So all of the Afghan "interpreters" we are rescuing...need interpreters?

+1

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by sigmonkey:
There is change of dealers and shuffling of cards happening, ,and the game is going to be different.

And something tells me none of that will be advantageous to the US or its ongoing safety.

This is true. But it will be realized looking back how better off the rest of the world is/was when the United States is the worlds military power and economic driver. I still believe when the United States sneezes the rest of the world catches cold. It may take many more years for this to bottom out. When it does is when this country starts its comeback.

quote:

Originally posted by sigmonkey:
Whether or not it was done as a deliberate "subliminal" message, I cannot know, but my "gut" reaction, is that "American allies" got a slap in the face and many of them have realized that they need to stand on their own feet.

I think we will see and hear of changes concerning defense and world affairs.

There is change of dealers and shuffling of cards happening, ,and the game is going to be different.

History tells us this.

Ironically it took Biden to drive home that message which Trump should have made clear, but couldn't deliver without shooting his own foot at every step by talking in terms of dues owed by America's allies, like the US was running some sort of protection racket. That probably went well with the domestic electorate which may have been the actual intended audience; but over here it put any move towards spending more on defense up against popular opposition to give in to the bully. Nevermind that the NATO target of everyone spending two percent of their respective GDP was agreed under GWB, formalized under Obama, and at some point each of the four German parties which have been in government over the last 20 years consented to it - somehow it became "Trump's two percent", a toxic issue to sell to the public.

There was lingering doubt about America's future reliability as an ally even after Biden's election, because everyone was aware that the war-weariness, increasing isolationism and political polarization Trump seized on hadn't just gone away. For the first months, everybody was being extra nice about increasing joint efforts to paper over the cracks, but something had changed. As somebody noted, a flippant remark by US Secretary of the Treasury John Connally in 1971 to his European colleagues that "the Dollar is our currency, but your problem" became part of the momentum to establish a common European currency a quarter century later. The combined Trump-Biden shock may do the same for common European defense.

There have always been Atlanticists and Euro-centrics in this field, for reasons beyond the financial aspects. The UK, Netherlands and others have been in the Atlanticist camp because they saw the strength of an alliance sharing common values including North America. France, which at one point left military integration within NATO, has long been the leader of the camp advocating greater independence of European defense from the US (quite likely, with themselves in the driver seat). Germany traditionally sees itself as a mediator between different camps in European politics, but if in doubt has been falling squarely among the Atlanticists ever since first post-war chancellor Konrad Adenauer chose NATO integration over Soviet offers of early reunification.

So it indicates some sea change when staunch Atlanticists from Adenauer's Conservative party now publically say that Germany must chose its future military deployments better according to its own interests, and not just follow the US anywhere - though not quite as drastically as their British counterparts, which is even more startling. Obviously any greater independence in defense will require not just more money, but also more political and popular support in general. How much the apparent current consensus among the four parties who are the likely basis for the next few governments, and between them represent about 70 percent of the electorate, lasts beyond the fresh impression of events and the September elections remains to be seen though.

As for the US, it has had contradictory expectations of its NATO allies ever since the Clinton administration: to take more responsibility and a greater share of the burden in common defense, but still follow the American lead when it comes to international security interests. Obviously it can't have allies both capable of fending for themselves and dependent upon it though. Afghanistan was kind of a no-brainer; the US was attacked, and even though the expectation behind NATO always was that the Americans would come to the aid of the Europeans, there was no question about going to war for them just like they would have for the four decades of the Cold War. Now Iraq was something entirely different, and I think this actually was were the rift started; it eroded support for US interventions both domestically and internationally.

The current Afghanistan debacle is the ultimate consequence. The rest of NATO actually wanted the mission to continue - not least since Europe will be much more exposed to the effects of failure, just like the increased terrorism and the refugee crisis which were ultimate results of Iraq. But it's hard to make the ally you went to war for extend the commitment when he has decided to quit; particularly when he provides 70 percent of the capabilities in the alliance. Nobody was going to tell the Americans "fuck you, we're gonna keep fighting for you even if you cut and run", despite an initiative by the British defense minister and some voices in other countries to that effect. Before that could happen, there need to be either more national capabilities, more European cooperation to achieve them jointly or, preferrably, both.

Banshee, that was the long way of saying you guys cut your noses off to spite Donald Trump. Big mean, meanie wouldn’t just keep paying for all of NATO’s protection. As I said earlier, every country that’s furious about Afghanistan needs to look at a mirror and reflect on their poor choice in backing Joe Potato.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mutedblade,

Joe Biden is half a potato.

quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:

Funny how they never even released a name associated with the strike. Or Biden making a huge press conference live in front of the American people. I smell BS also.

