quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
Other allies in the region that we can trust, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Israel

Go home troll.

ISIS remains an evil force in the world, and they've had a good day when two of their adversaries start bombing each other.
It is not inconceivable that the recent and the 2013 Sarin attacks were launched by ISIS using captured Syrian stocks that they overran. It would be no problem to combine binary weapons at the site of a conventional Syrian attack and then have the world blame Assad as the usual suspect. We just don't know for sure.
If the U.S. now decides to continue manned bombing attacks on ISIS in Syria we will need to eliminate Assad's air defense. ISIS wins again.
How will Putin react? That's another thing we don't know.

Susan Rice had been out of the news for 20 minutes or so...then chemical weapons used in Syria

The weapons Obama got Syria to give up "voluntarily and verifiably"

quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
Also, ISIS won't take over as we can send in at least 150,000 ground troops at anytime to maintain order until a Democratic government is setup.

You kind of need a populace that wants a democratic government, wants it bad enough they're willing to sacrifice themselves and their loved ones to establish and defend it. I'm skeptical you'll find it there. Too many competing interests and belief systems unwilling to let majority-rules at the ballot box determine how they live their lives, I think.

My heart goes out to the Syrians who just want to live their lives and raise their families in peace, but you can't just install the government you think they should have and expect it to maintain power. Many there would despise us for imposing our system of government upon them.

quote:

Originally posted by MTJbyrd:
ISIS remains an evil force in the world, and they've had a good day when two of their adversaries start bombing each other.
It is not inconceivable that the recent and the 2013 Sarin attacks were launched by ISIS using captured Syrian stocks that they overran. It would be no problem to combine binary weapons at the site of a conventional Syrian attack and then have the world blame Assad as the usual suspect. We just don't know for sure.
If the U.S. now decides to continue manned bombing attacks on ISIS in Syria we will need to eliminate Assad's air defense. ISIS wins again.
How will Putin react? That's another thing we don't know.

Except for the fact that we tracked the aircraft who launched the chemical attack, monitored the results of the attack, and that is why we know which air base they flew from. Not everything is a conspiracy theory.

quote:

Originally posted by BamaJeepster:
monitored the results of the attack

I would be interested in seeing proof from a US source instead of Turkey or the White Helmets.

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:

quote:

Originally posted by BamaJeepster:
monitored the results of the attack

I would be interested in seeing proof from a US source instead of Turkey or the White Helmets.

Pentagon released the info. What they did not confirm (how would they know anyway?) is if the plane was carrying conventional or chemical bombs. My bet is on conventional bombs hitting the rebels stock of whatever they stole or were supplied with.

Sometimes the simple, non-conspiratorial answer is the best one; namely that the Assad government used gas on its citizens. Further, Trumps response MAY BE no more than telling Assad one way in which he may not wage war. As far as it being done by one of the rebel groups? Well, where did they get the chemical weapons if not from a stash not declared by Assad?

As far as 150,000 troops on the ground to set-up a democracy? Hell no! Democratic forms of government come only from within the society itself, driven by the belief of a sufficient number of its people who are willing to sacrifice for an ideal. Not going to happen under Islamic or tribal systems ever.

Silent

Perhaps I'm not understanding- some of you are suggesting that the release of Sarin gas was due to conventional bombs striking stockpiles of gas on the ground? Is this what some of you are suggesting?

Nikki Haley is noting that Russia was a co-guarantor of removal of poison gas supplies from Syria. Were they complicit, or duped by Syrians?

Satellite images (on Fox News) of damage make it appear pretty extensive and complete.

quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
Our intelligence agencies determined that Assad ordered sarin bombs to be dropped on women and children. Other allies in the region that we can trust, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Israel came to the same conclusion. I doubt the rebels allied with us on the ground would be in possession of such weapons. Also, ISIS won't take over as we can send in at least 150,000 ground troops at anytime to maintain order until a Democratic government is setup.

