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Lawyers, Guns
and Money
Picture of chellim1
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quote:
I remember, it was before your generation started shooting up the schools David, even though we still had guns. Thank you for confirming..again…that it’s not the gun, it’s the person, and in particular you & your peers millennial culture.

That's awesome!


"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the law abiding that their rights depend not on their own conduct but, on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless."
- Lysander Spooner

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
Posts: 14188 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: April 03, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Once a Marine,
always a Marine
Picture of Ronin1069
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This is first full account I've read from the POV of Scot Peterson, the school resources officer who was vilified for not entering the building during the Parkland school shooting.

I recall prior shootings where multiple officers had been on site and were not permitted to enter a building until SWAT had cleared it....this was one man against an unknown threat. The article gives an interesting perspective...should he have rushed the building in the attempt of finding the source of the shooter(s) or was he right to lock down the building and attempt to direct police where to go.

At the end of the day, based on what I read, this man needs serious help or we will eventually read about him eating his gun.

'It was my job, and I didn't find him': Stoneman Douglas resource officer remains haunted by massacre


___________________________
All it takes...is all you got.
____________________________
For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
Posts: 9495 | Location: Belly of the Beast | Registered: January 02, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
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quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:

...should he have rushed the building in the attempt of finding the source of the shooter(s)...


YES. YES. YES.

I did not read the entire article, but as a Reserve LEO I took active shooter training a few years ago. We learned formations, clearing rooms, used sim rounds, etc. It was stressed that if we're the first one on scene YOU GO IN SOLO!

This guy was the school resource officer. Saving the kids was his job, and he failed miserably.
 
Posts: 13165 | Location: Eastern Iowa | Registered: May 21, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
A Grateful American
Picture of sigmonkey
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I read about half of it, but cannot take any more.

The article is a "way too long" excuse.

The guy sounds, even now after these months, as if he is still unsure of what he should have done, and what he did.

He has no more been able to make it a "teaching moment" in retrospect.

His first four years were as a SD but not sure exactly what duty he saw, and his remaining 28 was as the SRO, and it sounds as if he were at a country club environment with no threat (and no mindset of threat assessment or awareness).

It sounds as if he were asleep at the wheel for nearly 30 years.




"the meaning of life, is to give life meaning" I could explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
 
Posts: 37839 | Location: fl | Registered: December 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie
Picture of Balzé Halzé
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quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
Stoneman Douglas resource officer remains haunted by massacre.


And he ought to be. No one ever said being a coward was easy.


~Alan

Acta Non Verba
NRA Life Member (Patron)
Family, Guns, Country

"My guns are always loaded."
~R.G. Justified

What whiskey will not cure, there is no cure.
 
Posts: 20040 | Location: Out of Jersey, Into Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of lkdr1989
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This doesn't surprise me at all.

quote:
~More medics kept asking to go in and rescue wounded at Stoneman Douglas. They kept being told no.~

Inside Marjory Stoneman Douglas High children lay dying. Outside, the Coral Springs deputy fire chief repeatedly asked a Broward sheriff’s commander for permission to send his medics inside the school but was rebuffed.

“The incident commander advised me: ‘She would have to check,’” Deputy Chief Michael McNally wrote in a report released Thursday by the Coral Springs-Parkland Fire Department.


At the time, the shooter had not been caught, creating a dangerous situation for all but a handful of specially trained SWAT paramedics that already were inside.

But McNally kept asking for permission for additional medics, assigned to a Rescue Task Force, to go into rooms that had already been searched and found to be safe, to quickly extract and treat the wounded. Again he said he was told by the sheriff’s commander that she “would have to check before approving this request.”

Even after authorities saw delayed surveillance footage showing the shooter had fled the building, those Coral Springs fire-rescue forces were not permitted in. By the time the whole building was deemed safe for them to enter, there was no need — everyone had already been brought out by police or was dead.
What went wrong on the third floor in Parkland school shooting?

