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Fire begets Fire |
Thank You! "Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." ~Robert A. Heinlein | |||
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Jack of All Trades, Master of Nothing |
Where are you getting this information? I work with and treat Covid positive patients every single night I'm at work.[/QUOTE] I live here. I work in crisis intervention. I meet with people affected by the policies of these Anchorage hospitals (and the Soldotna one also). I hear directly from the people affected by policies and procedures. The denial of treatments, the denial of visitation, the way non-vaccinated people are treated or rather, not treated the same. The cancellation of needed procedures over political decisions of who will get care. I've met with people who've lost loved ones over this.[/QUOTE] It was a honest question as to where you are getting your information. You're right, I'm an RN in the ER and low on the totem pole. From what I have seen in the ER, no one has been denied care based on vaccination status. I don't know if that's what is happening in other departments or not. That's why I was asking because it is in contradiction as to what I have seen. We did have a case of a local politician that made headlines. A couple of other politicians got involved and it was a big movement and protest against the hospital I work at over his treatment. The aspects of that story that probably didn't make the news were his supporters overloading and blowing up our phone system. Myself and a physician were making calls on our personal cell phones that day trying to get a burn victim transferred to Seattle. Or how his supporters were trying to follow nurses in from the parking lot to enter the hospital so that they could bypass security at the main entrance. Or another one of his supporters who checked into the ER under false pretenses and was caught taking photographs and videos on a cell phone violating the privacy of other patients. There have been conversations in the nurses' station and break rooms and occasionally a nurse or a doc will go on a rant and make a statement of how we should be able to deny or limit treatment of the unvaccinated. These have just been a few isolated personal statements, not policies I have seen. My philosophy has always been we work in an ER, 90% of what we do is fixing other people's bad decisions. Be that not wearing a seatbelt, a diabetic non-compliant with meds or a Covid positive patient that is unvaccinated. Not our place to play God and pass judgement. That said I've seen and dealt with a lot of Covid positive patients that refuse to abide by things like wearing a mask while in the hospital, refusing to self isolate in their rooms, having my competence questioned, demanding treatments that they've read about on the internet, spouting conspiracy theories and literally cussed at, coughed on and spit on. Listening to rants of how it's all a government conspiracy and not real and yet here I am adjusting the levels on their high flow nasal cannula to keep them from going hypoxic. That's when things escalate very fast. Had a patient that was Covid positive decide to go help herself the beverage and snack station. Explained to her that since she was Covid positive she needed to self isolate within her room, that she had a commode in the room, that if she needed anything all she had to do was activate her call light, told her that if she couldn't abide by these very simple requests she would be asked to leave. Her response was, "Who do you think you are? Fucking Dr, Fauci? It's America, a free country and I'll go where I want when I want." Sorry ma'am, your freedom ends at the door to your room when I've got a kid we're fighting to keep out of respiratory distress in the room next door. She repeated the same behavior and was escorted out by security. That's where I've seen differential treatment. It's not from being Covid positive, it's from acting like an asshole and interfering with the care of others. Doesn't matter if it's Covid, drugs, alcohol or psych, reality is a non-cooperative or combative patient is going to be treated differently. Doesn't make it right, but it is human nature. Visitor policies have changed. It went from a very strict no visitors policy, to being relaxed with one visitor allowed in the room and now back to a no visitors policy. There are exceptions to that policy now, things like; end of life even with Covid patients, family members to act as advocates when the patient is unable to advocate for themselves, and family members to act as translators. I get it, it sucks for the family but on nights when we're full and there's 30-40 in the waiting room probably half of which are Covid positive, the last thing we need is additional people getting exposed. Not defending the policies that you are accusing my hospital of, just honestly asking because I have not seen it. The only thing remotely close was back in the fall when the Delta wave was at its peak, I did have a critically ill patient in need of surgery and ICU care afterwards requiring dialysis and a ventilator which were both in short supply. That case went through an extensive ethics board review concerning resource allocation and projected prognosis. The decision was made to follow the surgeon's recommendations for care and the patient was admitted to the OR and then ICU. Whether that affected another patient having access to those resources, I have no way of knowing. My daughter can deflate your daughter's soccer ball. | |||
