I'm thinking the strike won't last long. There's a lot of money tied up on the ships so the port management will feel the pressure.

On the other hand, no matter how much strike stipend the workers get, inflation has eaten up its value, they can't last long either.

In any case, consumers are about to take it in the posterior.

Yup, pretty much how this always shakes out.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
MANNERS

Speak your piece, but do so in a polite manner.

I don't agree with what he said, but I also don't think he's serious. You could- and here's a radical idea- ask him to clarify, and if he says he's serious, then you can break out the Wiffle bat.

Balzé,

It was a stupid joke given the absurdity of what they are asking. I don't feel that someone unloading freight is worth that much pay. I have a college degree, master electrician license, a dozen various certifications and many years of experience. I do not earn what these people do, nor do I have their benefits. Give me 30 days on the job training and I am certain I could replace one.

Unloading things is not rocket science. Learn to be safe, move heavy things, learn equipment.

I really hope the people in NC, TN, GA and FL don't need anything from overseas to rebuild with. Joe and the Ho could have stopped this strike, but are scared $#!tless of losing another union this close to an election.

Unions helped build this country but I they have been taken over by pure greed.

Years ago, I met Jimmy Hoffa. After shaking hands with him, someone said "count your fingers to make sure you still have all of them."

Re the automation debate:
Not all jobs can be replaced by automation today but as time goes on an lot of jobs can & will be automated. Dock workers, manufacturing, hell even McDonald's is automating. Much of the manufacturing is leaving this country due to labor cost and EPA regulations. EPA regulations are a large part of manufacturing leaving.

So the question then becomes what are workers going to do for income?
Go on welfare?
They can't all mow lawns for a living.

It’s my understanding that the dock operations in other countries put ours to shame as far as the technology use and the efficiency and the speed, we are still stuck in the 1930s and they are in the 21st century.

Too many of these unions have had it so good for so long that they have no clue how the rest of the country lives now. The fact that they are demanding premium healthcare where they pay little or none is absurd. My health plan through a major employer is a horrible HDHP where I have to pay everything out of pocket and that’s just the reality now since Obamacare.

quote:

Originally posted by Skins2881:


Balzé,

It was a stupid joke given the absurdity of what they are asking. I don't feel that someone unloading freight is worth that much pay. I have a college degree, master electrician license, a dozen various certifications and many years of experience. I do not earn what these people do, nor do I have their benefits. Give me 30 days on the job training and I am certain I could replace one.

Unloading things is not rocket science. Learn to be safe, move heavy things, learn equipment.

I fired that off right before I rolled over and fell asleep. I woke up knowing it'd probably be too late to delete. Para is right. The harshness was not necessary.

Sal Mercogliano breaks it down. The ILA does have some valid concerns or points its making, but I've never supported strikes. Seems like the ILA was determined to go on strike no matter what.

quote:

Originally posted by gjgalligan:
Re the automation debate:
Not all jobs can be replaced by automation today but as time goes on an lot of jobs can & will be automated. Dock workers, manufacturing, hell even McDonald's is automating. Much of the manufacturing is leaving this country due to labor cost and EPA regulations. EPA regulations are a large part of manufacturing leaving.

So the question then becomes what are workers going to do for income?
Go on welfare?
They can't all mow lawns for a living.

EPA regs are a part of jobs leaving, so are labor costs. Auto Workers wanted/got a raise and a 32 hour work week. The system can only take so much before it collapses.

quote:

Originally posted by ulsterman:
Unions helped build this country but I they have been taken over by pure greed.

Years ago, I met Jimmy Hoffa. After shaking hands with him, someone said "count your fingers to make sure you still have all of them."

I began my UAW membership at GM in Aug of 1969, I am still a member but retired from being an active member in 2012.

While I agree in principle with the greed comment it not just the unions engaging in the greed free for all.
Using my former employer as an example why does Mary Barra (sp?) deserve upwards of $30 million a year. I think there are many people that could be the CEO of GM, she is not the only one.
I recall reading, years ago, of a CEO of Greentree financial (I think thats the name) that made $100 million of pay, stocks, & bonuses in single year.
Greed is everywhere.

The dock workers have a nice side business of smuggling containers in with stuff that isn't legal. That's a big reason they don't want automation or cameras.

I know of no other industry where unionized workers can demand "no automation".

quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Sig:
The dock workers have a nice side business of smuggling containers in with stuff that isn't legal. That's a big reason they don't want automation or cameras.

Been watching the 2nd season of The Wire, have you?

In all seriousness, I'm sure some of that might be going on, but I'm not sure it's a big reason why theyre fighting automation.

quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Sig:
The dock workers have a nice side business of smuggling containers in with stuff that isn't legal. That's a big reason they don't want automation or cameras.
I know of no other industry where unionized workers can demand "no automation".

Wow... I hadn't thought of that.
Of course it makes sense. Some of them, at least, are paid off by smugglers.

quote:

Give their jobs to illegal immigrants, they will do it for 1/4 the price.

Now hang on a second......

Unions like the ILWU endorsed Kamala. Why should they then be exempt from Kamala's policies? Why do they get to support a candidate and then isolate themselves from what their candidate stands for?

Perhaps an example should be made. If you support those that support flooding the nation with cheap labor, then maybe you should be replaced with that cheap labor that you supported being here. Might make others think twice.

To steal a concept from the movie Hot Tub Time Machine: You chooze it, you dooze it!

The influence and presence of organized crime in the longshoreman work environment and unions has long been documented. I am sure that there is plenty of smuggling going on as well, maybe even more of the deadly fentanyl coing in via this route than over the border.

And, as far as the unions go, it isn't so much the wage rates as the work rules that they have imposed on the employers. Situations where "workers" are collecting quadruple overtime for sitting at home watching TV have been reported with some longshoremen making upwards of $400K per year.

Right now is Christmas in the ports (i.e. when they start filling stores and warehouses for Christmas) and it wouldn't be the first time the longshoreman decided to fuck up people's Christmas's by striking. They did it in Port of Los Angeles and Long Beach when I lived in SoCal.

In the mid 1970s, my father was giving my young self a tour of an EMD diesel-electric locomotive. He pointed to a chair and said:

“This is where the fireman sits”.
“He puts out fires?,” I asked.
“No”, he replied, “he tends the fire.”
“What fire?”, I inquired.
“The ones that trains used to have when they were steam powered”, he explained. “Due to the union contract, we still have a fireman, but his only job is to ride in the cab”.

That job has since be negotiated away, but it took decades to do so, and I’m sure it cost dearly in concessions.

This was an eye opener for me about the nature of unions, and was key in forming my opinion of them in my youth. Subsequent personal experience with them has only reinforced my option that they are self-serving, arrogant pricks, who would rather kill an industry than negotiate fair and honestly. Automate the whole affair. I have zero sympathy for them.

As a self employed contractor whose had 60+ IBEW "union grievances" filed against me for using a screw driver to open an electrical panel, I'm sitting this one out.

These F'n people...