quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
... this entire incident occurred because someone's ego didn't allow him to simply get on with his life, and instead he had to follow the shitty driver escalating the situation.

^^^^^ This.

quote:

Originally posted by sigmonkey:
If I were looking at this as a jurist. (with only what I know from this video)

The issue of following Rivera might not be the smart decision, but at the point that Rivera produced a deadly weapon, had the guy presented his firearm and "stopped the threat", I would vote to acquit.

I probably would.

Yes: Cutting people off in traffic is a dick move. Especially cutting-off two-wheelers. But the biker essentially created the confrontation that resulted in the threat.

IMO they both should have been arrested.

Btw: Michigan has a Stand Your Ground law, and immunity from civil action related to exercising your SYG rights. But that all goes away if you use lethal force to defend yourself from a fight you started.

quote:

Originally posted by vinnybass:
Florida man...

My takeaway from this is twofold:

Don't do this stupid stuff.

Practice your draw.

Agree with practice the draw ...

Evidence is with the motorcyclist on the video tape ... once the guy swung the knife was the time to draw and cap the 10 ring. Rivera was in the danger distance of a guy swinging a knife.

Though the shot would be justified, best practice is not to get into this situation in the first place.

Yup. Avoid this stuff as best you can. No point in escalating it. It's a no-win.

If knife dude was serious, biker dude would have been badly cut before getting his gun out.

Never get out of the boat.

In my younger days I would get pissed. The last 25 years, on the rare occasion
it was my fault, I would wave to them to try to tell them I'm sorry. Their fault,
let it go.

A few years ago a retired local cop decided he'd been cut off and probably had, but chances are it was accidental.

Anyway, he starts following the vehicle that had cut him off and when it had to stop for a red light, he hopped out of his car, ran up to the vehicle that cut him off with his gun drawn and pointed at the vehicle. This was about a mile and a half from my house.

The driver pulled out his own gun and center punched the retired cop...DRT.

D.A. called it a good shoot, which it was. I would have done the same thing under the same circumstances.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

No, this entire incident occurred because someone's ego didn't allow him to simply get on with his life, and instead he had to follow the shitty driver escalating the situation.

Absolutely.

I spent 30+ years commuting in Chicago area traffic. One thing I developed in all that time was to be very tolerant of bad drivers.

Whatever they did, I smiled (grimaced) and got on with my life. Screaming, flipping them off, much less following or confronting them, wasn’t worth it.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
But the biker essentially created the confrontation that resulted in the threat.

Completely wrong. The biker could follow that boob all over town and it would not be the biker's fault. Simply following someone after one of these incidents isn't the brightest move given current culture, but it shouldn't incite a confrontation. The dipshit in the truck could have dialed 911 if he was concerned, and eventually pulled into a parking lot where police were waiting. All of this in on Rivera.

quote:

IMO they both should have been arrested.

And what exactly would the biker be arrested for? Following with the intent to annoy? Drawing a firearm on a knife wielding man who'd threatened him with it? Come on. The biker guy showed incredible restrain in dealing with that mental midget who'd lost his mind.

You asked what I would have done? I would already be at home sipping a Coke Zero.

This has been hashed over many times but I guess not enough. If you choose to carry you have to make a decision to avoid conflict. If conflict finds you then that’s one thing. If you seek conflict then you are putting everyone’s life in danger.

Don’t follow the guy. If you somehow think it’s necessary then you better be on the phone with the cops because otherwise you are just looking for trouble. While armed.

Ego needs to be put in your back pocket if you choose to carry.

Just skimmed the video, lesser events have lead to death, no question about it.

I also think if you can stop short of shooting(as able) it’s much less messy.

Filming is a good idea, the knife swing was caught on tape. I’d almost be content to stop there & get him charged, follow through.

If I was cut by his knife, I’d be emptying my magazine.

Yes, don’t have all the scoop with the foolishness that lead up to it. A motorcycle rider(s) is much more vulnerable with other idiots around.

Have my suspicions about the biker with brass knuckles…

quote:

The biker could follow that boob all over town and it would not be the biker's fault. Simply following someone after one of these incidents isn't the brightest move given current culture, but it shouldn't incite a confrontation.

I agree with this, but will also follow up with a question. How was he followed? There's a difference between followed (changed direction with intent to go out of your way) and followed (both going the same way, one behind the other).

I think the biker is good in either situation, but if they were both going to Walmart and ended up in the parking lot he's beyond good.

Follow him? On a bike? Nope. And gun would have come out as soon as the knife appeared. No conversation or allowing the knifer to close with me.
Poor judgement on everybodys part here.
And what are the priors on all involved?

quote:

Originally posted by Aglifter:
Have my suspicions about the biker with brass knuckles…

Wait, what? I missed that detail.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
And what are the priors on all involved?

I know I shouldn't, but when I read 'Rivera', first thing that popped into my mind was, is the guy even legal to be in this country? I assure you, if he is illegal, the Orlando Slantinel would never report on that.

quote:

Originally posted by radioman:

quote:

Originally posted by Aglifter:
Have my suspicions about the biker with brass knuckles…

Wait, what? I missed that detail.

It is in the article Artie posted on page one.

Most incidents like this are more accurately described as "When two assholes collide."

quote:

Originally posted by bigwagon:
Most incidents like this are more accurately described as "When two assholes collide."

Exactly ... saying when I was work as an LEO, "If not for stupid, I would be unemployed".

Not a good idea to follow an asshole who cut you off in traffic, IMO.

That said, in Arizona where MANY motorcyclists carry a gun, that knife swinging clown would have been shot.

The biker following was primarily resposible for escalating the incident. Guy gets out of truck with knife threatening biker? Or biker says I'm going to kick your ass and approaches truck, then driver exits truck with knife? Two very different scenarios, but of course the truck driver did not need to leave the truck.

Then biker moves agressively toward truck driver, and truck driver responds with the knife swing to try to maintain distance.

A lot of stupid to go around, but not slam dunk on the truck driver. With decent lawyer, I think his charges are lowered or dismissed.