Manners

Rogue,
Great reference, but sadly, when most cops look at the vault, they freak out about the size, so I think the 6000 or 7000 will still be around as they are perceived as smaller and....kind of are? It's certainly not as wild as some seem to think it is, since I have all three, but I also think a. cops carry what they are issued. b. If there is a shown improvement, they may be willing to bear the extra kit.

That said, I feel fine with plenty of other guns in a 6000 or 7000. Stacking a dingus on the trigger or a not precocked striker makes me feel a bit better though I'm sure anything can be argued if we think about it enough.

Shoot, that was my nice version. I guess I gotta recalibrate again.

quote:

Originally posted by Anubismp:
Great reference, but sadly, when most cops look at the vault, they freak out about the size, so I think the 6000 or 7000 will still be around

Oh, I totally agree. And I'm not saying that the Vault is the answer, or that everyone will switch to the Vault.

They've already demonstrated with their new Solis that they could do a 6XXX/7XXX-style holster with a fully covered trigger, by only making it for WMLs that are no wider than the frame.

So once the thin/compact WMLs catch up in capabilities, Safariland can introduce a newer version of their 6/7 series that eliminates the giant tunnel for the current large cylindrical duty WMLs.

quote:

Originally posted by 92fstech:

Glocks DO have NDs caused by trigger incursions in the holster.

I am acquainted with a SIGforum member who incurred "Glock Leg" while re-holstering during a Gray Guns training session. As always, safety is a major concern with Gray Guns; the reholstering process was observed by at least one instructor, and there was NO finger on the trigger. It turned out that the culprit was the drawstring of a windbreaker type jacket.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Once they perfect compact WMLs that are no wider than the width of the slide/frame but with the full brightness/throw/battery life of the current large duty WMLs, that will be the final nail in the coffin of this "gun bucket WML tunnel trigger guard gap". (The newest ones like the TLR-7 HL-X are getting there, so I suspect it won't be many more years.)

Why should I have to buy a new light and holster for a problem that seemingly only manifests itself around one handgun brand? I happen to really like the 6000 series and the X300 Turbo. Most of this problem seems to be around theory that sells more or someone else’s holster for non SIGs.

The 6000 series holster vastly predates the 320. But I can’t remember 20-25 years of buzzword problems with the design and lights used to be way bigger than they even are now.

Thanks for that link to the Vault holster, Rogue. I'm surprised I hadn't seen that because I was just looking at different holster options a few months ago. Your post prompted me to go back out and check the Safariland site...that one is indeed listed there, as well as another one I've not seen before called the "Ballast". Both unfortunately appear huge, but the 6360 isn't exactly small either. Do you have any personal experience with either of these two models? The "Ballast" midel appears to have a piece specifically designed to eliminate foreign object ingress into the trigger guard..I'm curious how well that works in real life.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
There you go again. You are quite clearly implying they just go off by “stepping out of a vehicle” or “touching the gun butt”.

Looks like you're having a hard time understanding what I'm saying.
Okay...I'll put it as simply as I can for you. If P320s aren't going off without a trigger being pulled, they must be going off because something is getting into the holster. Since these are the only pistols out there without a grip/manual/trigger safety, they look to be more prone to being discharged by debris/objects/side pressure from the holster.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
You sound like the typical internet goofball. If you keep repeating the same nonsense enough times you believe it to be true.

This is why nobody takes your input on this seriously. You just can’t help yourself. “I’m not saying they just go off”. Then immediately, “they just go off”. No. They don’t.

You need to relax and stop letting my posts live rent free inside your head. You are far too emotional.
We are only expressing our opinions here. We'll let members decide what input is useful.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
Posting pictures of sigs shitty free holster has no bearing on this topic.

Yes it does. Especially when you post something like this and believe a company needs to be sued for making a wildly dangerous holster as you put it.

"If somebody deserves to be sued, it is Safariland for making a wildly dangerous holster for duty use."

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
I’ve had probably a dozen of those holsters or more. They end up in the trash because they are trash. Honest question since I think based on your comments the answer is no. Have you ever owned or worn one of the wml Safariland duty style holsters being discussed? I say no because if you had you would know you don’t have to jam anything into the trigger guard area. On my 6000 series I can put my finger on the trigger without even touching the holster. It’s that big. Your pictures are like that guy who screwed a deck screw into the frame to prove his point. It’s silly. As shitty as sigs free holster is, you can’t drop a roll of dimes into the gap. Safariland duty holsters you can. It’s that bad. It’s why I ate a $150 holster, horrendous design. Makes SERPA look well designed.

You've had a dozen of these tactical WML holsters that ended up in the trash? I'm impressed. I guess it takes some of us longer to learn from our mistakes. I'm not in your league by any stretch. I've only had a few light bearing holsters. The latest is a Safariland Solis that does a really good job covering up the trigger on my G47. I got it free.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
That dumbass security guard was screwing with his equipment and caused an ND. He then had the exact same thought as that murderous airman, “I can blame it on the gun because everybody knows they just go off”. Reprehensible behavior all around.

While we're at it, can you explain how you came to the conclusion that the USAA officer was screwing with his equipment and exhibited reprehensible behavior from watching the USAA Austin video?

quote:

Originally posted by 92fstech:
Do you have any personal experience with either of these two models?

I've fondled the Vault, but don't have any actual training reps with it.

The Ballast is new to me.

Am I seeing this right? It appears to have a sliding cover (possibly spring-loaded) that fully covers the trigger area and down onto the grip, but looks to be able to be pushed forward to establish your full grip while drawing.



