Still no excuse for a tractor to be on the physical race track driving into traffic with that kind of spray. Gasly could have easily been driving on the left side cooling his tires and have a head on collision before seeing the tractor.

Here’s an interesting analysis over the Fucking Incompetent Assholes:

This isn’t an either or issue.
Both the driver and the officials or organizers had some serious explaining to do.
To say Gasly is somehow being unfairly criticized or penalized is total b/s and my earlier post shows why I say this. His part was easier and more quickly apparent and that’s why he has already been punished. His part is much clearer and more easily judged. He simply ignored the standards required of drivers under the existing rules that have been in place for decades, especially hard to understand because there was no real urgency to catch the field with a long safety car period expected. He had already seen where the incident occurred and should have been aware of the need to be extra cautious. Even less urgency existed to catch the field once the red came out, showing the race was being stopped.
The narrative that he only had a second or less between the flashing light and his arrival is just not true as shown on the in car video. A longer video showing the earlier part of the lap may have shown even more warning but we haven’t seen that part. Much like the police body cameras, the camera distorts what he was seeing due to the wide angle view.

Part two is the FIA or organizers shortcomings and that’s what needs to be answered next, but after the real reasons are known.
It could be that race control instructed the equipment to move onto the track or it’s possible a lower official or worker took that decision on themselves to speed things up and violated the rules. Too early for us to know yet. Either way, the FIA has at least some responsibility because that would show a break in the decision making process at the very least.
This second part involves many more people and processes and therefore time. I don’t think this will get swept under the rug due to all the publicity and people involved.

There are also some basic equipment issues that are already clear and need to be address for any conditions, even in clear weather. One is the warning lighting standards on the safety vehicles. Probably some others too.

Except Gasly has a delta lap time he needed to hit and he was 9 seconds under that time.

quote:

Originally posted by DanH:
Except Gasly has a delta lap time he needed to hit and he was 9 seconds under that time.

But is that delta lap time different for wet conditions than dry? I don’t think it is. 9 seconds below a dry lap time in extreme wet conditions may not be safe either. Also, Gasly got a 20 second penalty and 2 penalty points for driving too fast under red flag conditions. The race was actually red flagged just before he got to the tractor, but he really didn’t have time to react. Still, he kept his foot in it after he should have known the race was red flagged, and got penalized.

This doesn’t excuse the stupidity of the FIA of having a tractors and marshals out on the track in these conditions, even with the SC (The SC actually lead the pack past the in-progress recovery shortly before Gasly got there), but Gasly wasn’t entirely blameless, even though he was under the delta. It was too fast for the conditions.

quote:

Originally posted by DanH:
Except Gasly has a delta lap time he needed to hit and he was 9 seconds under that time.

That's another issue they need to address for the rain. The green flag pace was 20 seconds or so slower but the delta remains the same? He was going about the speed he would have under green in those conditions and he had full wets on at that point.

Not to mention Gasly's lack of common sense that driving to catch the pace car as if it was about to go green (it wasn't) and on a dry clear track (it wasn't) didn't apply here. Add to that the last 1/4 mile before the wrecker was under a obvious flashing red flag and he didn't lift for the later ones even after that until his team mentioned it to him. He appeared to be unaware that the red was out at all.

I suspect the pit lane start followed by catching the banner had him flustered and he was driving like he was out of his mind under those conditions.
I suspect Red Bull is happy to see him gone from their program at the end of the season. The only mystery is why they kept him when it was clear for several seasons that they had no intention of ever promoting him. He's often no better than Yuki's pace and judgement and that's not a high benchmark.

Aside from that, the restarted race was very good. probably more real racing than the usual hour and a half would have had.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 220-9er,

Gasly is very hot and cold. He’s like a worse version of Perez. I seriously think they were keeping Gasly around in case Perez fell back into the midfield like every other Red Bull driver since Ricciardo left.

In other news, Red Bull, Aston Martin, and Williams have been found to violate the cost cap:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/...-cap-rules/10382787/

Long of the short of is Red Bull had a “less than 5%” overspend that they’re appealing, Aston Martin had a procedural error (paperwork), and Williams copped a fine for being late to turn their paperwork in. Since Red Bull is appealing, there’s nothing listed about punishments.

Just watching the race now. I had it recorded on my dvr. For some reason it didn’t record Singapore

quote:

Originally posted by nhtagmember:
Just watching the race now. I had it recorded on my dvr. For some reason it didn’t record Singapore

I have lost the last half of the Singapore and Suzuka races. The DVR recorded the tv time allotted and not the 3 hour window of the race.

quote:

Originally posted by redstone:

quote:

Originally posted by nhtagmember:
Just watching the race now. I had it recorded on my dvr. For some reason it didn’t record Singapore

I have lost the last half of the Singapore and Suzuka races. The DVR recorded the tv time allotted and not the 3 hour window of the race.

