quote:

Originally posted by Ripley:
I can't let this slide, let's call it a day on the subject.

quote:

Originally posted by 280nosler:
..(Vettel) moving the place placards

I'm not going to lie - this is a despicable sight of unsportsmanlike behavior.

quote:

Originally posted by cfiore:

quote:

Originally posted by 280nosler:

Here is Jolyon Palmer's take on the penalty:
https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/48583803

You obviously are an F1 fan and knowledgeable, however, posting Jolyon Palmer's take on the penalty??? Please!!! Seriously, there hasn't been a bigger no talent F1 driver ever. My God, if he was still driving he would make the torpedo look like Senna. Him and Rosberg are two of a handful of people who see the penalty as warranted.

You obviously also are not a fan of Vettel which explains your seeing the penalty the way you see it.

A fan of Vettel now - no. But I used to be. He lost me as a fan when the whole Multi 21 incident went down. When the wall called Webber and told him they told both to turn the car down and bring it home with Webber 1, and Vettel 2, and Vettel did not turn his car down, while Webber turned his car down and passed him while the wall told him he would not do it, it showed what kind of person he really was. There have been a number of other incidents that he did not apologize for to numerous other drivers (Button, Alonso, a few times with Massa), and I came to realize that he was just as il spirited as Schumacher was at his worst. Does it make him a bad person, no, but he has made no friends on the circuit, and Kimi has so much during the awards presentations last year.

There are few drivers that I think will be well regarded into the future from F1, and while had been able to drive the hell out of the Red Bull, and won multiple championships, he does not seem like one that will be remembered as one of the greats.

As for posting a link to Jolyon, again it is one person's take, and from a RULES perspective, there were really only two outcomes, which I respect the rules. You don't like them, get rid of them and there will (likely) be more crashes, and I won't complain.

Ross Brawn came out today and was quoted that three of the four stewards were in agreement after consulting the telemetry and video feeds.

Again, if you don't like the outcome, we are in agreement, but not liking how the rule is implemented is only the stewards decision, and based on the TECHNICAL rulebook, I don't see any other way.

I continue to say to people, and have yet to have anybody disagree with me, that if this is two backmarkers fighting for 12 and 13 position, this conversation would not be happening.

That was a real yawner, other than the midfield guys.
Tracks with the entire runoff area paved should be illegal.

I think I will take a break from watching for a while. That was the most boring race I can remember. They need to make it more competitive or risk losing more of their target audience, in my opinion.

I'm beginning to think the F1 thread should be moved to "What's Your Deal!"

Kind of seems like the Drivers’ and Constructors’ championships are pretty much wrapped up. Well done to the FIA for not letting teams develop their cars. They’ve achieved their cost savings initiative.

Ricciardo was ballsy with those passes, seemed a bit desperate on the last one & it came back to bite him.
Looked like Leclerc was close to making a move on Bottas, probably would've made it happen given 1 more lap.

Nice nap tho!

I think F1 has jumped the shark

This race looks like it could be exciting but we’ll have to see tomorrow. The grid is certainly mixed up and the Ferraris seem to have found some real pace, at least at this track.

The Austrian race was great, however not without a lot of drama at the end and some questionable interpretation of the rules. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, so I'll leave specifics for another day. We certainly could have had another Canada on our hands.

**kinda spoilers**


By far the best race of the year, so nice to be reminded that F1 can truly shine.

That said, I can't deny some nagging doubts. Was Merc sandbagging? The 2019 season has gotten increasing criticism with each race and the negativity was really building. One race will not change the inevitable outcome for the year, Merc had little to lose. Sorry to be so cynical but I find such maneuvering entirely possible. They've dominated in all weather this year, why not in this weekend's heat? They really never had the pace throughout and that's just not like them. I can only take so much heart in today's results.

Ripley, I think your cynicism is completely justified. Mercedes winning the Constructors' Championship by 400 points is not what the FIA wants. Ticket sales will will start to fall off if this series doesn't become more competitive.

Really enjoyed this race. I also think it would have been criminal for the stewards to have changed the outcome. Glad they didn’t.

Finally a race weekend that was really good!

quote:

Was Merc sandbagging?

You're kidding, right? There is zero chance of that happening. Ever. Testing sessions maybe, but not a race weekend.

Definitely a more enjoyable race.
Glad the stewards left the decision as-is.

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:
You're kidding, right? There is zero chance of that happening. Ever. Testing sessions maybe, but not a race weekend.

I'd like to believe you're right for a few reasons. How can you be so sure?

quote:

Originally posted by Ripley:

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:
You're kidding, right? There is zero chance of that happening. Ever. Testing sessions maybe, but not a race weekend.

I'd like to believe you're right for a few reasons. How can you be so sure?

My only thought is that I can't imagine a premier level team intentionally throwing a race. Doesn't seem to be any upside to that scenario, and I can't imagine convincing the drivers to willingly toss points out the window.

quote:

Originally posted by Ripley:

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:
You're kidding, right? There is zero chance of that happening. Ever. Testing sessions maybe, but not a race weekend.

I'd like to believe you're right for a few reasons. How can you be so sure?

I suppose he can’t “be sure.” Let me ask you to speculate what could have taken place. AMG-Merc decides they’re winning too much and on their own initiative decides to...what?

The FIA is uncomfortable with AMG-Mercedes’ dominance and, for the good of F1 orders them to...what?

Liberty Media...and...what?

What might have happened?

Post race, Hamilton made mention that they were struggling with tire temps.

The track was unseasonably/above average hot.

Some thoughts off the top of my head. Merc has dominated for several years now, the FIA keeps making noise about changing the power unit formula. That's Merc's biggest advantage obviously, they've tried to say the racing was more competitive than it really was, no need to change regs.

Ferrari kind of looked like they might mount a realistic challenge the last few years but by mid season the Mercs magically walk away with it. I'm not overlooking the Ferrari's consistent screwing up -- bad strategy, wrong choices and human error in the pits and behind the wheel. I'll contend they succumbed to the pressure knowing they had no advantage against a clearly superior car. It wasn't a matter of Mercs getting their shit together by midseason, they let the cars do what they can. Merc could claim the racing was close enough til then, no need to change the rules.

Not the same thing but driver orders were the rule of the day at one time, think Schumi and Barrichello, Austria 2003 (?). Supposedly not allowed now, wink wink. There's engineered results right there.

With each dominant year, we find the Mercs on the podium getting booed more and more, not anything they and the FIA can be happy about. I would imagine going into last race, it was clear the stands would be filled with orange. Not saying they gave Max the race, he damned well earned it, but there's no way that crowd would have welcomed Mercs on the top two steps. It would have been ugly. Mercs getting booed is increasingly evident over the last couple years.

And maybe just my imagination but Hammy looked like the cat that ate the canary post race, he wasn't convincing.

I've said this before, I have little trust in the auto business, from the sleaziest used car lot to the top level of autosport, they'll all push the envelope. For Merc the bigger picture is maintaining regs that serve their advantage long term, tanking one or a few races for appearance sake is entirely possible. It's good business.