Edit: Looks like it's a hinged spring-loaded cover. Starting at 7:07:

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Once they perfect compact WMLs that are no wider than the width of the slide/frame but with the full brightness/throw/battery life of the current large duty WMLs, that will be the final nail in the coffin of this "gun bucket WML tunnel trigger guard gap". (The newest ones like the TLR-7 HL-X are getting there, so I suspect it won't be many more years.)

Why should I have to buy a new light and holster for a problem that seemingly only manifests itself around one handgun brand? I happen to really like the 6000 series and the X300 Turbo. Most of this problem seems to be around theory that sells more or someone else’s holster for non SIGs.

The 6000 series holster vastly predates the 320. But I can’t remember 20-25 years of buzzword problems with the design and lights used to be way bigger than they even are now.

Not about one handgun brand.
It's about the cavernous opening around the trigger area when holstered that some holsters have.
If you have to go hands-on with a perp, they can reach in and pull the trigger on whatever is in the holster.
Not handgun brand specific.

The WML Trigger Gap
There's a video by a firearms instructor with about 10-12 cops wearing their daily rigs.
The instructor had an assistant go around and reach the trigger on most of them.

quote:

Originally posted by DirectDrive:


Not about one handgun brand.
It's about the cavernous opening around the trigger area when holstered that some holsters have.
If you have to go hands-on with a perp, they can reach in and pull the trigger on whatever is in the .

lol. Yes it is. You seem to be pretty desperate to blame anything but the 320.

When in fact, my unit points guns at people almost daily. Gets into fights at least a couple times a week. And there are zero problems with the 6000 series and Glock. You’d think if the problem was with the holster, it would show up widely on the street. Matter of fact, I don’t know of a single incident statewide. And the 6000 series is king and the state is 80 percent Glock. Not a single instance. Not. one. And yep, I have had people try to disarm me as recently as last month in a fight with a guy high on ‘shrooms.

And most of the social media influencers that bad mouth yhe 6000 series also strangely seem to be sponsored by Alien Gear. Weird, no conflict there.

quote:

Edit: Looks like it's a hinged spring-loaded cover. Starting at 7:07:

Yeah that's what it looks like. I'd like to get my hands on one to try it in person.

We've been using the 6000 series since 2017 with no NDs. It's a very robust holster...we've only broken one that I know of and that was in DTs with no gun in it so when the officer landed on it it got crushed. I've been picked up and thrown around by mine with a blue gun in it and it's still going strong. It is possible to force a finger in there and get at the trigger on my duty gun, but it's certainly not easy, and actually downright painful to do it. Some of you guys must have pretty small fingers.

Think about this-

JSOC issues the 6000 series almost exclusively. And all the Rangers, ODAs, SEALs, Recondos do not report the dreaded buzzword “holster intrusion”. And they swim, crawl, jump, and so on without their Glocks mysteriously going off in the holster. Everything from HAHO jumps to skull draggers. Nothing.

And look at it in police use. The holster just isn’t the problem.

^^ Pretty sure they're not issuing Pistols w/ Weapon Mounted Lights to 'all the Rangers, ODAs, SEALS & Recondos'! The problem is with holsters designed for the 'double-wide' battery compartment to accommodate two CR123 batteries side-by-side that's a feature on most WMLs.

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
^^ Pretty sure they're not issuing Pistols w/ Weapon Mounted Lights to 'all the Rangers, ODAs, SEALS & Recondos'! The problem is with holsters designed for the 'double-wide' battery compartment to accommodate two CR123 batteries side-by-side that's a feature on most WMLs.

Yes a lot are. Welcome to 2025.

The holster is not the problem. You guys really need to find another thing to blame. Maybe the ammo. It’s the ammos fault because if the gun was unloaded it wouldn’t have went off?

Perhaps you might give me some first hand experience of the last time you went “hands on” wearing the 6000 series holster and the non-SIG went off due to something the holster did or failed to do? Last fight I was in was Wednesday. Gun and holster performed as expected. You?

And the invitation expends to anyone. This is not a issue outside of theory.

You guys made me pull mine out. It’s a 6354DO. Whatever that means. It’s fabric wrapped, has the optics cover, and is made for an X300. I put my Gen 5 and my Gen 4 in it (don’t know why I did both). I have medium sized hands in every glove I have ever been issued or bought. I can take my index finger and pull the trigger and not touch the holster body. It is a gaping maw of a hole. I believe a Glock would “probably” be safe to carry in it maybe. That being said I took one look at it years ago and said “this is a fucking retarded design”. Maybe I got the lined up Swiss cheese hole model but mine is scary wide open. Which is a shame because other than that it is a kick ass holster. Maybe in the spirit of 320 ND’s I’ll karma it away to somebody who doesn’t mind extra holes in the walls, floors, companions.

Yep, please send me all of these mean, hateful and dangerous holsters before it is too late for you.

Whatever. I’m posting the facts as they exist. I own an as from the factory 6354 that you can stick your fucking finger into and reach the trigger without fucking touching the holster body. Which I just did twice with 2 separate Glocks a few hours ago. You can pretend these are brilliant designs with no drawbacks. If you can stick a finger in the holster while the firearm is seated properly that is a fucking design flaw regardless of how many times you went hands on last month. This shouldn’t be a tough concept to grasp. And you are now no longer invited to my karma. lol

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
And you are now no longer invited to my karma. lol

And here I am apparently one of the few that would give this dangerous miscreant a good home. And you could have the satisfaction when it finally knocks over a liquor store I would be a fault for not heeding your warnings.

Well there is that. Ok, you’re back in. Lol