I'm going to get my first quote on a water heater. The vendor can do AOSmith / State but recommends American Standard.

I haven't looked into American Standard. Good to go? Comparable to BW / AOSmith / State? Or should I avoid American Standard?

quote:

Originally posted by 9mmepiphany:

I had a plumber out for another issue last week and asked for a ballpark price for a water heater replacement. His figure was $3700 w/10 year warranty. When I balked, he mentioned that a common figure for installation...he's worked for other companies...was $4-5k for replacement and removal of the old water heater.

We didn't get into brands as I was only trying to get a ball park idea. I had my other water heater replaced a couple of years ago and it was about $2700

Over the phone, sounds like basic replacement is in the ballpark of $2500 (5 year warranty?). Hopefully it stays in that range.

Man, ain't inflation great? I replaced the heater in my first house for $149, a can of pipe dope, and about a half hour of work.

$4000?!

I'm assuming most of that is a "California/high cost of living area markup", combined with some inflation.

Because for my last water heater replacement in 2019 I paid my plumber under $1100 out the door for a higher end 50 gallon gas Rheem.

Around $900 for the heater and a little under $200 for install.

So, the initial quotes look like $3000; a couple hundred more for a BW, a couple hundred less for an American Standard. (comparable 50gal units with 6 year warranty; ultra low NOx ATM vent).

I'm leaning toward the BW for $350 price premium because I don't know anything about AS. Is the AS good enough - expect it to last as long and w/o issue as the Rheem I have?

That seems high, but then again I'm not in California, prices for MOR Rheem 50 Gal NG units at Home Depot at the Mira Mesa store are around $800 to $960, the 6 year is around $800.

Link HD Rheem Low NoX 9 year warranty Tank

Presume because it's NG you don't want to deal with it yourself and the call to a plumber to hook up one you put in yourself (rnr tanks) would be $1000?

I've hooked up LP, and electric, the later is simple, you need some tools and correct installation bits for the NG.

Hooking up the water lines is now simple with SharkBite style hoses made for water heater hookups. You turn off the water, cut the copper tubes coming out of the wall, connect the hoses to the tank and then they have a pressure slip fit for the copper lines, no need to sweat copper joints.

Link Water Heater SharkBite Ball Valve Hose


DIY would be around $1,200 to $1,500 depending on the tank, tools, etc.

Thanks. I think the units being quoted are not available in HD/Lowes; it's hard to find pricing but the webz is suggestive that the price from a supply house is about $1500. Then need a few hundred for the county permit and another few hundred for expansion tank to meet code (btw, do these things require replacing on a regular cadence? If so, what types of fittings should I request? Or should they be soldered and just replaced by a plumber?).

So, parts ($1500) + extra ($500) + labor ($1000) puts us in the $3000 ballpark. About ten years ago, I got an unofficial estimate of about $2300 so perhaps it's on par with local expectations.

It seems like BW is still considered a premium brand despite more issues reported of late. And since I don't know anything about AS (other than it's related to AOS - cheaper brand?), I'm leaning toward BW since the cost isn't too different (10%). Unless AS is considered the way to go here because of other trends (first hand experiences).

I can get the same AS unit w/ an extra anode for $300; not sure it's worth it or not. I'm thinking not, especially given my experience with the current unit unless the anodes used now are substantially inferior and less durable than what was used in 2000.

Question: the heater replacement will require install of an expansion tank per code. When the tee is installed for the expansion tank, what should I request is done? Should the tank be threaded or soldered? Do I need valves or just a straight line (valve to turn off water to the tank to replace it? Valve to drain the tank for replacement? Other?).

Not sure what the quote should specify other than “install Expansion Tank”.

BTW, is this a generic tank or should I get one from, say Bradford White?

They're quoting you $1000 in labor for a 1-2 hour job?

WRT replacement, yeah they last about 10 yrs. Make sure the plumber puts a cut off valve on the inlet side. They make flexible lines now so you don’t have to hard solder them into place. The expansion tank is a newer requirement and like other things they do go bad. So just make sure you have an emergency $ set aside for when the universe looks at you.

You would already know if you needed a model with 2 anodes, which I assume you don’t. Also, check it annually when you flush the tank. It takes a 1 1/16” socket a cheater bar and another person to hold the tank from moving while you gorilla it.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:

So, parts ($1500) + extra ($500) + labor ($1000) puts us in the $3000 ballpark. About ten years ago, I got an unofficial estimate of about $2300 so perhaps it's on par with local expectations.