This is where I'm really happy with YTTV, it grabs the whole broadcast regardless of what channel it's on & gets the overage too.
The only times it's missed is when the title of the program is different & doesn't get caught in the DVR.

quote:

Originally posted by redstone:

quote:

Originally posted by nhtagmember:
Just watching the race now. I had it recorded on my dvr. For some reason it didn’t record Singapore

I have lost the last half of the Singapore and Suzuka races. The DVR recorded the tv time allotted and not the 3 hour window of the race.

I have wishlist recordings set up for Formula 1 on my TiVo (yes, I’m an old guy, still use cable and TiVo) and normally pad the recordings. I have it set up to add 1 hour to all of the recordings (used to be +30 minutes, but found out a few years ago that wasn’t always enough), but for Japan, I added an extra half hour the day before. It was just enough to get through the race and the podium. Occasionally, my wishlist misses something, but I’ve taken to look through my scheduled recordings before the race weekend starts to make sure it’s all there. There was a race recently that I had to manually add. May have been Singapore.

If you have almost any cable service you can log in to ESPN app and watch these as associated provider. As well as the pre and post race coverage ESPN typically drops in football season.

For races with extended red flags, etc. this is the only way to see. I had an extra hour set on our DVR recording for Japan, and it clipped off with about 12 minutes to go in race. Swapped over to app, all good.

RE: Gasly
That was a pretty scary incident, we finally got to watch last night.
I can see both sides, that Gasly knew the Ferrari was disabled there & shouldn't have been carrying so much speed (and was penalized for it), but the marshals shouldn't have had any equipment on track until the track was neutralized, especially with the reduced visibility.

You'd think of all tracks, after Bianchi, they'd be more cautious at Suzuka in inclement conditions.
The lights on the tractor weren't nearly as bright as the rain lights on the cars.

Can someone also explain why it seems that almost every time they are recovering with sling/tractor it looks like 4 bubbas from 'bama trying to sort this out for the first time? No consistent approach, and almost universally with one or more hangin onto the front wing directly or with a line, often while the tractor is driving TOWARDS them? WTF?

Sure it's another design element no team wants but putting a small loop on rear of car and having the recovery teams have a tether that's proper length to partially stabilize car directly to the tractor seems it would help. Maybe even something similar on front, but that's probably more sensitive.

Beyond that more than one connection point and marshal trying to wrestle a swaying/swinging suspended vehicle in motion from nearly underneath it seems....... logical?

I guess since they're volunteers, it's not a 'normal' thing for most people & not something easily trained.
Wonder if a secondary tether point could be added on the DRS actuator & a redesigned tether that would keep a suspended car more stable. Would probably add too much weight with reinforcing it enough to handle the strain that teams would veto it.

I have always wondered why they dont just quick winch it up onto a flatbed tow truck. The thing is a lot faster at getting there, picking it up and getting out of the way.

NASCAR uses it

I'd be curious if you could winch it onto a flatbed, or if you'd need one with a crane to lift the car into the air & onto the flatbed.
Can't imagine the latter would be much quicker than the existing method.

Thinking that since they sit low to the ground, winching would destroy the nose and rear diffuser underneath the car.

quote:

need one with a crane to lift the car into the air & onto the flatbed.

They have these at some venues and they seem to solve all the problems except also being able to drive in the gravel, thus tractors in play some too.

Shit it's F1 - the local towing company(ies) would probably love to have the opportunity to get some free visibility by letting their trucks be use, with or without their people.

The whole thing just feels so bush-league.

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:

quote:

need one with a crane to lift the car into the air & onto the flatbed.

They have these at some venues and they seem to solve all the problems except also being able to drive in the gravel, thus tractors in play some too.

Shit it's F1 - the local towing company(ies) would probably love to have the opportunity to get some free visibility by letting their trucks be use, with or without their people.

The whole thing just feels so bush-league.

I think it was Baku where the crane hit an overhead & leaked hydraulic fluid all over the car?

Our first USGP in 17, Grosjean went off right in front of us & the car was hauled off on a flatbed wrecker, but we didn't see how it was loaded.
I'd assume, regardless, it would have to be lifted onto the truck due to low clearance with the front wing & rear diffuser.

I've thought about applying to marshal the USGP, for the 'free' tickets, but haven't looked into it seriously.