I've decided to proactively replace my 25 year old water heater. Rheem 50gal natural gas. I don't think there is anything special about it. But it has lasted pretty well.

I've never bought a water heater before. I don't think I need anything more fancy with more bells and whistles. I think I'd be happy with a straight replacement (perhaps more reliable and more power efficient?).

What brand(s) is recommended? I see BW, AOSmith, Rheem mentioned frequently. Any real differences in reliability, quality, efficiency? In my non-expert view, it's a pretty simple appliance - tank, gas burner, insulation. But quality of materials and workmanship may affect reliability / durability.

Any thoughts - any strong preference for brand? Any other considerations?


Update Aug 15 - now seeking help between two models after receiving quote from plumber.

Both are ultra low NOx, 50gal, natural gas.
1) BW URG150T6
2) American Standard GN50T1-3-6

Price delta between the two is $350; #1 is higher.

Both sound good on paper; the AS seems to have better specs (first hour 86gal vs 75gal). The 12 year warranty for the AS includes a second anode rod $350 adder).

The BW brand seems to have a better historical reputation. But the AS (made by AO Smith and shares the same tanks, etc) sounds pretty reputable too. BW seems to have a much better customer service reputation but sounds like I wouldn't deal with BW or AS directly anyway - work with the plumber for both warranty and non-warranty work.

Please help me decide. I'm analysis frozen and don't have first hand experiences except for my current trouble free Rheem.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: konata88,

Any reason for not going tankless?

Our last tank heater was a BW. Other than the plastic controller failing [large BW recall on a bad batch, had a half dozen fail on our street within a year of each other] & spewing water [luckily it was in the garage] it was fine after repair & the plastic controller was replaced with a metal dial & ignitor.

Any of those name brands will serve you well.

Just make sure you (or your plumber) gets it from a plumbing supplier, not from a big box store.

The units sold in big box stores are made cheaper for a lower price point (or at least a greater profit margin).

So a 50 gallon Rheem from Lowes/HD will be lesser quality than the similar on paper 50 gallon Rheem from a supply store.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Just make sure you (or your plumber) gets it from a plumbing supplier, not from a big box store.

Thanks. How do I ensure this? By model number? Some specific verbiage in quote / contract?

Tankless: I trust Rinnai and have other products made by them. But I'm not entirely comfortable with the safety, efficiency, adequacy. Also, I think the installation cost will be considerably higher - not sure it's justifiable if we end up moving w/in next 5-10 years. I guess I could research and consider more deeply but not sure what benefit I'd really derive (assuming safety is not in anyway compromised vs tank heater). I haven't been left wanting in any real way from tank water heater - even the contractor special I currently have installed (for past 25 years).

Our tankless at our old house was a Rinnai.
Had to replace the ignitor, but otherwise was trouble free. It was a mid 2010s model, so there were times we could outflow it & get little spurts of cold water.

I'd have to look at the brand of tankless we have now, but it's definitely more robust. Can run the washer, dishwasher and 2 showers with no hot water interruption.

Do you need a larger pipe to feed gas to a gas tankless water heater?

I know with electric tankless models you need larger wires and breakers. The one my dad has has three 240v 40 amp breakers.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:

Tankless: I trust Rinnai and have other products made by them. But I'm not entirely comfortable with the safety, efficiency, adequacy. Also, I think the installation cost will be considerably higher - not sure it's justifiable if we end up moving w/in next 5-10 years. I guess I could research and consider more deeply but not sure what benefit I'd really derive (assuming safety is not in anyway compromised vs tank heater). I haven't been left wanting in any real way from tank water heater - even the contractor special I currently have installed (for past 25 years).

I replaced 3 water heaters in 30 years, the last one is a Rinnai tankless that runs on LP, since we have a 120 gallon LP tank at the house for the cooktop. It has cut our LP bill in half since it's not heating water all day to keep a tank full for possible use.

If you have NG in your home or LP then it's the way to go, you get more space because the old big 50 gallon tank is gone, and while it may take a bit for hot water to arrive, it already does that with a tank water heater. You can add a recirculation device that keeps the water in the tankless up to temp for faster heat up, but IMHO it's a waste.

You are in California? If so I'd bet there are some kind of state programs for putting in a Tankless water heater over a tank that might make it even more affordable... What the hey, lets ask Google aka AI....

Question: Are there any state of California incentives for putting in a tankless water heater

Yes, California offers several local utility rebates for installing high-efficiency gas or heat pump tankless water heaters, though state-wide funding programs and federal tax credits for gas tankless models have expired.

The most common ways to save include:

Local Utility Rebates: Many gas and electric providers, such as SoCalGas and LADWP, offer cash-back incentives (sometimes up to $1,500 depending on the unit's efficiency and your location) when you replace an older tank-style water heater with an eligible tankless model. Check current offers using the SoCalGas Rebates & Incentives page or the LADWP Consumer Rebate Program.

Heat Pump Water Heater Incentives: If you choose a high-efficiency electric heat pump tankless water heater, you may qualify for specialized statewide incentives and grid-savings programs.

You can explore qualifying equipment and contractor guidelines through TECH Clean California.

To find the exact incentives available in your area, could you tell me your zip code and which utility companies (e.g., PG&E, SoCalGas, SMUD) provide your gas and electricity?

Having a tankless Rinnai, I'd never go back to a tank heater. Plenty of hot water and it doesn't run out.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Just make sure you (or your plumber) gets it from a plumbing supplier, not from a big box store.