To answer your question, BW is still a good water heater. They are all 10 year max life units anymore...

Did you ask what a tankless would cost, that $3K might be close, then you'll eliminate the extra NG cost to keep water heated in a tank...

there are no California incentives for tankless, they are all about high efficiency heat pump water heaters, so you might look into those, and check what the state offers in tax kick backs.

For tankless check with your NG provider, some are offering rebate/incentives if you convert to tankless. I don't know your provider but AI came up with this information


Major regional gas providers—such as SoCalGas—offer local customer rebates ranging from $80 up to $1,500 when replacing an old storage-tank water heater with a qualifying high-efficiency natural gas tankless model.

https://www.socalgas.com/savin...bates-and-incentives

Thanks guys for the inputs. I'll go with BW instead of AS (AOS associated).

Sounds like Amtrol is the way to go for expansion tanks; my line pressure at the supply inlet is about 45-65 psi (varies during the day). Plumber is suggesting 2g (vs 4.5g) tank. Seems okay since I don't have an expansion tank today; no real issues with the line...?

I checked on tankless and it doesn't seem to be much benefit in my case. If there isn't a strong and compelling benefit, I was thinking just to keep this as simple as possible. May end up moving in a few years anyway.

Updated OP for two choices. Need help deciding between the two. Both sound comparable to me; plumber is advocating AS as the better choice; better thicker tank, higher btu, additional anode with 12 year warranty at the same price as BW option.

You should go with whichever your plumber prefers/recommends, and has access to/gets the best support from the Plumbing Supply House in your area. It sounds like American Standard is the way to go here.

American Standard GN50T1-3-6 = 6 year warranty
American Standard GN50T1-3-12 = 12 year warranty

Just FYI - The American Standard GN50T2-3-12 is + 2" Dia. (22 1/2"} vs GN50T1-3-12 (20 1/2") which means add'l insulation and a lower operating/energy cost.

Thanks! I appreciate the inputs.

I think the plumber has easy access to both supply and customer support for BW and AS. I think he's saying that he recommends the AS over the BW because it has a thicker wall tank (not sure what that benefit is since the current Rheem has lasted 25 years w/ our water) and because a second anode is available with the 12 year warranty (vs BW is just a paper warranty). And there was mention of a traditional metal gas valve vs the modern plastic one that BW uses?

However, I'm interested in some of the features of the BW like the silver ion coating for antibacteria. And the historical reputation of high quality build and great customer service.

The AS does sound good on paper though; and it's made by AO Smith which is supposed to be reputable for product quality (but not so much for customer service?).

I've been leaning toward BW by reputation but I'm swayed by your recommendation to go w/ whatever the plumber recommends (btw, he only does water heaters).

Have you had a problem with bacteria in your water?

Killing bacteria in your water heater is easy, just crank the temperature up. 130 will kill bacteria overnight while 140 will kill bacteria in under an hour. At 130, your hot water will be at least as safe as your cold water.

I don’t think so. Just wanted some additional protection. I set the water heater for 120f but it ranges from 110-123f throughout the day. Raising much above that and it gets scalding hot at times (but perfect other times). I’m hoping the new heater will produce a tighter range but maybe not. Not sure if 110f is good enough for bad bugs.

Bacteria like 110 degree water.

We have our water heater in Michigan set at 140 because the incoming well water is 45-55 degrees and we run out of hot water too fast otherwise. We started going up here when the kids were babies 19 years ago and have yet to have anyone get scalded.

The one in Florida is set at 130 and gets left on when we are in Michigan because we had a bacteria problem when we left it off. I figured I could swing the $10 it costs to leave it on when nobody is using it for the 2 months we are gone. We drain the pipes in Michigan when we leave because of the freeze risk.

If bacteria is a concern, the 'new(er)' protocol/best practice is to set the Water Heater at 140 degrees (or higher) to prevent/kill any/all bacteria, and install a Mixing/Tempering Valve at the outlet of the Water Heater to 'mix in' cold water to achieve 120 degrees at the hot water faucets.

https://www.nibco.com/nibco-pr...ering-valves/h-7x31/

Interesting! Any brand / model recommendations? I'll look into it. I wonder how much it would add to the quote to install one.