Experts question decision not to name ISIS terrorists killed in Afghanistan drone strike

By Jon Levine and Dana Kennedy
August 28, 2021 4:39pm Updated

Major Gen. William Taylor did not name the ISIS terrorists who were killed in the US drone strike in

The failure of the Biden administration to name the two Islamic State terrorists killed in a US drone strike in Afghanistan on Friday has led some experts to conclude they were not high-value targets.

In a press conference Saturday, Major Gen. William Taylor only referred to the dead targets as a “planner” and “facilitator,” and would not say if they played specific roles in the airport suicide attack Thursday that killed 13 American soldiers and 169 Afghans. Islamic State Khorasan, or ISIS-K, was behind the attack.

“Normally if they get a high-profile guy they like to name him,” retired US Army Lt. Col Brian F. Sullivan told The Post.

“They keep talking BS about ‘eyes over the horizon’ but I think a lot of this is the administration blowing more smoke,” Sullivan added. “They’re throwing this up as if the US is reacting with strength and power. So that makes the score something like ISIS 200-US two. Who are they kidding?”

Sullivan, an officer involved in the withdrawal of US forces from Vietnamese coastal cities in the 1970s, pointed out that by rapidly droning the alleged planner of the ISIS attack, “they must have known who he was beforehand.

“If they knew about this why didn’t they drone the sonofabitch beforehand? They are flat-ass lying to us .”

The ex-officer said it was also possible the names were concealed in order to land a bigger target down the line.

In a statement Saturday, President Biden promised more drone strikes targeting terrorists.

The Pentagon believes that “thousands” of ISIS-K fighters were set loose after the Taliban reconquered Afghanistan and released inmates from military prisons.

“I said we would go after the group responsible for the attack on our troops and innocent civilians in Kabul, and we have,” said Biden. “This strike was not the last. We will continue to hunt down any person involved in that heinous attack and make them pay.”

https://nypost.com/2021/08/28/...campaign=android_nyp

quote:

Originally posted by BansheeOne:
Atlanticists and Euro-centrics

So is this a phrase that you throw out with some regularity, or is this an uncredited opinion piece?

quote:

“If they knew about this why didn’t they drone the sonofabitch beforehand? They are flat-ass lying to us .”

...

Yep.
Operation: "Smoke Up Yer Ass"

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Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Joe Biden is half a potato.

Stop insulting potatoes !!

quote:

Originally posted by mutedblade:
Banshee, that was the long way of saying you guys cut your noses of to spite Donald Trump. Big mean, meanie wouldn’t just keep paying for all of NATO’s protection. As I said earlier, every country that’s furious about Afghanistan needs to look at a mirror and reflect on their poor choice in backing Joe Potato.

Thank you for posting this response. My sentiments exactly.

We didn't have intel about the quick takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban but within hours have intel on the planner of the suicide bombing.

Yeah, you can't fool all the people, all the time.

Total BS, Drone strike, you can’t fool everybody you Traitor.
.

My biggest concern is Hunter. What happens to him when the big guy has no influence

If warranted, please pull this out to its own thread.

Individual Heroism

There was an article on KNX1070 about one of the Marines from Norwalk who was killed earlier this week.

The story was about the Marines know all the people who helped the US and are Left Behind will be slaughtered like Lambs. Because of this, the mothers are trying to get their children out by handing the kids to Marines on the wall.

The Marine in this story was one who was receiving children (5 - 18 months?) and fell into the crowd.

During the ensuing confusion of the Marine falling, one (or the?) multiple bombers launch their attack.

This Marine also died after saving babies from the same fate - an early death by an evil actor.

Think about that this upcoming Labor Day weekend because that Marine was doing more than just his job.

quote:

Originally posted by lkdr1989:
We didn't have intel about the quick takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban but within hours have intel on the planner of the suicide bombing.

Yeah, you can't fool all the people, all the time.

Amen

quote:

Originally posted by marksman41:

quote:

Originally posted by mutedblade:
Banshee, that was the long way of saying you guys cut your noses of to spite Donald Trump. Big mean, meanie wouldn’t just keep paying for all of NATO’s protection. As I said earlier, every country that’s furious about Afghanistan needs to look at a mirror and reflect on their poor choice in backing Joe Potato.

Thank you for posting this response. My sentiments exactly.

Mine as well.

quote:

Originally posted by lkdr1989:
We didn't have intel about the quick takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban but within hours have intel on the planner of the suicide bombing after removing all intel sources/capabilities from the country.

Yeah, you can't fool all the people, all the time.

A small addition to you comments. And yeah, I'm 100% with you on this. This is nothing but pure BS by the Buyden clown show.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by lkdr1989:
We didn't have intel about the quick takeover of Afghanistan by the Taliban but within hours have intel on the planner of the suicide bombing after removing all intel sources/capabilities from the country.

Yeah, you can't fool all the people, all the time.

A small addition to you comments. And yeah, I'm 100% with you on this. This is nothing but pure BS by the Buyden clown show.

And I agree with this as well.