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Jack of All Trades, Master of Nothing |
Thank you, I appreciate it. I’m just sick all of the Covid bullshit! I’m sick of all of the bullshit coming from both sides. I’m sick of all of the bullshit that I’m seeing on the news that doesn’t match with what I’m seeing at work. I'm sick of ridiculous statements being made to the point I've lost my filter. To say that no care is available when I have to check in a 19 year old to the ER who's only complaint that he needs a Covid swab is bullshit. It may not be the ideal situation, the doctor one wants or the treatment that one thinks they should have, but it is available. To all of the Karens of the world screaming about masks, ridiculing those that don’t agree with them and demanding further restrictions; if you hate freedom that much go wear you mask under a burqa. To all of those claiming it’s a hoax and not real, all I can say is that you’ve never zipped a body bag closed while wearing PPE. Yes, Covid is real, it sucks, it can be deadly, but it’s not the black plague of the middle ages. The real truth is somewhere in-between what the Karens and those against the vaccines are spewing, it can be difficult to obtain an objective view. I keep hearing on the news about the rise in Covid cases and that local hospitals are all operating at capacity. That’s usually followed by dire warnings of the system breaking down, nursing shortages or talk about how much more contagious the Omicron variant is. Then there’s stories of breakthrough infections of those already vaccinated. These are just my observations of what I’m currently seeing at work. I have no idea if my little corner of the world is representative of the lower 48 or the rest of the world. Yes, we’re seeing a rise in Covid cases now. They’re usually unvaccinated, we’re seeing it more in pediatrics now, and the symptoms are usually milder. It's not like it was during the peak Delta surge when we were putting several on a ventilator every night. For the most part, patients come to the ER and are discharged with only a few needing admission to the hospital. We have seen a few breakthrough infections, unfortunately a couple of those were nurses on staff. In those cases, the symptoms have been extremely mild. What we are seeing is huge increases in daily visits to the ER with patients having much lower acuities. Things like coming in for just a Covid swab when there's a drive-thru testing center literally across the street. The reasoning, "I'm concerned I've been exposed." Well that may be, but you've definitely become exposed to it now in our waiting room. My daughter can deflate your daughter's soccer ball. | |||
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Member |
Agreed 2000z. Why anyone would go to the ER right now with a non-life-threatening emergency is beyond me. (broken bones and stitches aside) | |||
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Fire begets Fire |
Free Obamacare … can’t refuse care; it’s the indigent healthcare system. "Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." ~Robert A. Heinlein | |||
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Member |
The ER becoming the healthcare provider for the indigent became prevalent long before Obamacare. 1986 was when the Emergency Medical Treatment And Labor Act was passed by congress and signed by Reagan. | |||
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Member |
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ That is correct. There are many conditions that do not require emergency care and those patients are generally discharged if they do not have the means to pay. It is not carte blance free for everyone. | |||
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Ignored facts still exist |
Bytes is 100% correct. Been an issue since long before Obama. Ask anyone who has worked in ER for a long time and they will tell you this . | |||
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Fire begets Fire |
Yes; I am well aware. Doesn’t mean what I wrote isn’t a problem. "Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." ~Robert A. Heinlein | |||
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Member |
Transplant patients are rather severely immunocompromised due to the drugs they must take to avoid rejection of the transplant. As a result their immune system cannot mount a viable response to many kind of infections. Without any vaccine or treatment the death rate from Covid for someone with a functioning immune system is was 4%, meaning 4 out of 100 died. Now that we've learned how to treat Covid somewhat effectively the death toll has dropped to under 2%. Those taking an anti rejection medication regime do NOT have a normally functioning immune system and I would expect a death rate approaching 100% from Covid. Now, a transplant patient could stop taking his anti rejection drugs and restore his immune system enough to fight off Covid. Bad news is the side effect of doing that is they will go into a full blown rejection syndrome and would most likely die of Sepsis. Finally it doesn't matter where you live, Transplant Centers will NOT waste an organ on someone who won't survive long term and is willing to make changes as required. As a result they will mandate Lifestyle, Mediation Adherence, and Vaccinations. If you don't want to meet these requirements then you wont get a transplant and someone else will have their life extended by those organs. Concerning the vaccination debate, spend some time with someone who has been spending time on the front line in an ER or ICU and you'll get an earful and none of it positive for the Anti Vax crowd. I've stopped counting. | |||
