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Frangas non Flectes
Picture of P220 Smudge
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Thanks for that, I did some digging, and there's a DIY version of the Phokus/Tarsier Eclipse that's super easy and a lot cheaper. Just ordered all the individual components.

You thread in these, then you add these for a sacrificial lens (the UV coating is supposedly so minimal it does about nothing to light transmission), then you snap these suckers in there for lens covers.

So, for about $140, I'm into some refocus devices that should work just as well as a set of $500 Tarsier Eclipses, and give me more flexibility than $220 for a set of Phokus Hoplites. So, more expensive than the tried-and-true Butler Creeks with a .223 case punch, but I'm hopeful the adjustability will prove it to be worth it. The downside is these won't work with a COTI, which for hunting hogs in Florida which being an eventual goal this coming season, is maybe not a huge problem. They may also preclude use of bikini covers. The snap-in covers are nice, but short of sticking them in a pocket, there's no good quick retention method for them because I sure don't want them dangling loose from the unit.

Now for the zip-tie hack for IPD stops, and rear sacrificial lenses. Also going to try to rig a home job with shock cord looped around the bridge and red through a hole in some Onewrap running down the back of the midline of my helmet for retention. If that doesn't work, I'll need to get some split rings for the gaps in the bridge on the front for retention. The bungees on my Ops Core won't reach these, so there's no way to attach them currently. Maybe it'll be the split rings for those to reach and a homejob NERD.

As for walking around the parks by the house, I got a good walk in a few nights ago. Only saw one person out when I went, and it happened to be my next door neighbor walking his black German shepherd... without a leash. I saw both him and the dog long before either noticed me, and both were walking off the path out in the darkness. Rosco ran up to me, barking, and the neighbor had to call him off several times. The second two times, I heard him running up behind me thanks to amplified ear pro. Big Grin

To that end, I figure why not use it? I've got less situational awareness and they contribute a lot of stability when down and closed, so might as well turn them on. Rosco eventually went on his way, and I don't think the neighbor got anything like a good enough look at me to know who I was, but I'm sure my behavior made him uncomfortable at the least. Bizarre and suspicious, to be sure, but completely harmless. I think probably no worse than someone without NODs having a black dog run up and growl and bark at them in the darkness while someone out in the shadows is trying to call them off, at least. I did get a good view of a meteor while I was out! Great place to be for star gazing, and I'm really looking forward to the lightning storms later this year. Big Grin

Splitting my forehead open in the garage several days ago put a serious dent in my nocturnal activities. Had to get a tetanus shot, and the split wasn't long, but it was deep, so they superglued me. Ironically, wearing a bump helmet would have saved me (Roll Eyes). Then I got a raging sinus infection that put me down until today, so I'll be drawing up some plans for a counterweight pouch in Lightburn later this evening and get some Cordura cut. Hopefully get that sewed up in time for me to be healed up enough to get a helmet on without opening this thing back up. Between the focusing lenses, some bungees, and a counterweight on a carbon bump instead of a ballistic, my next walkabout should be much improved!

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Posts: 17229 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A friend has an adjustable iris fitted to his PVS14; he's been pleased with it. The setup he has always seemed a bit redneck, to me; the setup you linked is much slicker.

You're getting into some particulars and terminology that are out of my wheelhouse, when it comes to your other mods and upgrades. I am eager to see what you come up with, for a counterweight pouch. I may email you a picture of mine; it's a bit... different, and I may eventually change it.

I hope to be able to do some shooting next week. I haven't used my NVG in a while; last time it got used was by a friend, so he could get an idea of it. I think that's likely the bulk of my next shooting excursion as well, actually; my friends and I that have night vision have been trying to get others psyched on it.

One thing I have been considering lately is EMP protection for my night vision equipment. I don't care to get into the weeds, in this thread, but, when it comes to NVG equipment, specifically, it represents a huge advantage that I don't want to lose. I have considered "shielding" the smaller of my two safes, where my most-used weapons and equipment are kept, or creating an even smaller shielded container for my go-to rifle and gear.
 
Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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After a decent bit of research, without going down the rabbit hole in earnest, I arrived at the NEST-Z "EMP bag" made by Faraday Defense. It's made in America and costs about $35 shipped. They make it in a few different sizes, but the one(s) I went with are 18x28". I figure that allows space for an upper (or whole rifle if broken down or short SBR), your NVG, a radio, and any other NVG, shooting, or preparedness small electronics. Seems like a minimal investment, when we're talking about potentially protecting north of 6K worth of equipment; not to mention saving a key capability, in that situation that would render the bag useful. Seems prudent to keep the gear in this bag, when it's just sitting in the safe anyway.

