As folks here know, I am a licensed firearms dealer in Virginia.

I am listed as a Rock River Arms dealer.

In a never-before experience, I've gotten two calls today from people, one a customer who bought a RRA rifle through me, and the other someone who I guess is calling everyone on listed on RRA's website as a dealer.

If I had to choose one word to describe these callers, it would be "pissed."

I like RRA's products, but if they don't get ahead of this, and soon, they are in for a world of business downturn.

As for Springfield Armory... well, I'll just say I don't own any and never will unless its a Springfield Armory gun made at the Massachusetts government armory.

yeah but,
https://www.springfieldpromo.com/

quote:

Originally posted by Veeper:
How the hell do they explain away donating TWENTY THOUSAND dollars to an F-rated politician? I can't afford to donate $100 to the people I agree with, let alone the assholes that openly champion the removal of my natural rights.

Just for the sake of devil's advocacy - are there any NON-"F" rated politicians up for election in IL?

quote:

Originally posted by Rob Decker:

quote:

Originally posted by Veeper:
How the hell do they explain away donating TWENTY THOUSAND dollars to an F-rated politician? I can't afford to donate $100 to the people I agree with, let alone the assholes that openly champion the removal of my natural rights.

Just for the sake of devil's advocacy - are there any NON-"F" rated politicians up for election in IL?

Probably the same way our government can arm some durka durkas one day, and the next year or the like declare them as terrorists and bomb them into oblivion, and sleep at night.

I think both companies fucked up here, for sure, but companies and organizations and governments and people have been making deals with the less desirables and enemies since the beginning of civilization, when it suits some larger goal or end. I don't think this aspect, alone, means much or is rare.

The rest, however, I find inexcusable and I'll not be giving either company any money.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:
As folks here know, I am a licensed firearms dealer in Virginia.

I am listed as a Rock River Arms dealer.

In a never-before experience, I've gotten two calls today from people, one a customer who bought a RRA rifle through me, and the other someone who I guess is calling everyone on listed on RRA's website as a dealer.

If I had to choose one word to describe these callers, it would be "pissed."

I like RRA's products, but if they don't get ahead of this, and soon, they are in for a world of business downturn.

As for Springfield Armory... well, I'll just say I don't own any and never will unless its a Springfield Armory gun made at the Massachusetts government armory.

Please use this experience as a reason to call RRA and let them know what's happening in other states.

The more pressure put on them right now, the better.

quote:

Originally posted by Veeper:
How the hell do they explain away donating TWENTY THOUSAND dollars to an F-rated politician? I can't afford to donate $100 to the people I agree with, let alone the assholes that openly champion the removal of my natural rights.

The least pleasant answer is the one that's jumping up and slapping me in the face right now: They were doing so well with sales during the Obama years, with the constant threat against gun rights that they were willing to back those threatening gun rights to help the panic rolling. I wouldn't have wanted to believe that until I had a conversation with a LGS gunsmith who had nothing good to say about Trump taking office because the sales at his shop have sharply declined.

They were making money hand over fist with the pressure on. I'm willing to believe this backing of anti's was a gambit to help push sales as long as they could, and buy off anyone about anything that would actually impact them. I hope it puts them under, both of them.

So, just to make sure I get this right, these companies were supporting the anti gun nuts, helping them to pass even stricter gun laws/restrictions, in order to fuel the paranoia in gun customers, trying to provoke us to feel a greater urgency to buy their products?

That's actually worse than the 'greed angle' (trying to get themselves special dispensation for financial gain). That is blatant betrayal.

Maybe SA, inc and RRA can merge and then they can suck together.

What did they gain? Hatred from informed pro second amendment supporters. And it just so happens we are a group who tend to have Irish alzheimers. (Forget everything but the grudge)

What's all this "carve out" stuff? Suddenly, everyone is talking like a corporate lawyer. I understand the term. Tell me specifically what SA and RRA gained from their support of antis, please.