Reports of paramedics being kept, for their safety, from entering the school are another in a long line of miscues and missed opportunities in the Valentine’s Day tragedy that left 17 dead. The FBI and the Broward Sheriff’s Office had warnings before the shooting that the gunman, a troubled 19-year-old Nikolas Cruz, could shoot up a school but failed to intervene. An armed sheriff’s deputy based at the school took cover outside instead of storming the building to confront Cruz. And school officials and mental health counselors failed to hospitalize him for psychiatric treatment, despite serious concerns about his stability and his obsession with guns.

The latest records — some 80 pages — released by Coral Springs fire officials Thursday reveal more details of the chaotic response. One of the documents states the Broward Sheriff’s Office failed to set up an effective central command post, contributing to the confusion and frustration among the medics. The same issue was a problem in the January 2017 Fort Lauderdale airport killings — the last major shooting the Sheriff’s Office handled.

It’s clear from the reports that Coral Springs officials were butting heads with the sheriff’s office Parkland commander, Jan Jordan.

The reports released Thursday say Coral Springs’ Rescue Task Force medics were eager to get inside to help but were thwarted by Jordan. McNally said he asked six times for permission to enter “and my requests were denied.”

At one point, Jordan told McNally that specially trained SWAT medics were already inside the building’s danger zones but it’s unclear how many. An apparent argument ensued over the need for more medics, especially in safer areas that had already been searched and no bombs or gunman found.

Jordan could not be reached for comment Thursday evening.

A sheriff’s spokeswoman told the South Florida Sun Sentinel on Thursday that during an active-killer incident, medics are sent in after it has been confirmed that the threat is mitigated. She said more information will become available once all the facts are gathered in the criminal investigation and various state reviews of the response are completed.

Tony Pustizzi, the Coral Springs Police Chief at the time who has since retired, said Thursday that SWAT medics were in the building quickly but their purpose is to assist police officers in case one of them is shot. Naturally, if they see other victims they will treat them. He said SWAT medics from the Coral Springs Fire Department pulled at least two injured children out.

Paramedics had set up a staging area just outside the school at the corner of Pine Island and Holmberg roads. Victims were carried or driven there.

McNally, however, wanted more paramedics to go inside the school and was pressing Jordan for permission because she was in charge. He declined to comment Thursday, saying he’s not permitted to talk to the news media without department approval.

“What he said is true, it’s accurate,” Pustizzi said of McNally’s report. “He came to me and I tried to get a group to form up, but it was Broward County’s jurisdiction. We had to wait for an answer.”
Response to Parkland shooting lacked a 'unified command structure,' deputy fire chief says

The Coral Springs Fire Department put out a press release on Feb. 26 saying they could not speak for the sheriff’s office but believe that the Rescue Task Force paramedics were kept back because the Sheriff’s Office likely felt it wasn’t safe for them to go in, in accordance to how the response plan works.

“During the initial phases of this operation, we could not confirm that the suspect fled, had been detained or was confirmed deceased,” the press release states.

McNally’s report makes clear he felt the sheriff’s office had not set up a unified command structure, with leaders from each agency working side-by-side, including medics, the FBI and others, to coordinate the response and share information. McNally wrote that, as a result, “on several occasions, I would have to track down the incident commander to submit fire department requests.”

That concern seemed to be shared by an FBI agent on scene who, McNally wrote, also identified it as a problem. “The command post was inundated with too many people and made it impossible to establish and function under a unified command structure,” the report states.

In the aftermath of the January 2017 Fort Lauderdale airport shooting, the Sun Sentinel and the sheriff’s own reports identified the lack of a unified command post as a contributing factor to a disorganized response that left thousands of passengers stranded on the tarmac for hours over unfounded fears of a second shooter.

At Stoneman Douglas, McNally wrote, fire officials could not find out which structures had been cleared and searched. He also reported that his department learned of reports of more than 70 students in a drama classroom with unknown injuries. “I did not receive feedback when they were found,” he wrote.