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Jack of All Trades, Master of Nothing |
Scooter 123, Thank you for posting that. My father received a heart transplant and I've worked with transplant recipients as a nurse. Totally agree with what you posted. Organ donations are too few and far between to take chances with. My daughter can deflate your daughter's soccer ball. | |||
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Member |
Yet in all of your commentary you never once touched on whether this man needing a transplant is Covid positive (he isn't from what I've read). Since the vaccines do absolutely nothing to prevent viral acquisition and spread there is no viable argument for this man to take the vaccine on that basis. I would also assume, being a transplant patient, he's in an isolation environment to insure he's protected from 'any/all' viral pathogens. Vaccine or not, with a severely compromised immune system associated with transplant surgery, 'if' he acquires Covid (again, the vaccines do nothing to prevent acquisition) its unlikely the vaccine would save his bacon anyway. If one reasons their way through this issue, there really is very little justification for forcing this vaccine (that isn't a vaccine) on this person. I made this very statement to a good friend who's one of the most recognized cardiac surgeons in Central Florida. IMO the medical community as a whole has lost so much credibility throughout this Covid debacle that huge majorities of the population no longer take their opinions and positions seriously. I know I count myself as a member of that community. ----------------------------- Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter | |||
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Shall Not Be Infringed |
Israel, Denmark and Australia, to name a few, are places where you could 'spend some time with someone who has been spending time on the front line in an ER or ICU, and you'd get an ENTIRELY different earful... ____________________________________________________________ If Some is Good, and More is Better.....then Too Much, is Just Enough !! Trump 2024....Make America Great Again! "May Almighty God bless the United States of America" - parabellum 7/26/20 Live Free or Die! | |||
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Fire begets Fire |
From Sweden, Norway, Ireland, … to South Africa And for published hospitalization statistics in the USA, I’ve seen it’s pretty much ~40 vaccinated against ~60% unvaccinated in beds. Some difference, but not enough to justify forcing people with natural immunity to still get a jab. "Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." ~Robert A. Heinlein | |||
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Shall Not Be Infringed |
^^^In the hospital 'WITH' COVID, or 'FOR' COVID? ____________________________________________________________ If Some is Good, and More is Better.....then Too Much, is Just Enough !! Trump 2024....Make America Great Again! "May Almighty God bless the United States of America" - parabellum 7/26/20 Live Free or Die! | |||
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Member |
I seem to remember the American Heart Association putting out a statement that the covid vaccines had sde effects that were detrimental to anyone with heart issues. Most of the cases of vaccine injuries I've read about are heart related as well.. It would make sense that anyone needing a heart transplant would avoid the vaccine. How is it all this is being overlooked in this case? Taking the vaccine could kill the guy. He could get covid after surgery with or without the vaccine. Refusing the transplant will kill him. | |||
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safe & sound |
You forgot the third option of caught covid while at the hospital. For a place that wants to restrict transplants based on a what if he gets it viewpoint, you'd think they'd have the spread within their walls under control a bit better. | |||
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Fire begets Fire |
Good points all. I thought it was for C19 but, … "Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty." ~Robert A. Heinlein | |||
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Member |
To those that are labeling all people who don't want this trial vaccine as "anti-vax". Please knock that shit off. Most people I know of (including myself) that are suspicious of the covid vaccine aren't against all vaccines. Labeling someone as anti-vax is a weak attempt to discredit them as crazy conspiracy theorists and its wrong. | |||
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blame canada |
Thank you. I'm anti-expirimental vaccine, but what I'm really is anti-vaccine mandates. IMO, those who believe a vaccine should be mandated and/or forced, are un-American. Some of you have reared your head in this thread, to you I say firmly, "fuck-off". ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "The trouble with our Liberal friends...is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan, 1964 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Arguing with some people is like playing chess with a pigeon. It doesn't matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon will just take a shit on the board, strut around knocking over all the pieces and act like it won.. and in some cases it will insult you at the same time." DevlDogs55, 2014 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ www.rikrlandvs.com | |||
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