kg5388:

quote:

Originally posted by old rugged cross:
Besides resources who is behind them. What data are they after and who are they selling it to and for what purposes. I think we should be very skeptical. If there is nothing to hide. Why are they building them all over like there is no tomorrow.?

Oddly enough we all did well in all of those things without these data centers. This is nothing more than domestic surveillance writ large with the bogus claim of a better quality of life.

Anyone remember the Covid vaccines? People were coerced into taking them with the claim that your life will be better.

Not buying it.

I hope they all have massive failures and go up in smoke taking all of their precious surveillance data with them

I'm going to assume that's a joke or something.

Burn it all down make us the weakest country on the planet. There's no comparison of a building to an unproven medicine. It sounds like the people who destroyed the factory machines a hundred years ago or the unions that protest advancement. Whatever surveillance you are worried about would still exist, even if you attacked as many data centers as you could.

The best thing you could do if you are worried about surveillance would be to destroy you phone, your computer, and every electronic device you own even if not connected to the internet. Then join an Amish community.

Funny thing is that even the Amish were spied upon for producing uncertified raw, milk. They just sent in human assets and did it the old school way.

There's are numerous other reasons AI scares me other than the FBI stealing my grocery list. It's shocking anyone would actually want the US to become a third world country.

Data centers have existed since the 1960's. I did electrical work in them in the early 2000's the only real change over time has been efficiency.

Very well said, Jesse.

I’d be more supportive in general of data centers if their mega sized tech company owners would come forward and say they were wrong about manmade climate change. Tell the world they got it wrong. There’s nothing “green” about data centers and that’s fine, but those same tech companies are trying to tell me that internal combustion engines are going to be the end of the planet. It’s lunacy.

Also, how about putting these data centers in inner cities? There’s tons of abandoned factory sites in Detroit, Flint and throughout the rust belt. I’m sure there’s lots of available space in other big cities too. Why do they have to build campuses in undeveloped areas? Let’s use our land wisely.

There is a natural fear of the unknown. In Goochland County, the newest and the ritziest subdivisions are now going to be adjacent to a data center. Much consternation. 90 foot tall buildings will be permitted in a very suburban area. Generator noise has been restricted to certain hours only. Supervisors were harangued by citizens. Signs were hung, threatening to hang the horse thieves who are making the data centers.

We all want our lives to remain as we hoped they would be. Urban and urbane. Rural and bucolic. Suburban and safe. Any disruption, real or imagined, attacks our self-satisfaction. "I loved this neighborhood, now it's gone to h@ll in a handbasket with all the nearby apartments springing up."

There is also the general unease about what is coming. Is it the boogeyman? Is it disease? Is it the end of the world as we know it? Data centers have not, to my awareness, done much to describe their role in our generally Pleasant Valley sunrises. What is a data center? What is inside it? What does it do? Why does it need power? Why does it need water? What benefit do I realize from a data center? Is it truly to serve mankind, or is it "To Serve Mankind?"

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
I’d be more supportive in general of data centers if their mega sized tech company owners would come forward and say they were wrong about manmade climate change. Tell the world they got it wrong. There’s nothing “green” about data centers and that’s fine, but those same tech companies are trying to tell me that internal combustion engines are going to be the end of the planet. It’s lunacy.

Also, how about putting these data centers in inner cities? There’s tons of abandoned factory sites in Detroit, Flint and throughout the rust belt. I’m sure there’s lots of available space in other big cities too. Why do they have to build campuses in undeveloped areas? Let’s use our land wisely.

I agree with that. I'm not opposed to data centers, per se. But if the people in rural America don't want them, they could be put in North St. Louis, or Detroit, or Baltimore. All of those places could actually benefit from re-development. Yeah, I know, it's cheaper with raw land than removing all of the debris.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:

quote:

Originally posted by kg5388:
Who is behind them? People that want to be rich

What Data? Facebook, Amazon, YouTube, Google Maps, Waze, Roku, Netflix, online shopping, any search engine, booking flights and cruises and hotels, and all the data at your finger tips on your phone or computer has to be stored and retrieved from somewhere. Sigfourm is hosted somewhere.

Data and online information and services is in more demand every day and building new data centers is the only way to keep up with the demands.

What I would like to see is a complete ban, punishable by the death penalty, on any and all "data" harvesting. There was a time when a fella could go down to Monkey Wards and browse through their guns and tools and not receive reams of junk mail in their mailbox from the companies that made the things he was looking at.

Why is it OK to do that now? If I look up a pair of Rockport shoes on my work computer, every device that I am somehow associated with is inundated with Rockport shoe advertisements for weeks on end. This was never OK before and it should not be OK now. Frankly, I believe that it is an invasion of privacy.

Dick Proenneke had the right idea.

Are you ready to pay, dearly, for your google use?

