quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
the sky is the limit, with President Trump becoming the ultimate lame duck

This is my Hope and Dream- Donald Trump Unleashed. It's probably the Democrats worst nightmare.

If you think the first 2 years were great, buckle your seatbelt if this comes true.

I think one of my concerns is that the whole justification for the attacks on Iran were that Iran was imminently about to obtain a nuclear weapon. Based upon reports from testimony from Tulsi Gabbard, whom I trust substantially, I don’t know that American intelligence was co,pletely certain of this. I have no doubt that President Trump believed that Iran was on the brink of obtaining a nuke, but if our intel sources weren’t sure that means that the intel had to come from someplace else which basically means Israel. I’m sorry but I just don’t completely trust Israel. They’re allies and I want to help them but it doesn’t mean that I trust them without reservation either. Some of their recent actions, including ones that even President Trump had reservations about, give me cause for concern.

I think that it would have been better to attack Iran after the midterms, and I don’t think anyone disagrees. The only thing in my estimation that forced us to act sooner was Israel and their intelligence apparatus. At the end of the day, if the timing of the attacks were flawed because we were manipulated then the blame is still going to fall upon President Trump, it’s just the nature of the beast. The only problem is that we can’t afford to lose seats in the midterms so Trump’s performance, or more accurately the perception of his performance, is critical so I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to be concerned. I think in reality we need to move past Iran FOR NOW, make sure we do well in the mid terms and then we can re-examine the Iran situation in the future. I think any plan that gets Iran out of the news right now, even if it’s not such a great deal, must be undertaken. I also don’t fault conservatives from distancing themselves a bit from Trump on Iran as it’s not a particularly popular situation with the American populace. At the end of the day Trump is going to need both houses to continue making progress so the folks in congress also need to do what they can to secure a conservative majority.

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
I think that it would have been better to attack Iran after the midterms, and I don’t think anyone disagrees.

I disagree.

The War Powers Resolution Act

That's all that needs to be said.

The negative nancys are out and about lol. We decimated their ability to wage war. Their economy is set back decades. All while we have 0 boots on the ground. We WON. Get over it.

We won it the way we won the barbary wars, or Quasi-War.
Want WWII results? Pay the WWII price.

quote:

Originally posted by SevenPlusOne:
We won it the way we won the barbary wars, or Quasi-War.
Want WWII results? Pay the WWII price.

Yes, the Barbary pirates extracted tolls and bribes from European & American shipping. We paid $1.25 million by 1797.

After the wars, no tolls were paid. I hope the same can be said of this war.

Bomb them more.

And then what?

We have an opportunity to get their enriched uranium out of the country. You think bombing them some more is going to make that happen?

What are we trying to achieve?

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
I think that it would have been better to attack Iran after the midterms, and I don’t think anyone disagrees.

I disagree.

The War Powers Resolution Act

That's all that needs to be said.

That’s a fair counter point, but didn’t President Trump conclude operations before 60 days anyway? Other than a ground war, I don’t know that the war powers act really stands very far in the way of limited operations. SCOTUS has never really ruled on the limits of the war powers act, so it seems like President Trump’s assertion that 60 days of combat had passed and active “combat” had concluded, which would have allowed for him to re-engage for another 60 days if warranted.

My only real concern is keeping conservatives in Congress and solidifying much of what President Trump has already done. War is not generally terribly popular and higher gas prices are very unpopular. Any action in the Middle East has the potential to drive oil prices up. When Trump’s mandate largely came from people wanting help with Biden’s inflation I just feel like absent a clear imminent threat any military action in the Middle East should have waited until after the midterms. I realize that might not be everyone’s opinion but that’s my only real concern that I figured I’d add to the discussion.

Either we commit to a 50 year societal restructuring- and probably end up killing them off like we did to the Germans and the Japanese,
Or we sort our own house, lead by example and get them to free themselves - while absolutely keeping their military weak.

It shouldn’t just be nukes, it should be a goal to keep them weak enough to die at the hands of native patriots.

But, ever since Wilson and FDR, I think we haven’t been comfortable with encouraging that much liberty.

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
...higher gas prices are very unpopular. Any action in the Middle East has the potential to drive oil prices up.

People parrot this ad nauseum, but they either have short term memories or intentionally ignore 2022 gas prices and their "impact" on the midterm.

2022 was even higher prices with an even higher change in prices:


Republicans were supposed to have a red wave because there was drooling drooling, incompetent, moron in the White House and the gas prices were through the roof. However, the house was a tiny gain and the senate was a loss:


Turns out that only 46.2% of eligible voters bothered to get off their ass and vote in 2022 midterm which was a decrease from 50% in the 2018 midterm. Except for a few congressional seats, the biggest factor in an election outcome is whichever party gets its base voters to the polls and the fickle middle has little to nothing to do with it.

Is endless speculating on Israeli intelligence that no Sigforumite has ever seen, playing Trump shoulda woulda coulda, etc. going to get Republican base voters to the polls in November?

The sad reality is that we argue over "facts" that may not be true. Neither side has an interest in telling the truth.

Here is an interesting video about Iran that I chanced across.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vuS-71v7VA

Usual disclaimer : Use critical thinking skills as everyone is selling an agenda

Considering inflation, gas prices were much higher in the past. $4.50 today was like $2.50 not that long ago.

