her peers, was assigned to swat so they could have a female, was assigned to narcotics to “round her career”, was made a sergeant ahead of actual qualified members, and within a year got a DWI. But they retained her. She was assigned to a desk, and then a year later took a plea bargain to get the case over with. The state didn’t revoke her certificate, the dept put her in charge of a patrol team, and no one wants to work under her. No one. And she still can’t shoot. It still takes her a special day of training with only her and the instructor present before she can meet the minimum.


/rant

Mike, I am not at all surprised at your experience. In my own experience, such matters are the norm in much of CA, particularly for gov't positions.

We have a friend who's son was a small arms specialist in the Navy. After 10 years he got out, decided to go into local law enforcement. At the police academy, the firearms instruction was quite harsh and demanding, as many of the trainees had never fired a real weapon.

But the trainer told him "I saw your file, you can do whatever the h**l you want in this course. The only difference is the rules of engagement".

"Why couldn't they just shoot him in the leg" crowd must be screaming about this by now too.

Gotta say, that boolit dropped him like a hot potato... Bam, Thud, DRT....

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
Gotta say, that boolit dropped him like a hot potato... Bam, Thud, DRT....

Not DRT. He survived:
"Bahadoran suffered a gunshot wound to his left arm and a gunshot wound to the lower back. Police officers on the scene called for medical assistance and applied a tourniquet to his left arm. Bahadoran was transported to Bellevue Hospital, where he was admitted and treated for his injuries."

He survived the shooting

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
He survived the shooting

Just saw that, well he shoulda been DRT.....
after reading the write up on YT, what a screwed up situation...

This is what happens when we follow the Left's "brilliant" experiments in policing. Remember how they insisted more women be hired because they were "less likely to use force" and more likely to use social skills to "deescalate" violent/confrontational situations than men? Remember when we were told that hiring standards must have been "unrealistic", since an insufficient number of "targeted candidates" weren't selected and retained as officers? Well, this is the result: Applicants that met the standards (low) of the Left, resulted in poor quality personnel being hired, retained (when they would have failed the basic training and the field training officer period), have become officers of this "quality" and the resulting incompetence provides fodder for the same (Leftists) people now demanding the police be "de-funded."

This isn't something new, it's the result of following the same directions that leftists have been demanding law enforcement follow for decades. Welcome to "social engineering" based law enforcement, where the emphasis is on the "social engineering" and law enforcement takes a backseat to looking like those you want to make feel better. Would a white male over six feet tall be just an incompetent? Of course, when that officer is hired using the same low standards necessary to hire more women and minorities. Lowering the standards to make quotas with some groups also lowers the standards for every other group.