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
I’d be more supportive in general of data centers if their mega sized tech company owners would come forward and say they were wrong about manmade climate change. Tell the world they got it wrong. There’s nothing “green” about data centers and that’s fine, but those same tech companies are trying to tell me that internal combustion engines are going to be the end of the planet. It’s lunacy.

Also, how about putting these data centers in inner cities? There’s tons of abandoned factory sites in Detroit, Flint and throughout the rust belt. I’m sure there’s lots of available space in other big cities too. Why do they have to build campuses in undeveloped areas? Let’s use our land wisely.

I agree with that. I'm not opposed to data centers, per se. But if the people in rural America don't want them, they could be put in North St. Louis, or Detroit, or Baltimore. All of those places could actually benefit from re-development. Yeah, I know, it's cheaper with raw land than removing all of the debris.

why do you think those spaces are empty today?

So, I think there's a valid idea to having to somehow pay for a use which has a short half life, and may make a real mess.

If we turn 10,000 acres of desert (serious, like something around Lubbock, or Columbus NM, etc) into a data center, something else may take advantage of the power supply, etc.

What are the environmental clean up costs? That was a major issue until O&G had to start posting bonds/is currently a major issue for all those solar panels on farm fields.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:

why do you think those spaces are empty today?

Mostly because the industry they were used for ceased to exist in the USA, old car factories in downtown Detroit such as the old Packard Plant, closed Textile plants in NC, GA, SC etc, plenty of old dilapidated locations that cities could provide those sweet tax breaks to companies to come in and revitalize an area.

They didn't close because it was a bad area, it became a bad area because they closed.



This would provide revenue via taxes and jobs to cities that need it, eliminate high crime areas by removing dilapidated buildings, and they can tap into the existing city power grid and water/sewage systems vs tearing up lush green fields or forests in the name of data processing.

Those high tech company CEO's should love to expend capital to fix up old city blocks with nice new high tech data centers and some generous tax breaks for build a plant downtown. And nobody will care if a generator cranks up in an old plant location...

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
why do you think those spaces are empty today?

Urban decay is a complicated issue.
The simple answer is that the businesses were no longer profitable. But there are many reasons for that, many of them caused by government such as over-regulation and high taxes.

In the City of St. Louis, the beginning of the end was enacting the city earnings tax, a local income tax, which started driving businesses out in 1950. St. Louis has suffered 75 years of decline.

That also coincides with the election of Democrats. The City of St. Louis has had a Democrat Mayor since 1950 as well.

quote:

They didn't close because it was a bad area, it became a bad area because they closed.

HRK: That's right.

HRK, that is an excellent point.

Might be some push back about "gentrification" or something/the local idiot who's always had a dream about some location or another. (There's always some, often with a relative in the city/county government.)

But it does seem like something of some genuine benefit - might need some kind of environmental protection, so the data centers don't have to take on liability from whatever was on the site before.

^^^ I grew up in the Upper Midwest (aka rust belt) and my hometown is a great example. Used to have a large auto plant and their constant shakedowns (taxes, public works improvements, public safety) drove that away. Also, used to be the world headquarters of a Fortune 500 company and after it went through a merger my hometown was not selected for HQ and one of the reasons was the history of shakedowns.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:

why do you think those spaces are empty today?

<Snip>
plenty of old dilapidated locations that cities could provide those sweet tax breaks to companies to come in and revitalize an area.

<Snip>

Could is doing a LOT of heavy lifting here.

[quote]There is a natural fear of the unknown. In Goochland County, the newest and the ritziest subdivisions are now going to be adjacent to a data center. Much consternation. 90 foot tall buildings will be permitted in a very suburban area. Generator noise has been restricted to certain hours only.

I remember when I moved to the Richmond area, about a month after 9-11. Short pump was only a few buildings and nothing was in Goochland, New Kent, Hanover, etc..

((We screwed up not buying lan..))

The cities around Durham are trying to put a moratorium on these devils, so what does Duck University do, they say screw you and are building huge one right off campus.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:

quote:

Originally posted by kg5388:
Who is behind them? People that want to be rich

What Data? Facebook, Amazon, YouTube, Google Maps, Waze, Roku, Netflix, online shopping, any search engine, booking flights and cruises and hotels, and all the data at your finger tips on your phone or computer has to be stored and retrieved from somewhere. Sigfourm is hosted somewhere.

Data and online information and services is in more demand every day and building new data centers is the only way to keep up with the demands.

Dick Proenneke had the right idea.

I agree but only young men can do that and survive and most men are not financially able to do that until they are old. I’d like to do that but my body will no longer allow me to.

Seattle has an increasing amount of empty business space available...

What have we decided? Satanic or no?

I'm in the definite no column

Sounds like the only thing worse than building new data centers in the US is not building new data centers in the US.