The reports also show that the safety precautions that kept many paramedics out of the building also restricted the ability to airlift the wounded to area hospitals. Broward County told Coral Springs that the county’s air rescue crews would not fly patients “until they could confirm the shooter was down,” the reports state.

Palm Beach County Trauma Hawk was called and the Coast Guard to send their helicopters.

Coral Springs fire officials “wanted to get the helicopter in but they were told no by BSO originally,” said Pustizzi, the former police chief.

Cruz, who eventually was captured alive, had a high-powered rifle. “He could take out a helicopter,” Pustizzi explained.


http://www.sun-sentinel.com/lo...-20180531-story.html




...let him who has no sword sell his robe and buy one. Luke 22:35-36 NAV

"Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves." Matthew 10:16 NASV
 
Posts: 3209 | Location: Valley, Oregon | Registered: June 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thanks for posting that article. It shows Coward County Sheriff's Office was a clusterfuck from the top on down. The real sad thing, is they did almost the exact same thing over year prior to the Parkland Active Shooter incident at the Fort Lauderdale Airport Active Shooter incident. The report for that incident detailed the same failures by Coward County.
 
Posts: 2290 | Location: St.Louis County MO | Registered: October 13, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
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quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
At the end of the day, based on what I read, this man needs serious help or we will eventually read about him eating his gun.


“You know, in certain older... civilized cultures, when men failed as entirely as you have, they would throw themselves on their swords.”
 
Posts: 9244 | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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Thanks, lkdr1989, for that very informative report. The issue of medics entering “warm” zones is getting a lot of attention these days. I suppose that the refusal of the sheriff’s office on scene commander to let medical volunteers enter the scene might have been justified, but such a large agency’s incompetent response in general is mind-boggling. The failure to even establish a proper incident command in this day and age is just one more to add to the list of screw-ups. I passed on the link to several people who I’m sure will be interested in it.




“Most men … can seldom accept the simplest and most obvious truth if it … would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions … which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabrics of their lives.”
— Leo Tolstoy
 
Posts: 38267 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Ryanp225
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quote:
Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
At the end of the day, based on what I read, this man needs serious help or we will eventually read about him eating his gun.


“You know, in certain older... civilized cultures, when men failed as entirely as you have, they would throw themselves on their swords.”

Building better worlds.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You can do it your own way, if it's done just how I say."
 
Posts: 7132 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 04, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:


From the above link:

“They keep saying I did nothing,” Peterson said. “A coward.”

"They" are correct.
 
Posts: 13165 | Location: Eastern Iowa | Registered: May 21, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Unflappable Enginerd
Picture of stoic-one
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Awe, their taking a bus ride to register voters... Roll Eyes

Parkland Students Are Taking Their Activism on the Road This Summer With a 20-State Bus Tour


quote:
It’s not going to be a quiet summer off for the students of Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School. With the school year ending, many of the Parkland school shooting survivors are taking their political activism on the road.

The students are embarking on a two-month, nationwide bus tour dubbed March For Our Lives: Road to Change, the group announced Monday. They plan more than 50 stops in 20 states to rally young voters and campaign to end gun violence. They are also planning to visit every congressional district in Florida.

Parkland student Cameron Kasky and recent graduates Emma Gonzalez and David Hogg will join other classmates and young activists from around the country on the tour. The first stop is in Chicago on June 15.


More at link, but don't do it, it's a trick! (Hogg pics...) Yeah, this is "grass roots".


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I lost all my weapons in a boating, umm, accident.
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Posts: 3759 | Location: Headland, AL | Registered: April 19, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of mikeyspizza
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quote:
How fitting.
 
Posts: 2621 | Location: North Carolina | Registered: August 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of Ryanp225
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I hope they all get mugged or worse. Sometimes children need to burn the fuck out of themselves to learn once and for all that when dad says the stove is hot STFU and listen.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"You can do it your own way, if it's done just how I say."
 