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Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
Picture of P220 Smudge
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*Coughcough*These just dropped an hour ago *coughough*

quote:
Originally posted by KSGM:
A friend has an adjustable iris fitted to his PVS14; he's been pleased with it. The setup he has always seemed a bit redneck, to me; the setup you linked is much slicker.


I like it a lot. I was intitally sort of lamenting that I have no manual gain on this unit. I do now! Between the irises and the autogain, there's sweet spots for whatever lightning conditions that give me better focus at all distances. I've even taken to dialing them down to almost nothing on nights with more ambient light to keep from totally blowing out my peripheral vision, and it's very usable. I kind of want to try a purple filter to get me to more of a black and white tone, but that would mean giving up the irises. Down the road, I guess.

quote:
Originally posted by KSGM:
You're getting into some particulars and terminology that are out of my wheelhouse, when it comes to your other mods and upgrades. I am eager to see what you come up with, for a counterweight pouch. I may email you a picture of mine; it's a bit... different, and I may eventually change it.


It occurred to me that with a PVS 14, you probably haven't had to mess with IPD stops. Inter-Pupillary Distance is setting dual tubes to whatever width to match your pupils to get your brain to see one aligned image. In some videos, you'll see guys with them set nearly together, and some guys have them pretty far apart. I'm somewhere in between. Some housings that don't articulate like the RNVG don't articulate, so you set the distance and that's that. Then there's housings where the pods articulate (fold up independently out of the way) like the DTNVS, PVS31A et al, and when you do that, you lose your inter-pupillary distance... unless you have preset stops, so that when you articulate them back down, they're in the right spot. The units mentioned use set screws, which my unit doesn't have, so, zip ties! Haven't messed with it yet, I'm not doing anything "dynamic" enough yet that I need presets.

quote:
Originally posted by KSGM:
I hope to be able to do some shooting next week. I haven't used my NVG in a while; last time it got used was by a friend, so he could get an idea of it. I think that's likely the bulk of my next shooting excursion as well, actually; my friends and I that have night vision have been trying to get others psyched on it.


You go yet? How'd it work out?

quote:
Originally posted by KSGM:
EMP protection


Hadn't even thought of this. Worth investing in, yes.


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Posts: 17229 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
keep from totally blowing out my peripheral vision

That is exactly how I use the manual gain on the PVS14. Sometimes the view through the device is just too damn bright, and it's nice to be able to knock it down a bit. Good to hear that you achieve a similar ability with the iris, as no manual gain has been a hang-up for me as well, when considering the more affordable DTNVGs.

When it comes to the IPD stops, the new arm I got for the PVS14 actually does have that functionality. I guess it'd just be a PD stop, as opposed to IPD, since it's just the one tube.

I was able to use my NVG a little bit a couple days ago, but it was only to walk into the woods in the wee hours, in order to do a bit of shooting once the sun came up. It had been a little while, and I found myself reminded of all the NVG-related weapon/equipment nuances: My Eotech was already installed, but, from there, I had to switch the Vampire from white to IR, switch the Eotech to NV setting, switch IR laser to momentary, and attach my helmet light. We weren't doing any shooting on the walk in, but it's good to go through the motions. When we got to where we were going to establish some targets, and the sun was providing usable light, it was time to switch everything back or off, stow the NVG equipment, remove helmet counterweight and, in my case, switch back to daytime optics. I did not go through the motions of ammunition changes, but that's another potential to-do in the routine, if you opt for a lower flash ammo during the night hours. So, no night shooting, for me or anyone else, but a good refresher nonetheless.
 
Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I did some shooting in the dark a couple weeks ago; I didn't post anything about it, because there wasn't anything particularly interesting about my experiences. As I recalled it over the past while, though, I did determine a couple things worth sharing:
1)A friend works at a store that has a demo Sionyx Opsin; he brought it with him. It's nothing to write home about, as a NV device, in terms of moving through the environment and shooting; the internet has come to similar conclusions.
2)I had previously placed a target less than 50m from a defined shooting position; a 6" steel plate with a ~24" cardboard "iris". After arriving at the shooting position, in the dark, the target was very difficult to spot, even though I had pre-existing knowledge of it's location; the lack of contrast and monochromatic palate of the NVG are a game changer.