Thanks. How do I ensure this? By model number? Some specific verbiage in quote / contract?

You tell the plumber to go buy one from Ferguson or elsewhere BUT NOT FROM HomeDepot or Lowe’s .

It’s that easy. He will know why.

I had my 40gal NG unit go out during covid and all I could source to replace it then was a 50 Gal commercial unit. I cost much more and I had to have a blower motor for it hooked up and vented outside. It works great, AO Smith unit.

In hind sight I wish for the day that all these gas appliances didn't need 120v power to operate. It was nice to have a simple pilot light on the gas range, furnace, and hot water heater. If the power went out they all still worked. Now, the power goes out and I have no working gas appliances.Plus the repair bill is much higher.
Progress?

A few years back I had a 50-gl Bradford White tank installed.
Natural gas unit with a pilot light.

Awesome tank, no complaints at all.

When I get a quote from a plumber, should I specify the specific models of interest (one each for Rheem, AOSmith and BW)? Or should I let them just quote for a comparable replacement for existing unit? I guess I can check online at HD/Lowe if the models of interest are sold there. Or is there a better way to ensure that even though I specific not buying from a unit from HD/Lowe, that they actually don't?

HRK - thanks! I looked around for rebates and found one from PGE but the program is ending this month. Only for $75 anyway - helps but is pretty minimal. I'm looking at an AOSmith unit that seems to be selling for about $1300.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
If you have NG in your home or LP then it's the way to go, you get more space because the old big 50 gallon tank is gone, and while it may take a bit for hot water to arrive, it already does that with a tank water heater.

Not trying to take away from HRK's post at all here, but... Installation cost has been mentioned, and I can talk briefly about that.

I looked into replacing my gas water heater with a tankless unit. The initial cost wasn't too far different, but the installation was going to be ridiculously expensive. Evidently, the tankless unit was not allowed to use the same flue as my existing appliances (water heater and furnace), so I was going to have to run a whole new flue. At that point, it became a no-go.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
It has cut our LP bill in half since it's not heating water all day to keep a tank full for possible use.

I was looking forward to reduced gas bills, no doubt.

Our current Bradford-White - Defender 40 gal has no pilot or electrical hook-up.

Just magic, I guess.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:
I've never bought a water heater before. I don't think I need anything more fancy with more bells and whistles. I think I'd be happy with a straight replacement (perhaps more reliable and more power efficient?).

Any other considerations?

At that age you're not really going to get a straight replacement. Safety requirements have changes and there are additional pieces, and space, needed for a replacement.

I had a plumber out for another issue last week and asked for a ballpark price for a water heater replacement. His figure was $3700 w/10 year warranty. When I balked, he mentioned that a common figure for installation...he's worked for other companies...was $4-5k for replacement and removal of the old water heater.

We didn't get into brands as I was only trying to get a ball park idea. I had my other water heater replaced a couple of years ago and it was about $2700

quote:

Just make sure you (or your plumber) gets it from a plumbing supplier, not from a big box store.

Also Lowes & Home Depot pass the warranty to the manufacturer. A HVAC & Pumbing contractor I do accounting & tax work for said it is best to buy one that is manufactered locally. He had one of his subs replace my last 55 gal water heater for cost. Water heater $800 + labor $400 with total $1200. I paid the sub in cash.

quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:

Not trying to take away from HRK's post at all here, but... Installation cost has been mentioned, and I can talk briefly about that.

I looked into replacing my gas water heater with a tankless unit. The initial cost wasn't too far different, but the installation was going to be ridiculously expensive. Evidently, the tankless unit was not allowed to use the same flue as my existing appliances (water heater and furnace), so I was going to have to run a whole new flue. At that point, it became a no-go.

Yes ran across that same issue having to upgrade the existing gas tanks flue, so I opted for an outdoor unit, mounted it
on the side of the house right where the gas line comes into the house just past the cut off.

Zero cost for the flue.

There are new ones that you can vent with just PVC pipe, you don't need the metal flue and you can run it right out the side of the
house vs through the roof.

quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:
It has cut our LP bill in half since it's not heating water all day to keep a tank full for possible use.

I was looking forward to reduced gas bills, no doubt.[/QUOTE]

Yes that was one of my reasons for installing it...

^^ Much of the 'why don't you just get a Tankless Unit' argument is extremely dependent on how your house is plumbed for natural gas and water, the floor plan/design of the house, where the existing unit is located, as well your geographic location. When I looked at this equation, it didn't even make sense to upgrade to a high(er) efficiency tank style water heater, let alone a tankless, or potentially multiple tankless units! The ROI to realize any savings was out past the realistic lifespan of the direct replacement to my existing water heater!

^^^And balancing that against “cutting the gas bill in half”. Which means nothing without numbers. Half for a pair of empty nesters would be much different than half for a family of 4 or more with teenagers.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:
^^^And balancing that against “cutting the gas bill in half”. Which means nothing without numbers. Half for a pair of empty nesters would be much different than half for a family of 4 or more with teenagers.

Refill times per year went down initially 50%, then they moved us to automatic refills and now they have a cellular tank monitor so they know when to come out to fill.

While we are empty nesters, the nest is never empty, both daughters live with in walking distance, so between the grandkids in the pool, washing towels, showers, washing dishes, running dishwasher we're anything but light users.

Right now with all the fuel costs jumping around you'd have to do a spreadsheet with cost per unit, units used, and time between fills to be accurate.

But in the first few years it was clear our total $ outlay as well as number of times billed dropped considerably, net net net we saved a bit more than half.