Posts: 7132 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 04, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of dusty3030
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The twit circus are rumored to be coming here.
I'd love the opportunity to take them on a tour of real Memphis where a lot of my customers are. I've spent the better part of my work days for the last 20 years within 1/2 a mile of where the intersection is in this story. The twit circus is rumored to be coming here to hold their breath and stamp their feet that FedEx - the only thing that keeps this entire region from slipping off into the apocalypse - has a NRA discount. If I to have a chance to drive the twit circus bus around my Memphis I would pull over and drop them off on Crump and tell them to walk their ass the last mile or a little less to the tourist district so they aren't short changed and get the full Memphis experience.

https://www.fox13memphis.com/t...he-country/511910374


Straight shootin!
dusty
 
Posts: 3413 | Location: Memphis, mf'n, TN | Registered: August 13, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
:^)
Picture of BillyBonesNY
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Reading Petersens discussion of the events, it is evident he was confused and not in the proper frame of mind to intercede.

I was always taught, 2 is one, one is none.
It would possible have helped if Resource Officers were paired-up with a battle buddy.

A second officer would have provided a back-up in case the other officer failed, such as in this case.

No excuse for his inaction, antiquated procedures be damned.

What a pity.


----------------------------------------
http://lonesurvivorfoundation.org
 
Posts: 6776 | Registered: March 19, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of lkdr1989
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If I had the money, I'd start a marketing campaign that accuses these red guards of racism...I'd ask why they don't want law-abiding black people to have guns, is it because they (fascists) support the KKK. With their rhetoric & hate speech, they've already cranked the knob to 12...I'm pretty sure I could crank it to 20.

quote:
Originally posted by dusty3030:
The twit circus are rumored to be coming here.
I'd love the opportunity to take them on a tour of real Memphis where a lot of my customers are. I've spent the better part of my work days for the last 20 years within 1/2 a mile of where the intersection is in this story. The twit circus is rumored to be coming here to hold their breath and stamp their feet that FedEx - the only thing that keeps this entire region from slipping off into the apocalypse - has a NRA discount. If I to have a chance to drive the twit circus bus around my Memphis I would pull over and drop them off on Crump and tell them to walk their ass the last mile or a little less to the tourist district so they aren't short changed and get the full Memphis experience.

https://www.fox13memphis.com/t...he-country/511910374




...let him who has no sword sell his robe and buy one. Luke 22:35-36 NAV

"Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves." Matthew 10:16 NASV
 
Posts: 3209 | Location: Valley, Oregon | Registered: June 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
wishing we
were congress
posted Hide Post
way back on page 13 I posted a report that the video being monitored was a delayed video by over 20 minutes.

Some thought the shooter was still in the bldg. almost 30 minutes after he had left.
 
Posts: 11548 | Registered: July 21, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gracie Allen is my
personal savior!
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quote:
I'm pretty sure I could crank it to 20.

If you dig a bit back further in this thread, you'll see that black students at Parkland already tried to raise hell about the fact that what they had to say was being ignored so that some histrionic white boy whose daddy is an ex-FBI agent could suck up all of the oxygen in the room. The effort didn't do anything at all.

No, the thing to do is to find a way to stop the PR machine. Try logic with these little chattering airheads and they'll simply decide that ignoring you proves the depth of their faith in whatever it is they tell themselves that they believe in.
 
Posts: 21766 | Location: Deep in the heart of the brush country, and closing on that #&*%!?! roadrunner. Really. | Registered: February 05, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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quote:


"It was my job, and I didn't find him".

Finding something or someone implies you have to look, typically by moving around to change your viewpoint after not finding it in the first place you looked.

Hiding against a wall isn't "looking", so it's no surprise he didn't "find" anyone.

Fucking coward.
 
Posts: 38814 | Registered: July 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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