I'll give my .02c. I grew up in the Bay Area with a dad who had an early 70s FJ (stock except for 70s vintage knobby tires) we took that all over the state off road.
Fast forward 30 years I had a stock exterra 4wd that I lived. Short wheelbase made it very maneuverable. Did some basic trails in it. Road to Bodie and other Fire roads in the Sierras. Then it was totaled. Replacement is a 2013 4Runner 4wd. Dry capable but haven't really done serious off roaring due to kids and other commitments. A few years ago I started researching a 4wd truck for myself. Was 99% sure I wanted a A Toyota. As noted used is very expensive. They hold their value well. You also don't know what has been beaten on the last 10 years and 200k miles. So I decided to buy new. I had to special order it but I have a 2017 double cab short bed TR Off-road with manual trans. I got it as stripped as I could. I added a steel skid and went to 26575 wheels bigest I can get with no lift. It's not bad. Debating a moderate lift or add a leaf becuse wife wants a travel trailer in the 3500 pound range. Then we can park it in a national forest campground and then go wheeling in the truck.

Anyway. I'd consider new if you can. Yes I have put some money into mine since new and I have a small payment each month. But I know 100% of what has been done to it.

Nice expedition video. But yea, I'm not going to be doing anything like that The bugs / mosquitoes in areas like that are enough to keep me away -- looked like 1000 mosquitoes per square yard of air

Thanks for the ih8mud website -- I'll check it out. Given my budget limitations, seems like my choices will be limited depending on how old / # of miles I'm willing to accept.

I'm still trying to itemize a list of features I should get. I'm probably not going be doing anything that you guys would call off road - probably at most elementary level. But definitely places where my car won't go and want a little extra headroom / capability to make up for my utter lack of experience off road just in case I make a bad decision.

I'd love to buy new but I can barely probably afford 10 year old used.

Still watching the videos -- what is that compressor in the engine compartment they used to fill the tires with air? Is that a typical thing in these types of vehicles? Or is that a special custom thing they did?

Based on your needs and budget I'd buy a 4th Gen V8 4Runner in a heartbeat. It will likely be the most reliable and all-around capable vehicle that you own. If you need more than what it can do in stock form it has strong aftermarket support for whatever level of mods you desire.

I have a 2007 Limited V8 model and a couple of my buddies also have V8 4th gens. We have driven them on hunting/camping/offroading/boating adventures all over North America without ever having a failure across hundreds of thousands of miles. The 4th gen was the only gen that got the 4.7L V8 which is a fantastic engine. Bulletproof and great low end torque for easily climbing hills and obstacles.

It's also one of the only medium sized SUV's that is rated to tow 7000lbs which is a testament to how beefy the drivetrain components are. I have towed a 6200lb boat with it up and down steep unpaved paths multiple times and was blown away by it's performance.

I will never sell mine and often joke about finding another one with relatively low miles to store in bubble wrap for when I finally wear mine out in another decade or two.

Here is mine, still with stock suspension + rear air bags for towing duty:





Here is my buddies SR5 V8 with a minor suspension lift + BFG A/Ts, just before we headed into the Smokies for a hog hunting adventure. The red Tundra TRD also now has a suspension lift + bigger tires. That will be our rig for an out west hunt this fall. It's better at towing and has tons of room for gear but is a bit harder to thread through the trails due to the larger size.

I don't consider four door s.u.v.'s with stock suspensions, high clearance vehicles

quote:

don't consider four door s.u.v.'s with stock suspensions, high clearance vehicles

agree; while some have marvelous traction and considerable scrambling-in-the-rough capability, 'high clearance' is more than measuring dirt-to-differential height on the pavement.

Decades ago big disagreement between buddies that had CJ5 vs the diminutive Suzuki version.

Went on comparative off-road route just for kicks. The Suzuki made just amazing impression up to the point where it quit steering and was otherwise headed for the ditch.

Of course the size/weight/power/traction ratio was very impressive, as was maneuverability. What wasn't impressive, was the little darlin' was just a tad bit too low and picked up a piece of tree pole that rammed itself between front axle, tie rod, & ran up steering column until it levered the front end off contact with the ground. About wrist thickness, it dug down into the ground where softer ground was present; when we came to harder/gravelly surface it just dug in until rear drive couldn't push forward. Both front tires were off the ground, and it was a difficult job removing the little javelin impaling our chariot. No one had seen this happen before.

MB 250GD Wolf

Low mileage used FJ Cruiser. Great 4wd even stock. Insanely high value retention.

