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Originally posted by BamaJeepster:

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Originally posted by JALLEN:
Whataburger is not only very good food, but very well managed. Our investment co. had a property leased to a Whataburger unit for several years, and they were first class in every way, very impressive.

I would question the management decision to enter the debate on gun control.

A good management decision would be 'We follow the local and state laws where our establishments are located, we do not further restrict or attempt to influence public policy in any way. We are a hamburger chain and producing the best food possible is what we focus on.'

The best food for the most peo.... errr, customers. As weird as it seems, there are some who would not be comfortable sitting there with a table of armed civilians in view.

The open carrying plain clothes LEOs I have seen have been neatly groomed, conservatively dressed, not attracting notice.

This isn't hard to figure out. This was no mistake. Get real.

My answer is simple, if I lived in Texas I would never go into a What-a-burger... since regular law abiding citizens are now 2nd class....

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Originally posted by Blume9mm:
My answer is simple, if I lived in Texas I would never go into a What-a-burger... since regular law abiding citizens are now 2nd class....

Oh, please.

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:
The best food for the most peo.... errr, customers. As weird as it seems, there are some who would not be comfortable sitting there with a table of armed civilians in view.

The open carrying plain clothes LEOs I have seen have been neatly groomed, conservatively dressed, not attracting notice.

Many citizens who choose to carry are not comfortable eating in public unarmed. It cuts both ways.

Simple solution to anyone who complains on either side:

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Dear customer,

Thank you for your recent letter. It is our policy to follow the local, state and federal laws in each of our establishments. If you do not agree with those laws we encourage you to contact your representatives and work for a solution that you do agree with. Thank you for your patronage.

This works for McDonald's, Taco Bell, KFC, Hardee's and any number of other locally owned restaurants as well. They would lose not a single customer if they adopted this policy.

It's a very stupid management decision for a business to enter political debates on either side of the issue.

quote:

Originally posted by BamaJeepster:

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:
The best food for the most peo.... errr, customers. As weird as it seems, there are some who would not be comfortable sitting there with a table of armed civilians in view.

The open carrying plain clothes LEOs I have seen have been neatly groomed, conservatively dressed, not attracting notice.

Many citizens who choose to carry are not comfortable eating in public unarmed. It cuts both ways.

Simple solution to anyone who complains on either side:

quote:

Dear customer,

Thank you for your recent letter. It is our policy to follow the local, state and federal laws in each of our establishments. If you do not agree with those laws we encourage you to contact your representatives and work for a solution that you do agree with. Thank you for your patronage.

This works for McDonald's, Taco Bell, KFC, Hardee's and any number of other locally owned restaurants as well. They would lose not a single customer if they adopted this policy.

It's a very stupid management decision for a business to enter political debates on either side of the issue.

I haven’t noticed Whataburger lacking for customers even when In-and-Out opened up on the other side of the freeway. They aren’t debating, and are following the law. A number of businesses post signs, like HEB banning open carry. They do just fine.

Why would they ban any legal owner of firearms?
Have they ever, ever been robbed by a legal carrier, police or civilian?

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Originally posted by 220-9er:
Why would they ban any legal owner of firearms?
Have they ever, ever been robbed by a legal carrier, police or civilian?

Robbery isn’t the problem. Have any of the CHL open carriers ever been robbed?

Without redebating the issue, the Lege recognized that some wanted to carry openly, but some business and property owners do not want people with guns in their property. Those rights collide. This is the political compromise that emerged.

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Originally posted by JALLEN:

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Originally posted by bigdeal:

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Originally posted by ScreamingCockatoo:

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In October 2017, Whataburger fired a Denison employee who cursed at two officers and refused to serve them. In September 2015, the chain fired a Lewisville worker who wouldn’t serve two police officers.

This had jack and shit to do with open carry.
This has to do with BLM VS Law Enforcement.
FIRE the jackass now.

I'm inclined to think the same thing. Article states the officer had a clearly displayed badge on and explained who he was. That, coupled with these other instances seem to indicate a trend.

Also, why do I believe it is a really stupid idea to confront an armed individual and seek to piss them off by refusing them service?

I guess if you announced in a loud voice, “Hey you with the gun! Get the fuck out!”, it would come across as confrontational. There are better ways.

Why do you believe it would “piss them off?” People who open carry have permits, have done the training, know that we don't shoot people because we are mad at them, but because they are a threat physically. That’s why there are so few road rage shootings, parking lot shootings, etc.

Why not assume the employee saw the gun, saw the badge, believed that store policy was to ask the gunperson to leave, and now knows about the LEO exception?

Because it ain't their first rodeo with denying law enforcement service.
That's how we ascertain that the employees are shitbags.

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Originally posted by Blume9mm:
My answer is simple, if I lived in Texas I would never go into a What-a-burger... since regular law abiding citizens are now 2nd class....

You'd be missing out.

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Originally posted by JALLEN:
I don’t think Whataburger uses signs. I’ve not seen any signs at the Whataburgers I have been to.

