quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
Wouldn’t be the worst thing for everyone involved if the Ukrainians disappeared that clown and replaced him with someone who isn’t a grandstanding nitwit. He’s done everything possible to enrich himself and prolong the conflict.

Hmmmm. You mention that it wouldn’t be the worst thing if someone disappeared the grandstanding nitwit doing everything to enrich himself. Are you talking about Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, Newsome, Schiff, Waters, McConnell, I’m sure lots of others, or Zelenskyy?

Zelenskyy would be easier to get away with. The place is awash with (donated) firearms, and the list of "People with a Motive" would include every family member of every Ukrainian wounded or killed in action.

quote:

Originally posted by whanson_wi:
Zelenskyy would be easier to get away with. The place is awash with (donated) firearms, and the list of "People with a Motive" would include every family member of every Ukrainian wounded or killed in action.

Yeah, I don’t think anyone is suggesting that it should be done, just noting that if it happened, it probably wouldn’t be a negative.


Hopefully the natural reaper is coming for at least some of those folks soon…

European leaders set to hold emergency summit on Ukraine

https://www.france24.com/en/eu...plomatic-sources-say

France is in talks with its allies about holding an informal European summit on Ukraine on Monday, diplomatic sources said Saturday. Donald Trump's Ukraine envoy Keith Kellogg earlier said that Europe would not have a role in Ukraine peace talks planned between the US, Ukraine and Russia.

France is discussing with its allies holding an informal summit of European leaders to discuss Ukraine, a French presidency official said on Saturday, and four European diplomats said the meeting was likely to go ahead on Monday.

Speaking on a panel at the Munich Security Conference on Saturday, Polish Foreign Minister Radoslaw Sikorski also said that French President Emmanuel Macron had called for a summit of European leaders in Paris.

"President Trump has a method of operating, which the Russians call reconnaissance through battle. You push and you see what happens, and then you change your position, legitimate tactics. And we need to respond," Sikorski said.

Following pressure from U.S. President Donald Trump to end the war in Ukraine, Europe's focus is shifting to what concrete role it can play in providing security guarantees for Ukraine,as well as how to strengthen Europe’s collective security.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy called on Saturday for the creation of a European army, saying the continent could no longer be sure of protection from the United States.

The four diplomats, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said discussions were continuing about who should be invited to any summit. Two of them said non-EU member Britain had been invited.

The Dutch news agency reported that Prime Minister Dick Schoof would go to Paris on Monday for the summit.

It was unclear whether Volodymr Zelenskiy would be invited.

I'm in awe with President Trumps political sense and ability.

Europe went from- "As much as it takes, For as long as it takes".

To- "We need to wrap this up Monday".

And only 1 month after UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer signed a 100-year partnership agreement with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

The only real "bargaining chip" that Zelenskyy has are the bodies of the dead Ukrainian soldiers; it's called "sunk costs". No one wants to accept the fact that everything they have done and sacrificed was for naught. An "internal regime change" will eventually solve the issue.

The fact that Trump speaks highly of Putin and the two share mutual respect for eachother should clue any hold outs here on who the real enemy is; Zelensky. I would not be surprised at this point if Trump uses the threat of military intervention (against Ukraine) to force Zelensky's surrender. While I hope Trump doesn't have to escalate to that point, Zelensky is a welfare rat and will always look for a way to scurry and steal and I don't think change will come from within Ukraine.

quote:

I would not be surprised at this point if Trump uses the threat of military intervention (against Ukraine) to force Zelensky's surrender.

Yeah, sure. What, "We're going to bomb you"? Or, "We're going to send troops to fight yours"?

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

I would not be surprised at this point if Trump uses the threat of military intervention (against Ukraine) to force Zelensky's surrender.

Yeah, sure. What, "We're going to bomb you"? Or, "We're going to send troops to fight yours"?

What's the alternative if Zelensky refuses to play ball and runs to the Europeans for help?

quote:

While I hope Trump doesn't have to escalate to that point, Zelensky is a welfare rat and will always look for a way to scurry and steal and I don't think change will come from within Ukraine.

Don't be silly, Trump isn't going to be the one to take out Zelensky.

Having said that, you're right about Zelensky being "a welfare rat". We are going to cut that off and then the Ukrainians will take out Zelensky, either by election or by assassination. If Zelensky were smart, he would immediately call for elections. It's the only way he makes it out alive.

quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
What's the alternative if Zelenskyy refuses to play ball

Zelenskyy and Europe fight the never ending war themselves, with their money, resources and lives.

quote:

What's the alternative if Zelensky refuses to play ball and runs to the Europeans for help?

Simple. We walk away and tell Zelensky and the Europeans that you are on your own. Why should we force a deal (with US military force) on Ukraine and the Europeans that none of them want. The idea that we would use military force in support of Russia is kind of nuts. What are we going to do, run a joint military operation with the Russians to kill Zelensky?

quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
What's the alternative if Zelensky refuses to play ball and runs to the Europeans for help?

Don't be a politician. Answer my questions.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

Originally posted by Carpentermaass84:
What's the alternative if Zelensky refuses to play ball and runs to the Europeans for help?

Don't be a politician. Answer my questions.

I think the beauty with Trump is that when he makes a statement that doesn't leave out the possibility of ________ then people panic and assume he's going to follow through with his threat. Even a veiled threat might be enough to convince Zelensky to surrender.

^^^ Trump is a peace President. No foreign wars were started under his 1st term. He campaigned on no more money to Ukraine. So, it's ludicrous to think he would make any threats of actual military intervention against Ukraine.

quote:

I think the beauty with Trump is that when he makes a statement that doesn't leave out the possibility of ________ then people panic and assume he's going to follow through with his threat. Even a veiled threat might be enough to convince Zelensky to surrender.

Surrender? Really? Unless there is some kind of a deal, there are three scenarios here:

1. Continue to support Ukraine with weapons and other aid, hoping that with sanctions, their deteriorating economy, and battlefield casualties, the Russians will withdraw, much like they did in Afganistan.

2. Pull our aid, weapons and support, and tell Ukraine and the Europeans to have at it. You're on your own.

3. Actively support Russia. Remove all sanctions. Declare that the Russians are free to demand Zelensky's surrender. If they want they can take the whole country. (What other meaning could you mean by Zelensky's "surrender.")

It does sound like you are advocating option #3. I could be very wrong of course. Please clarify what you mean by "surrender."

Europe doesn't have the money or the military and everyone knows it.

How to lose gracefully is the answer

quote:

Continue to support Ukraine with weapons ...

Cash up front.

From today: Zelenskyy is in the Fuck Around stage, he will soon see the Find Out stage soon enough. "I will never accept any decisions between the United States and Russia"