Apparently they engineered an exemption from a new, burdensome, licensing and registration scheme in IL. All they had to do was drop opposition to the bill via their lobbying corp.

People caught wind of that AND the fact that they've been donating heavily to GDCs via this lobbying corp.

No idea what they gained in the real world. Everyone I see is lose lose lose.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

< snip >

Tell me specifically what SA and RRA gained from their support of antis, please.

Free publicity? No, they gave tens of thousands of dollars to the antis, plus paid a lobbyist to get the exemption, so it wasn't free publicity. It was publicity, but the kind Anthony Wiener gets.

Name recognition? Yeah, but its like being recognized for being a member of a terrorist group or a person with a terrible communicable disease, like syphilis or AIDS, or contagious, God awful, never-ending, voluminous flatulence. People tend not to hang out with you.

A place in future business administration textbooks? True, its the chapter on what not to do when you screw the pooch, but future generations of entrepreneurs should learn something from the bloody awful decisions being made.

A new business model. That's it. They have a new business model... called Chapter 7, so no, not a benefit.

I've got it! They made Colt look like a agile, successful, well run firearms manufacturer.

The truth is both RRA and SA had better be in damage control mode and preparing to make a very public, unequivocal mea culpa complete with atonement for their actions or they are going to see a just how badly being on the wrong side of this issue is on the bottom line. And this is possibly the worst time in the last nine years to be in that position, so they'd better do it soon, and do it big because their competition is already salivating.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:
And this is possibly the worst time in the last nine years to be in that position ....

That is one of the most amazing thing about this, but what may be an even more damaging revelation that would have never received any attention if not for the first issue is the report of their supporting antigun politician(s), and especially the allegation that it was with the hope of increasing their sales by keeping the “panics” going. I could almost tolerate playing politics to avoid something like the licensing requirement if they assumed it was inevitable, but the other? Someone needs to be hung head down over a slow fire (figuratively, of course).

Is there any direct evidence to support this claim that SA, Inc and RRA intended to create some sort of panic over firearms in order to sustain sales?

Here's an article from Bearing Arms on this whole thing. In it the dangers of what they are trying to achieve with this bill, and an alternate view and a possible explanation of SA & RRA actions.

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/...sing-point-illinois/

quote:

Originally posted by Storm:
Here's an article from Bearing Arms on this whole thing. In it the dangers of what they are trying to achieve with this bill, and an alternate view and a possible explanation of SA & RRA actions.

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/...sing-point-illinois/

Interesting. Thank you

Are either of these companies large manufacturers of something else? About all I can think of, which justifies the large donations, is that someone needed help for a branch of business, more significant than gun sales?

quote:

Originally posted by Storm:
Here's an article from Bearing Arms on this whole thing. In it the dangers of what they are trying to achieve with this bill, and an alternate view and a possible explanation of SA & RRA actions.

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/...sing-point-illinois/

Oh a calm direct assessment of the situation well done

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:

quote:

Originally posted by Storm:
Here's an article from Bearing Arms on this whole thing. In it the dangers of what they are trying to achieve with this bill, and an alternate view and a possible explanation of SA & RRA actions.

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/...sing-point-illinois/

Oh a calm direct assessment of the situation well done

Pure spin. The fact is that the 2 companies hold 75% of the board of director positions, and are responsible for its entire budget. In other words, they know exactly what the organization is up to.

Additionally, if you don't like pay for play then move across the river into Iowa instead of buying into it. You keep most of your employees and get away from the corrupt Dailey political machine.

The only thing I agreed with is the most important thing is killing this in the Iliinois House since SA's and RRA's puppet already helped it out of the Senate.

quote:

Originally posted by Storm:
Here's an article from Bearing Arms on this whole thing. In it the dangers of what they are trying to achieve with this bill, and an alternate view and a possible explanation of SA & RRA actions.

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/...sing-point-illinois/

Thanks for posting, but he didn't convince me. I agree the focus for now should be killing this bill, but the two companies who made it possible for it to see the light of day still have some explaining to do.