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Originally posted by texassierra:
I love Wataburger but either post 30.07 or allow OC. Doing so allows LTC holders to make an informed decision to patronize your establishment or not prior to entering. By going the verbal route they're attempting to stratle both sides.

I have an app on my iPhone (Texas 3006) for places that have 30.06 and/or 30.07 signs. It turns out only 4 Whataburgers in the state of Texas have a 30.07 sign. The one closest to my house does not have a sign, and neither does the one in Friendswood that the article is about.

Whataburger seems to me, a customer, to be a class outfit. I was disappointed last year when they reacted with the “we’d rather you not open carry in our stores” statement. I’ve never seen them enforce it though and I have seen open carry in their stores. As for the Texas 30.07 signs, as I understand the law as written, if you are “notified” by a private individual or an agent of a commercial business, you are required to leave by Texas law. The 30.07 or 30.06 signs are an acceptable form of notification. I don’t know that you can interpret them as the only legal means of notification. You guys that are lawyers here in Texas, check me out on that.

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Originally posted by ScreamingCockatoo:



Because it ain't their first rodeo with denying law enforcement service.
That's how we ascertain that the employees are shitbags.

Where does it say that?

Whataburger has had a couple of incidents, but not necesarily with this employee. Why the employee failed to implement the policy is unstated. Training problem, bad attitude, political hari kari?

The employees who were involved before were fired, I believe. You can’t just shoot them apparently.

Whataberger apparently hasn't corrected the problem as it continues to occur now doesn't it?
Once OK a lone jackass.
Three times now? Three times is no longer a coincidence.

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Whataberger apparently hasn't corrected the problem

The problem you're assuming exist can not be corrected even if it is indeed the problem.

It's a restaurant. They have thousands of employees of the variety that work in restaurants. It may surprise some people to know that some of those people have issues that are not entirely conducive to running a proper business. You weed them out as they pop up.

Most restaurant employees glance through an employee handbook that they are required to sign off on. Most of these handbooks mention "no gun" policies. Back to the fact that you're hiring a restaurant employee and not a lawyer. They glanced through the book, and likely don't know about paragraph 2, subsection Q, third sentence exceptions to rule #1586.

So could it be a SJW? Yes. Could it be an employee that honestly believed they were following company guide lines? Yes. Could it be a completely clueless person who was making things up as they went along? Yes. It's a restaurant.

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Originally posted by ScreamingCockatoo:
Whataberger apparently hasn't corrected the problem as it continues to occur now doesn't it?
Once OK a lone jackass.
Three times now? Three times is no longer a coincidence.

I’m not buying that. ~800 stores, several thousand managers, no telling how many of them relatively new. They have apologized, I am certain made amends in other ways directly to the officer. It is no more intentional than handing me a Double Whataburger with onions, when I ordered that with no onions. If in discussing this incident with the manager, and the story reveals a bad attitude of some sort, there will be ramifications.

SC has a bad zero tolerance policy apparently. I think Whataburger made it right. 3 isolated incidents, from 3 different stores and franchisees does not equal as big a problem as you are making it out to be.

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Originally posted by JALLEN:
Why do you believe it would “piss them off?”

My comment was more a take on the old story about the kid who hated the bully, but knew the bully was big and mean enough to kick his butt, so he took the smarter course of action and simply kept his mouth shut and left the bully alone. I would assert anyone short of the police screwing with anyone carrying a firearm is less than brilliant, regardless what stupid company policies exist, and regardless what permits and/or training the individual with the firearm has acquired.

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Why not assume the employee saw the gun, saw the badge, believed that store policy was to ask the gunperson to leave, and now knows about the LEO exception? There are so few open carriers (that I’ve seen) that the full ramifications of the policy might not be well internalized by some and with a bit of nervous, they fumbled it. Now they know.

I might have been inclined to believe just that, had there not been a series of other similar incidents. With degrees in Accounting and Economics, and doing what I do for a living, I tend to always default to statistical probability to form an opinion. There's a few too many of these incidents at this burger chain for me to simply give them the benefit of the doubt. I also think its beyond asinine for hourly employees to be expected to confront 'anyone' open carrying like this. Post the appropriate state signage, and if anyone ignores it, call the police to deal with the individual.

Another aspect of this, perhaps lost sight of, is that even with a sign, the plainsclothes guy was perfectly legal to open carry. If the manager had tried to invoke state law and refused to serve, the outcome would be the same.

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Originally posted by corsair:
Meanwhile, Whataburger upper management is left having to clean-up the mess and apologize all over the place. The anti's are grinning.

That management team is part of the problem given they opted to institute a policy of not serving people who are acting completely within the law. I will never understand why the management of companies today is so incredibly spineless in dealing with whining crybabies who want to dictate what their company policies should be. Why can't these companies simply advertise that their company policies regarding firearms in their establishments will strictly adhere to whatever current state law dictates. If the whiners want something different, they are welcome to solicit their state representatives for a change to state law. Use the excuse that state government creates the law people must live by, not corporations. Any reasonable person would accept that policy.