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Member |
Yes...it has been proven that there is a correlation between fatigue and BAC. And I would venture to guess there are laws on the books for Negligent Homicide when situations as you describe occur. That is the punishment phase. Again, I appreciate what your intent is, but you want the Government to get involved as the Nanny State to determine who is and is not competent to drive a vehicle just because they haven't slept. I believe I've had enough Government control in my lifetime. I shall respectfully agree to disagree with you, sir. If you want to be convincing, I suggest you bring data to the table showing fatal accidents caused by drunk driving vs. fatigue with alcohol and/or drugs NOT involved. "If you’re a leader, you lead the way. Not just on the easy ones; you take the tough ones too…” – MAJ Richard D. Winters (1918-2011), E Company, 2nd Battalion, 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment, 101st Airborne "Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil... Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel." - Isaiah 5:20,24 | |||
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| Member |
Respectfully, if you're having problems controlling your vehicle to the extent a police officer feels the need to pull you over, you need to be pulled over and arrested for endangering the public whether your problem was lack of sleep or because you drank too much. I want you off the road anytime you're too impaired to correctly handle your vehicle, regardless of why you're impaired. We already call it criminal for people to be drinking while driving based on potential outcomes involving harming innocent people. Why not just do it for all impairment? Far too many people fail to take the responsibility of driving safely and not impaired seriously. That should change. ------------- $ | |||
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| Member |
OK...now you've given a specific scenario. Yes...the officer should pull said person over, but what are the charges? DUI? Under the influence of what, exactly? Lack of sleep? Again...that isn't against the law! Best case in your scenario is that the officer has the driver call someone to pick him up whether it be a family/friend, uber, cab, whatever. But to say he's GUILTY of something is preposterous. Stupid? Yes! Against the law? Not even close. I'm out...you can have the last word. "If you’re a leader, you lead the way. Not just on the easy ones; you take the tough ones too…” – MAJ Richard D. Winters (1918-2011), E Company, 2nd Battalion, 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment, 101st Airborne "Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil... Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel." - Isaiah 5:20,24 | |||
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| Member |
The title of the crime would be simply 'driving while impaired'. In my solution, it f doesn't matter why you're impaired, only that you are impaired compared to the baseline test standard. The law regarding "driving under the influence" is completely replaced by the driving while impaired, and then people partaking in all risky impairment behaviors from driving while exhausted to smoking weed, to drinking to any other drugs are all accounted for. ------------- $ | |||
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Member |
State's making their own choice is great, except when it isn't. Conceal carry is already a pain in the ass when crossing state lines. We need consistency in our laws. I could care less about weed, what would be the difference between it and any other controlled substance? Sounds like a money maker to me - how many folks are going to start smoking that don't already? I've never held a cigarette. *Handguns are fine, Shotguns are final | |||
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Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie |
It's beyond preposterous. I can't even quantify how absurd the notion is. So an officer pulls you over cause you crossed a line when you nodded off for a split second. I'm willing to bet though that now that the officer is next to your car and talking to you that you are as wide as awake as can be. So now what? What does the officer do now to prove you are impaired? Seriously, this idea of charging people criminally for being a little sleepy behind the wheel strikes me as wildly unreasonable and frankly illogical. ~Alan Acta Non Verba NRA Life Member (Patron) God, Family, Guns, Country Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan | |||
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Nullus Anxietas |
Do you suppose the friends and family of somebody killed, or an individual maimed as a result of impaired or distracted driving on the part of another cares whether it was a result of the ingestion/inhalation of drugs--legal or otherwise, mobile device usage--be it texting or talking, their fiddling with the radio, getting a bj while driving or lack of sleep? Impaired is impaired. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | |||
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| It's not you, it's me.  |
So....how bout that weed? | |||
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| Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie |
If you fall asleep and kill someone as a result, won't you possibly face some type of vehicular homicide or negligent or involuntary homicide charge? That's not at all what I'm addressing. ~Alan Acta Non Verba NRA Life Member (Patron) God, Family, Guns, Country Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan | |||
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Sigforum K9 handler |
The charge you fellas are looking for is reckless driving. That is where sleepy driving fits. And yes, if someone is sleepy, and is driving recklessly they get charged despite being wide awake while the cop is standing at their window. It is arrestable in most states, and a reckless driving conviction hits you just as hard as a DUI on insurance because it is in fact a form of impairment. | |||
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Member |
The legalization of pot would only give more tax dollars to a government that has proven time and time again that they WILL NOT spend that money wisely. The logical question is: Why give them more money/power? ——————————————— The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Psalm 14:1 | |||
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| Member |
Anyway, some people in the thread were fretting over not having an equivalent to the breathalyzer for weed. I was merely saying we have the technology to determine a safe be impaired threshold as measured by ability to concentrate, react, and use fine or coarse motor skills, so why not switch solely to that measure and throw away the whole idea of blood alcohol content, trying to decide a test for THC impairment, and so forth? That's all I really want. Something black and white they can test someone with to be able to say yes, this person we pulled over is impaired according to this quantitative test or no, drive safely have a great day. Testing for specific impairments is ridiculous to me versus simply determining if the person in question tests impaired or not impaired. ------------- $ | |||
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The Joy Maker |
It's da debil.
I'm impressed at that bit of gymnastics. 
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| Member |
Call it what you want, but true Conservatives want smaller government. The only way to achieve that is through less taxes. ——————————————— The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Psalm 14:1 | |||
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| Sigforum K9 handler |
Roadside PBTs are inadmissible in court for alcohol. and likely they never will be as long as attorneys make the laws at the state legislature. Some cops, like me when I was on the road, are already good at pot related impaired driving, pill related impaired driving, etc. I feel what you are saying, and I think anyone who who thinks that smoking pot and driving is somehow “safer” than drinking and driving are idiotic at best. Pot smokers cause their fair share of fatality accidents. | |||
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| Gracie Allen is my personal savior! |
In Texas, they can be. It's not a surprise given all of the eighteen-wheeler traffic coming through the state, but apparently we've had that many fatalities due to tired driving. | |||
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| Peace through superior firepower  |
This stuff you guys are arguing about now has nothing to do with the original question. You can be for or against decriminalization of marijuana and you can argue your position enthusiastically. The one thing you cannot argue with is this inexorable tide. The times, they are a-changin'. The answer to the original question is "yes". ____________________________________________________ "I am your retribution." - Donald Trump, speech at CPAC, March 4, 2023 | |||
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Frangas non Flectes |
Thanks, Para. That's kinda my point: it's going to happen, and probably sooner than most of us would have imagined. When it does, there's going to be a ton of people on both sides of the aisle who will celebrate it, and the ones on the left who were openly consuming it before will not be shocking to anybody. What will absolutely stun a goodly number of you is how many of your friends and family on the right end up seeing it as a good thing and "come out of the closet." When that happens, we can either let the left own it, the way they have in decades past, or we can try to have a place at the table. If we pull a Trump, and just announce we bought the table and invite everyone, it will be more of a win for the right than the left. ______________________________________________ “There are plenty of good reasons for fighting, but no good reason ever to hate without reservation, to imagine that God Almighty Himself hates with you, too.” | |||
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| Gracie Allen is my personal savior! |
Not to mention a tangible example of the old Republican principle that less government means more freedom. That's an argument that the GOP has somehow failed to make to young voters for quite some time. | |||
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Honky Lips |
so what if we legalize and don't tax? then we just get less government. | |||
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