Another vote for the 4Runner. Very capable in the situations you cite and durable as all get out. Unfortunately for being a buyer they do hold their value extremely well but it will be to your advantage when you sell/trade later. If you are considering a 4Runner visit www.4runnerforum.org and look around. You can ask questions there and get educated answers from folks that have or do own them. FWIW, the 2014 are highly regarded and seem to command a premium. There are for sale areas that may be of interest to you. The FJ is also good but I found the visibility with the large sail panel C pillar an issue for my taste. You can sleep in a 4Runner but I think it might be an issue in the Jeep. But I must confess for pure 4 wheeling my old Jeep CJ5 was one of the best.

I just bought a two-door Rubicon and I'm just getting into off roading. A trusted friend with experience recommended that my wife and I attend Bill Burke's class in Colorado. We plan on going next year.

Wow. Videos were kinda cool and scary. Hopefully that's not expected at novice levels. I'm not expecting to encounter obstacles like that. Or should I? In any case, I would like to take a novice class once I buy something.

Sun wasn't kind to the camera, but the 80 Series is my choice.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:
Wow. Videos were kinda cool and scary. Hopefully that's not expected at novice levels. I'm not expecting to encounter obstacles like that. Or should I? In any case, I would like to take a novice class once I buy something.

I thought the same thing! I've been assured a student can go from zero to that in two days. What the hell. I've never regretted taking a quality class.

I learned 4-wheeling in a Jeep Liberty (seriously). Now I borrow my wife's Jeep YJ and promise not to break anything. Sometimes I come home and haven't.

My dos centavos: Get anything older, cheap and stock with a low range. Spend your money on good all terrain tires (5 of them).

Go play and learn your vehicles limits as is before you modify it - it won't take long. Use common sense and if it doesn't feel right, don't try it. Use a spotter. Trust your spotter.

Learn how to use and bring recovery gear, safety gear, survival gear, and communication gear if you plan on going far from civilization. Try to go with others, or let people know where you are going and when you should be back.

Stay on the trails, tread lightly, and have fun. There's some pretty stuff out there off pavement.

Todd

 
A shorter wheelbase decreases your chance of getting high-centered. It depends on the terrain you intend to navigate.
 

Question -- I've been watching for 4Runners and other candidates on the road.

One curiosity -- I've seen several 4Runners where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end. Perhaps not dramatically but noticeable. This seemed to be a natural state (ie - nothing heavy in the back).

Is this normal? Why is this? Is this okay? Is there an issue with 4Runners?

quote:

where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end.

...lately I've noticed several dozen new up-scale pickups (usually some kind of hot rodder diesel model) with 'nose up' attitude as well....

Don't know what kind of trend may be involved, but they ALL were packing Cali plates....which is noticeable in Oregon Territory.

quote:

I've seen several 4Runners where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end.

sagging leaf springs. no big deal.

quote:

Originally posted by ScorpionBoy:

quote:

I've seen several 4Runners where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end.

sagging leaf springs. no big deal.

If it's a 4th gen 4Runner (2003) or newer, there's no leaf springs. More than likely it's a spacer kit that somebody has installed on it. Some are better than others with keeping a level lift. Spacers are cheap, but I'm not a fan of them. If you're going to lift, spend the money and do it correctly. Especially on a IFS vehicle.

quote:

Originally posted by signewt:

quote:

where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end.

...lately I've noticed several dozen new up-scale pickups (usually some kind of hot rodder diesel model) with 'nose up' attitude as well....

Don't know what kind of trend may be involved, but they ALL were packing Cali plates....which is noticeable in Oregon Territory.

It's the off road racing look. Think Baja 500 sand and dirt. The high front end helps with hitting bumps that might bounce you into the air--you don't want your truck to nose down into the ground on the landing.

California has lots of rocky trails for crawling, but we also have lots of open desert for dirt and sand off roading.

quote:

Originally posted by MattW:

quote:

Originally posted by ScorpionBoy:

quote:

I've seen several 4Runners where it looks like the front end is higher than the rear end.

sagging leaf springs. no big deal.

If it's a 4th gen 4Runner (2003) or newer, there's no leaf springs. More than likely it's a spacer kit that somebody has installed on it. Some are better than others with keeping a level lift. Spacers are cheap, but I'm not a fan of them. If you're going to lift, spend the money and do it correctly. Especially on a IFS vehicle.

3rd gen 4Runners experience that sagging over time, mine is starting to sag a little.