You're nuts man. I don't want our kids coming back in body bags or missing parts. Fuck that. You go fight against Assad if you want. 80 people dead in a very crappy way doesn't mean shit to me, other regimes kill their own people faster than that. Hell I bet 80 N. Koreans will die of starvation today. He keeps ISIS occupied. Nation building sucks, and no one wins.

quote:

some of you are suggesting that the release of Sarin gas was due to conventional bombs striking stockpiles of gas on the ground?

that is what the Russians are saying

maybe the Russians need a diversion for this:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/s...=2017-04-07-12-48-20

Senior military officials say the U.S. is looking into whether Russia participated in Syria's chemical weapons attack earlier this week.

They say a drone belonging either to Russia or Syria was seen hovering over the site of the chemical weapons attack Tuesday after it happened. The drone returned late in the day as citizens were going to a nearby hospital for treatment. Shortly afterward, officials say the hospital was bombed.

The officials say they believe the hospital attack may have been an effort to cover up evidence of the attack.

wouldn't be the first time Syria tried that trick

http://www.reuters.com/article...-syria-idUSKBN1782S0

Satellite imagery suggests the Shayrat air base that was struck by dozens of U.S. missiles is home to Russian special forces and military helicopters, part of the Kremlin's effort to help the Syrian government fight Islamic State and other militant groups.

Not what I'm suggesting, though others might be. Simply pointing out that these chemical weapons most assuredly came from the Assad government and were not declared because the government wanted to keep some for future use. It seems certain that they were dropped via Syrian planes. If not,say a rebel group captured them and was storing them for future use, Assad's intention to use them is made manifiest by the action his government took to hide them in the first place. Either way Trump's response strikes me as appropriate. After all, Assad has a demonstrated history of using chemical weapons against his citizens (a thing that Bathists do). So, why would some rush to support his version instead of our governments? Not sure on that one.



Silent

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Is this what some of you are suggesting?

I would like information from an impartial source. It wouldn't really change my mind though. Gassing ISIS isn't much worse than firebombing and nuking Japan. Syria is in a life or death struggle with insane murderers and rapists. It's not going to be pretty.

Fox video

says 20 Syrian planes damaged

some damage pics

all 59 missiles hit within 3 minutes

one Tomahawk failed

http://video.foxnews.com/v/538...5001/?#sp=show-clips

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
I would like information from an impartial source. It wouldn't really change my mind though.

Good grief.

I don't even know what to say.

You let us know when you have satisfactory information from what you deem impartial sources.

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:

quote:

Originally posted by BamaJeepster:
monitored the results of the attack

I would be interested in seeing proof from a US source instead of Turkey or the White Helmets.

You want the US to release to the public our intelligence capabilities?

A. Either it went down as reported by the administration or

B. Our intel people intentionally falsified the data and convinced SecDef Mattis and the entire US military leadership and the president and his NSC and convinced him to order a strike knowing all along that it wasn't Assad's planes that dropped it.

C. The intel showed it wasn't Assad, but SecDef Mattis, the entire US military leadership, the president and the NSC all colluded to cover up the intel and order attack on Assad anyway.

You actually believe B or C?

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Perhaps I'm not understanding- some of you are suggesting that the release of Sarin gas was due to conventional bombs striking stockpiles of gas on the ground? Is this what some of you are suggesting?

That is a possibility, albeit a very remote one. We have no idea how much the Syrians lost to the SAA and ISIS, so it's possible someone had a sarin-filled projectile squirrelled away unaware of what it was, and a conventional bomb opened it releasing the contents.

I can't see how Assad and his henchmen thought using one chemical round was good idea. All of them, maybe. But one? The battlefield wouldn't be exactly tipped in their favor.

We finally have a decisive POTUS and what do I get to see in this thread? Pissing and skepticism.

Oh, I can't even begin to tell you how very unwelcome this is. If you only knew. From the heart, I'm telling you to take it elsewhere. Do it for both of us.

quote:

Originally posted by sjtill:
Nikki Haley is noting that Russia was a co-guarantor of removal of poison gas supplies from Syria. Were they complicit, or duped by Syrians?

Satellite images (on Fox News) of damage make it appear pretty extensive and complete.

I am very impressed with Nikki Haley!