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Originally posted by RAMIUS:
If those bums want to get high, they can buy a gallon of cheap whiskey or some Nyquil from the local store for a few dollars.

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Originally posted by RAMIUS:
Buying weed is not cheap, legal or not.

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Originally posted by P220 Smudge:

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Originally posted by Modern Day Savage:
- A number of deaths attributed directly to pot, including at least a few cases of violent death. These are largely due to the extra potent marijuana edibles like sweets, chocolate, candies... as well as the synthetic forms of pot.

The rest of your post was very logical and thought out, but this bullet point, I've got to question. You got any links to back up this assertion? There's no LDL for anything in cannabis, I can't speak for the synthetic stuff. Deaths directly attributed to marijuana? These would be the first I've ever heard of.

As to the rest of your post, I live near SeaTac, so I've seen all that same stuff here, too. The "homeless" showing up when pot got legalized first there, and then here, didn't show up just because of the legal pot. They showed up because of our fantastically liberal social programs and the fact that cops won't hassle homeless junkies here. Until last fall, I spent the prior three, almost four years working right in the heart of downtown Tacoma, next door to a medical grow house, and across the street from two weed shops that opened when the law passed. We had junkies before that, and yeah, they multiplied quickly. But Seattle, Tacoma, Denver, Boulder, they're all super liberal strongholds, and the first to legalize it. So the influx of human garbage wasn't a surprise to me, and I think it's really not looking at the whole picture when you lay all this stuff at the feet of legalized weed. There's a whole big picture here with our little corners of the country and what they're decided to do.

I just don't feel like homeless junkies are the metric for this issue, they're their own separate problem that isn't being handled correctly, either.

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Originally posted by BBMW:
I don't think that even if the Republicans supported Marijuana legalization, it would get them any votes.

It's my observation that people with specific traits tend to have specific political leanings. People who are into Pot tend to lean left. So even if the Republicans give them what they want on pot, they still won't vote Republican based on other issues (economics, other criminal justice issue, guns, education, etc.).

There may be good functional reasons for the Republicans to support Marijuana legalization, but I don't think it will flip many voters to their side. In point of fact, it could be a net loser for them.

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Originally posted by Ryanp225:
Replace "pot" with "firearms" and see how you feel.
So one person owning something you don't agree with is grounds for the gov to step in a ban it?
Some of y'all have a lot of soul searching to do if you even care about being honest.

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Originally posted by bigeinkcmo:

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Originally posted by Modern Day Savage:

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Originally posted by HayesGreener:
Medical marijuana has legitimate uses but having seen the effects of chronic MJ use many times over, I am convinced that states will rue the day they made recreational marijuana legal.

For many years, on the subject of illegal drugs, I took a libertarian attitude. Mind you, I don't partake myself and see drug use as a waste of money and health. At one point I was in favor of legalizing all drugs, with the caveat that any who partake be held wholly responsible for their behavior and actions while using the drugs with no public money allocated for their criminal or health issues.

I'm not in favor of sin taxes for any legal product- alcohol, tobacco, guns, drugs and when the legalization of pot in Colorado came to a vote I didn't like the bill as written due to the exorbitant way in which it was taxed...BUT thinking that the voters wouldn't actually pass it I thought that I would send a message of freedom and limited government by actually voting for it. I was a bit surprised when the legalization of pot was voted in.

Since pot has been legalized I've seen the repercussions on a local and weekly, if not daily basis.

A while back I took a temporary part-time job working as a booth attendant at a public parking garage. The booth was near a busy downtown area with lots of car and pedestrian traffic and was situated near a small quaint park. Mind you while pot is legal in Colorado, several municipalities have elected to not allow its sale in their jurisdiction. Also, it is prohibited to smoke pot in public, and yet in a city where it is not legal to buy I would see/ smell several who would smoke it in public, often in the park. My first day on the job we had one guy walk up to our booth and ask if we would mind if he smoked pot in the park with his friend. While I appreciated that he was courteous enough to at least ask, I didn't want to smell or otherwise be affected by it and told him I couldn't tell him what to do I didn't want to be near it.

Public smoking, often by homeless people, although they were certainly not the only ones. On a weekly basis I would encounter drivers/ passengers leaving the garage who would come to the booth freshly stoned. Why some felt the need to get stoned before driving I couldn't understand but there was no mistaking the pungent smell coming from their vehicles or, in some cases the bloodshot eyes, as well as the general confusion and giggling they displayed over a relatively simple transaction.

And its not just one park. I've seen and smelled pot being smoked in several parks and numerous other public places.

Since pot has been legalized in Colorado:

- I've noticed a significant increase in the homeless population and all the problems they bring to an area.

- A significant increase in the number of drivers impaired by pot while driving. The driver of a pot tourism bus was just arrested for being impaired while driving the bus while his passengers smoked pot.

- A number of deaths attributed directly to pot, including at least a few cases of violent death and murder. These are largely due to over-doses on extra potent marijuana edibles like sweets, chocolate, candies... as well as the synthetic forms of pot.

- An increase in the number of children who show up in emergency rooms or in school either on edible pot or who brought it to school. They see their parents eating the pot candy and grab some for themselves and their friends.

- Illegal grows. Some are small operations, but there have been several large illegal pot grow operations, many operated by drug cartels, including some from outside the U.S.

- Whether in an apartment or home, having to smell pot being smoked by a nearby neighbor. Yes, this occured before it was legalized but there is no doubt that it happens with much greater frequency now.