I think I shared a video from these guys before, concerning muzzle flash, as viewed through NVG; here's another of theirs, that is more recent. They seem to offer unique and objective observations. Their desert environment eliminates some factors that I have found to be problematic, in wooded areas, but they go the extra mile, compared to most folks. I think I still disagree with their outlook on muzzle flash; I intend to do more experiments on that front, myself. I think that, with the right combination of a good silencer and proper ammunition, muzzle flash can be eliminated, even when observed through NVGs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pQGX4fUg4I

The video I shared before was in a different thread. https://sigforum.com/eve/forum...0105858/m/4650004294

This is one more resource I have found to be objective and insightful.
https://gloomgroup.com/blogs/night-vision-info

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Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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***This is a conversation that started in the GP carbine thread. It needs to be here instead. I copied/pasted context from the GP thread.***

(Me)Another note, which is nothing new, but maybe something I'll start considering with renewed vigor, is white like accidental discharges. A light is something that's always agreed-upon as essential, in the context of a KISS or HD carbine, and it has a place on the GD carbine too, but the context of the GD carbine is such that an activation when undesired could be more consequential than in those other applications. Pressure switches are a tricky thing; we want them to be easy to activate, so they won't cause problems when we need them, under stress, when dexterity may be limited; but the easier we make them to activate, the easier they're potentially activated when we don't want them. All my lights are SF "vampires", so they have White and IR settings; some also have an "off" position; I need to start being more pro-active about using that "off" setting, or perhaps look into some flip-up lens covers, or even just apply some tape to the front of the light, which could be easily torn off.

(Sigfreund)I don’t, of course, know all of your concerns, but about the light problem, perhaps a different model would work better for you—and assuming I understand it.

I prefer the INFORCE models over those having tape switches because I find them easier to operate. For your concerns, they also make it easy to avoid unintentional white light activations. The white/IR models have a rotating lever switch that sets the light to either IR or white. That switch is unlikely to be moved to the white position if rotated to IR. There is also a rotating cover for the light switch that seems to work well.

But for extra security, the light can be turned off completely by just rotating the bezel a few turns. That’s very easy and positive even with gloves.

(Me)I have considered Inforce more than a couple times.

All of the SF Vampire functions are in rotation of the bezel: white, off, IR, and then back the other way. The activation is in a click tailcap, a remote tape switch tailcap, or a combo click and tape switch socket tailcap. The combo is preferred, as you retain a click tail, in the event of tape switch failure. The click tail would be very difficult to inadvertently activate, so the pressure switch is the worrisome point.

A perk of the SF lights, or their derivatives, is the abundance of compatible options from other companies. Unity Tactical makes some very intuitive switches, which work very well for my NV setups. Because my illuminator (the Vampire) and my laser are different units, it can be difficult to activate them simultaneously. Unity makes a switch with two buttons that allows you to activate one component by itself, or both together, by only pressing one of the two available buttons.
https://www.unitytactical.com/...nc-surefire-laser-9/

This takes us back to the Inforce. I have used configurations with a click cap for the Vampire, and a tape switch for the laser; and configurations with an independent tape switch for each item; both require more dexterity than the Unity button, if you want to activate both items at the same time. The Inforce, with it's angled button, would be an in-between, relative to the two aforementioned configurations. It sounds like the Inforce has every feature of the SF light, minus the availability of remote switch support, which can make the difference. All depends on what the user wants/needs. If not using a separate laser aiming tool, that he'd want to sometimes activate at the same time, the Inforce would be a just-as-good, and likely more cost effective option, compared to the Vampire.

(JoshNC)A friend taught me to place the white light activation button sufficiently behind the IR activation button, so it is a very conscious effort to fire the white light. My DIR-V and white light both get their own Modbutton Lite.

Inforce is hot garbage compared to Arisaka/Malkoff, Modlight, and SF options.

(Me)Do Arisaka/Malkoff and Modlight have "off" functions? It seems they don't have White/IR combo heads. I am not going to bat for Inforce, or any other brand, but the all-in-one functionality offered by the SF and Inforce is pretty slick; especially for my application. Considering I use IR OTALs on a few of my guns, the combo light gets me an IR illuminator and a white light which, when combined with the OTAL, makes for a total package really no larger than a PEQ15 (though lacking a visible laser); on my rifle with a PEQ, I need to put a white light on another rail. With a MFAL, like the PEQ, I need to use the dial to choose whether I want just pointer, just illum (why?), or pointer and illum. With those functions on their own switches, or an evolved button like the Unity, I can decide on the fly, without having to fiddle with a small dial on the MFAL. There are some MFALs that have this ability, with two remote jacks. The DIR-V may have similar functionality, if you can have the on-board button do one ting, while the remote does another; say so, if that's the case.