Iran Declares the Strait of Hormuz Closed Again After US Lifts Blockade. Is Israel fucking DJT?


https://ground.news/article/be...-hormus-street-again

quote:

Originally posted by downtownv:
Iran Declares the Strait of Hormuz Closed Again After US Lifts Blockade. Is Israel fucking DJT?

No, Iran is f*ucking DJT and the entire peace process by using Hezbollah to provoke Israel. Either Iran can't really control Hezbollah from shooting rockets into Israel, or they are purposefully using them to keep stirring the pot.

Until Iran either gets their Hezbollah bitches in line or delinks the situation in Lebanon from the MOU, this is going to be the status quo for awhile.

No. Hezbollah started it. The IRGC and hardliners in Iran didn't want the MOU. There's a power struggle within Iran between the IRGC and the nominal President and his faction who negotiated the MOU.

This is the IRGC sabotaging the MOU intentionally. They believe their god favors them and instructs them to continue pursuing the End Times. The linking of Lebanon to the cease fire gives Iran cover for not complying.

This writer on Facebook has an interesting piece this morning. The article isn't up anywhere else that I can find, so apologies for the FB link. It is a long read. Look for "From Confusion to Clarity", posted today June 20.

https://www.facebook.com/clayton.wood.338

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfr...dkt_nbr=0105042vvdg7

CENTCOM Says Hormuz Traffic Continues Despite Iran Closure Claim

U.S. Central Command said Saturday that commercial ship traffic continued moving through the Strait of Hormuz, hours after an Iranian military command claimed the strategic waterway had been closed.

In a statement, CENTCOM said 55 merchant ships transited the strait on Saturday, carrying more than 17 million barrels of oil and other cargo to global markets.

"Safe passage through the international waterway remained intact today," CENTCOM said.

The statement came after Iran's Khatam al-Anbiya Central Headquarters said in a Telegram statement carried by Iran's Tasnim News Agency that the Strait of Hormuz had been closed because of what Tehran described as U.S. violations of the recently signed memorandum of understanding and Israel's continued military operations in Lebanon.

Iran's military command warned that additional measures could follow if what it called "continued aggression" persisted.

Despite the Iranian announcement, CENTCOM said U.S. forces remain in the area.

"U.S. forces remain present and vigilant to ensure all aspects of the agreement with Iran are adhered to, obeyed, and in full force and effect," the command said.

The Strait of Hormuz is one of the world's most important energy shipping routes, carrying a significant share of globally traded oil and liquefied natural gas.

Iran wants be able to use their proxies to attack Israel deal or no deal. Iran doesn't play by the rules of international norms. Killing those who aren't Shia as they move toward the ultimate apocalypse is their path. Israel will not allow Iran to rocket their country and not pay a price. Israel want peace, Iran has repeatedly said they want to wipe Israel off the map. American left buys into this idea not knowing the US is another target as they have been murdering Americans for decades. President Trump needs new advisors who know the history if Islam and the Middel East. If long lasting peace is to e achieved it means the theocratic dictatorship in Iran must fall. Templet is how the WWII ended. We bombed Germany, we burned Hamburg and Dresden to the ground, with allies our military invaded, when Germany unconditionally surrendered we located the Nazi leader, put nooses around their necks and hung the bastards. Then denazified the government and helped rebuild the country. Until Iran's current government is crushed there will be no peace. Bibi Netanyahu understands this. Other Middle Eastern government understands this. For reasons unknown the US doesn't.

Iran's IRGC reminds me of the alien they actually sort of spoke with on the 1996 movie Independence Day:


"We can find a way to coexist. Can there be a peace between us?"

"What is it you want us to do?"

"Die... Die"


To the IRGC I'd say, you first.

quote:

Originally posted by abnmacv:
Iran wants be able to use their proxies to attack Israel deal or no deal. Iran doesn't play by the rules of international norms. Killing those who aren't Shia as they move toward the ultimate apocalypse is their path. Israel will not allow Iran to rocket their country and not pay a price. Israel want peace, Iran has repeatedly said they want to wipe Israel off the map. American left buys into this idea not knowing the US is another target as they have been murdering Americans for decades. President Trump needs new advisors who know the history if Islam and the Middel East. If long lasting peace is to e achieved it means the theocratic dictatorship in Iran must fall. Templet is how the WWII ended. We bombed Germany, we burned Hamburg and Dresden to the ground, with allies our military invaded, when Germany unconditionally surrendered we located the Nazi leader, put nooses around their necks and hung the bastards. Then denazified the government and helped rebuild the country. Until Iran's current government is crushed there will be no peace. Bibi Netanyahu understands this. Other Middle Eastern government understands this. For reasons unknown the US doesn't.

Exactly this. But unlike WII, we are afflicted with the American Left and a sea of subversive foreigners; some of whom are in congress and State government. What you describe needs to happen if we are to rid the world of these rabid unshakable mass murderers. But the enemy is inside the wire and calling the shots. So if we take Iran, it will be after they are an almost invincible force which will require orders of magnitude more casualties to defeat. Better to pluck the weed while it’s vulnerable……if only we could bring ourselves to do it.