When I voted to legalize pot I has visions of freedom, states rights, removing just one example of government over reach and intrusion into our lives. I had visions of taking the tax revenue from pot and putting it to good use by reducing our state debt and improving our infrastructure. I had thought that those who chose to smoke pot would be so grateful for this new found freedom that they would exercise good judgement and would courteously and responsibly use pot only in their basements and home garages and backyards and would take care not to allow children to have access to it.

Well, as far as tax revenue, there is no doubt that the state is taking in HUGE sums. But, while pot tax revenue was supposed to go to schools the Democrats still show up every election year with new tax increase proposals to fund public schools and several district's teachers recently had walk outs that closed down schools while they protested for more school funding and better pay.

Infrastructure? We have many portions of interstate/ state/ local highways and roads in need of major maintenance and improvement. One portion of the local interstate that needs to be widened to lessen traffic congestion has been on hold for years due to funding issues and was only recently approved...as a toll road, so pot tax revenue isn't helping out here.

Also, our state pension fund, while not as dire as some others, is still in jeopardy and deeply underfunded...and nope, pot tax revenue is not helping out here either.

So, when I add up the Pros and Cons, I see a lot more negatives since pot has been legalized in Colorado.

What I've come to realize is that while in theory I believe in freedom and less government influence and intrusion into our lives, there is a caveat. For freedom to work, it must include responsibility. For freedom to work it must rely on a moral people, a courteous people, a civic minded people to exercise it. I'll be the first to acknowledge that we have many pot users who fit this description, but I've seen far too many examples of those who do not.

If the vote were held today, knowing what I know now, I would vote against the legalization of pot.

Regarding whether the Republicans should push to support pot legalization...when you support something you not only "own" all the "positives" but when things go badly you "own" all the negatives as well. I'm not sure that the Republican Party wants to own all the negatives that come with the legalization of pot.

I agree with a lot of your feelings as far as the quality of life here and some of the assessment of the changes that CO has gone through, but it's important to at least acknowledge CO has been gaining ~75k new residents PER YEAR since 2000. That's a decent size city worth of people! So we've added around 1.3 million new people since 2000. That's incredible growth and much of it happened well before either legal or recreational marijuana. In fact, you couldn't even buy booze on Sundays from a liquor store here until 2008!

So while it's easy to blame things on the MJ I don't think it's the driving force. MJ was very popular in CO well before any legalization. I've lived out here twice. In the mid 90s and then when I moved back about 15 years ago. I'll be frank and say I don't think things have changed for the better but much of that is just so many more people. Everything is packed, all the time. Our roads are congested. Parks full. Shortage of housing. We're experiencing major growing pains that come with adding huge amounts of people to your community. And even though jobs have keep up with the population growth, many resources and services are just strained. Try hiking or biking on a trail at 8-9am. Try getting to the high-country to ski and miss the I70/470 interchange at 6am and sit in traffic for hours instead of an easy 70 mile drive to A-basin. 10 years ago I could get to that interchange by 6:30 and still not sit in traffic. Nowadays it's bad a half hour earlier.

I think the MJ tourism definitely attracts a mix of folks. Some good, some bad. But then I read MJ shops are paying bud tenders $20+ an hour and I'm thinking. Ok, that's a decent amount of money for a low-skill job. If folks are going to be doing this stuff anyhow, having a well-regulated industry would be better in my mind than a black market. Prohibition didn't stop boozing and legal or not people will still partake in mj use.

Ideally I believe nation-wide decriminalization would be good. Let the states then decide how their residents want to regulate it. Here we have local control and cities can decide what's legal and what's not. I like that balance as it gives everyone a say still. If you don't want it in your community you can vote to keep it out...just like dry counties.

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Originally posted by Modern Day Savage:
This story was fairly widely reported and garnered a lot of local attention and debate. There are other story links that include more detail but require me to disable my ad blockers and my virus protection just expired so I'll just offer this link. Ultimately the husband confessed to the murder and was sentenced to 30 years. Police found evidence of edible marijuana purchase and use and the husband blamed the murder on his misuse of the edible.

https://kdvr.com/2014/08/26/fa...bout-loss-moving-on/


Teen jumps to his death after eating a marijuana cookie.

https://www.livescience.com/51...marijuana-death.html

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Originally posted by Modern Day Savage:
When I voted to legalize marijuana one of the several benefits I expected to see was the illegal pot black market dwindle or disappear. However, in taxing pot so heavily the black market for pot still thrives as an economic, if not risky, way to partake.

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Originally posted by Modern Day Savage:
You make a very good point...I would be in favor of nation wide marijuana decriminalization and allowing the states to determine how to handle it.

However, and until I see individual responsibility become the norm and strictly enforced by law, I would remain opposed to legalization at the state level.

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Originally posted by HRK:
Have to agree with above, the vote won't change anything, the left will just declare victory and the press will report that their work (progressives and media) finally forced the right to concede they were wrong and the that the left was correct...In the end it will be seen as a victory of the left who finally got the old stodgy right white men to release their old religious unfounded racism against pot smokers view and accept the lefts morally right pro pot viewpoint.

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In the end it will eliminate the debate on open free pot sales, however the future will be the debate on taxes, revenue sharing, and the criminal aspect of recreational pot use, no different than the enforcement of illegal acts committed while intoxicated with liquor.

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Originally posted by JohnCourage:
Get the Federal Government out of it and let the states decide.

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Originally posted by HayesGreener:
Medical marijuana has legitimate uses but having seen the effects of chronic MJ use many times over, I am convinced that states will rue the day they made recreational marijuana legal.