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Originally posted by mark123:

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Originally posted by PASig:
I was referring to church Elders, it's mentioned in the Bible several times by Paul and others as the early Church began.

what about head and assistant pastors? I just can’t seem to recall any person or group given authority over another.

Are you trying to pick a fight with me?

Go to church or don't go to church, it's your choice dude.

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Originally posted by PASig:
Are you trying to pick a fight with me?

Go to church or don't go to church, it's your choice dude.

Yikes. Sorry.

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Are you trying to pick a fight with me?

Go to church or don't go to church, it's your choice dude.

Mark was asking for your thoughts on head and assistants pastors.

Mark, I have found the below to be a good resource.

Senior Pastor

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Originally posted by SW_Sig:

quote:

Are you trying to pick a fight with me?

Go to church or don't go to church, it's your choice dude.

Mark was asking for your thoughts on head and assistants pastors.

Mark, I have found the below to be a good resource.

Senior Pastor

Thanks. That’s a good answer. I’m not certain I completely agree with it but I’m going to think on it.

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Are you trying to pick a fight with me?

Go to church or don't go to church, it's your choice dude.

Yikes. Sorry.

Well, I apologize if I came off too strong there.

There are numerous Bible passages speaking about shepherds and leaders and elders in the new church during the era of Paul and the other apostles.

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Originally posted by mark123:

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Originally posted by PASig:
… We really like that it's got an actual structure with head pastor and assistant pastors and ELDERS as the Bible commands. …

As a growing Christian may I ask where a church hierarchy is commanded in the Bible. This would help me to weigh my local options.

Besides that, I’m glad you brought this thread back up because just yesterday I talked to a member of the church I left about 6 years ago. He was in my small group at that church and he asked if I was still attending. Regardless, we had a friendly chat and I just mentioned that I was dissatisfied that no one had answers to questions we have and we think much of the modern church has gone astray. He was taken aback and I think that’s ok. I challenged him with a couple of questions to prove or disprove biblically and we went our separate ways. We remained friendly and I’d talk with him again.

Elders and the term Deacons have evolved as the corporate governing body of a local church in most denominations. They serve as the equivalent of the Board of Directors and is required for any corporation in the US whether for profit or nonprofit including churches.

In the bible, you can see the hierarchy in the early church. Local churches looked to the disciples who started the church and their peer group. 1 Timothy was Paul's letter to Timothy. Paul met Timothy in Act 16:1. He became Paul's representative to several churches (1 Corinthians 4:17 and Philippians2:19). In 1 Corinthians 4:17 Paul talks about sending Timothy in advance of Paul and Paul refers to his authority over the local church by asking them if they would rather he come with a rod or a spirit of gentleness.

Timothy was a pastor over the church of Ephesus when 1 Timothy was written to him. Paul warned Timothy of people who might try to teach blasphemy (1Tim1:20). He encouraged Timothy to not let himself be looked down upon because of his youthfulness (1 Tim 4:11). It's also in 1 Timothy where Overseers, Deacons, and Elders are talked about.

Lastly, Acts 15 shows the hierarchy in church when there was debate about some doctrine (Acts 15:1-2), the local churches sent a group with Paul and Barnabas to go to Jerusalem to get a ruling from the apostles and elders. They met on the issue (verse 6) and came up with a ruling (verses 22-29).

Having a governing hierarchy is a good thing to keep people accountable although it's not a failsafe (you can read about Hillsong's failure in its top leadership along with the other church scandals like Jim Bakker, etc.). They had governing bodies but it wasn't enough.

The ideal is a governing body of people with the same values and interests but different perspectives and power (actual or implied) not concentrated in anyone. Each person in their roles serves like a check and balance to keep anyone going off the deep end and keeping the church moving forward in its goals.

ETA (after reading the rest of the thread that occurred while I was composing my post):

Senior pastors and associate pastors are just titles that translate from pastors and elders. Some may argue that Deacons were only for serving widows and such but if you look at their qualifications, they had to be exemplary Christians. Hence deacons are what the lay people who make up the local church's governing body is called. Elders are referred in 1 Timothy as being worthy of double honor which implies they got remunerated for their services in contrast to the deacons. So the elders would be where the paid ministry staff fall under - associate pastor, children's pastor, worship pastor, etc. But what you call them are just titles; what's more important is what they do. And that includes the people sitting in the pews.