Also, considering my use of the combo lights, a white light AD at night, because I pressed the wrong button, isn't what we're talking about here. That is an impossibility, because my light is set to "off" or IR in the dark hours. A white light discharge during the day isn't good either, and I am not talking about my grip activating it while shooting; both my ADs the other day where while I was moving through the woods. In one instance, I had to stabilize a duffel with range equipment on my shoulders with one hand, while I controlled my muzzle with another, while I crouched under a fallen tree. It was a situation that had my focus in a few different places, and I failed to spare enough of said focus to avoid hitting my button. A button can be hidden and shielded, to help avoid something like this, but then it's just harder to use when you need it.

Sometimes, the weapon isn't the focal point of what we're doing; we're not holding it in any of the "ready" postures. I have heard it more than a few times, from more than a few people with more experience than I'll ever have, in interviews or statements in print or video form, that the concern of white light ADs is highlighted when negotiating obstacles or stowing the weapon. If you are clambering over something, and need to grasp your weapon in a hurried manner so it doesn't smack it's optic on something, or sweep it's muzzle across your buddy, you likely don't have the focus to ensure you don't grasp your pressure switch that is "sufficiently behind the IR activation button". Or perhaps you need to hand your weapon to a buddy, or take his from him, so that either of you can navigate some hazard with more agility; you can eliminate the extraneous need to say something like "watch out for my white light pressure pad". Your switches may be laid out in a way that prevents accidental activation when you have your hands deliberately placed on your weapon in a shooting context, but that simply isn't always the case. I don't know all there is to know, and I often like to discuss hypotheticals; I also sometimes fall victim to my "flavor of the week", or become temporarily enamored with some new thing I've got going on, and sing it's praises before discovering it's faults. This white light discussion is based on my experiences, which are echoed by experiences of others more experienced than I.

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Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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You can turn off the white light simply by unscrewing the tail cap a bit. SF Vampire head is not really necessary if you are using an IR laser/illumination that actually has good IR illumination.

KSGM, I know you want to use your nods passively through a red dot so my setup is not really what you may want/need.

I’m shooting a night 2-gun match in August. I just snagged a m300V and RMR for my handgun to use for the match. I’ll obviously be shooting passively with that setup.


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"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2327 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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What device in the dual IR laser/illumination category actually has decent IR illumination on par with a surefire dual head. I've tried a bunch and none are even close.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 11020 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
simply by unscrewing the tail cap a bit
Sigfreund said the same thing, and it snuck past me; that is a simple and effective solution indeed.

Our NV priorities and setups are definitely quite different. Funny how there's niches in something already niche. I don't get wrapped up in the illuminator power thing; I have full-power PEQ, but it doesn't get used much; I also have a TNVC Torch Pro MKIII, that I use handheld. I find the Vampires to be adequate for as far as I can see to shoot, in most cases; they seem to do quite well, out to 100m or so. I know a guy that has some clip-on stuff, and he appreciates high-powered illuminators in longer-range applications; he has a MAWL, among others, and is the guy who recommended the TNVC Torch.

Perhaps somewhat ironically, I wish my OTALs had less power. It seems every C-class laser is just goosed up to the max allowed output, which can cause some unwanted bloom. The low power settings on restricted units are quite nice to have. If a Holosun wasn't Chinese, I'd consider one of them, as they have a nice low-output setting.

As I have said before, I am anxious to hear about your 2-gun event.

***Also, the on-the-fly control of only pointer or pointer+illuminator is something that certainly shouldn't be discounted, when considering the different setups.***

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Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A point on top of my point. I want good/great IR and visible illumination out to maybe 100y. That's my terrain and my sensitivity to a decent identification. Maybe if I lived in the desert I'd choose differently. The SF is terrific at that.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 11020 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
What device in the dual IR laser/illumination category actually has decent IR illumination on par with a surefire dual head. I've tried a bunch and none are even close.


MAWL-c1 and DIR-V both have excellent IR illumination. Better than the SF vampire series. And have the ability to switch between CQB and further distance. Add in the benefit that they are integrated into and slaved to the IR aiming laser.


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2327 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by KSGM:

Perhaps somewhat ironically, I wish my OTALs had less power. It seems every C-class laser is just goosed up to the max allowed output, which can cause some unwanted bloom. The low power settings on restricted units are quite nice to have. If a Holosun wasn't Chinese, I'd consider one of them, as they have a nice low-output setting.


This is where the MAWL-c1 and DIR-V shine. Their use of VCSEL for IR makes them outperform other civ power lasers.

The form factor of the DIR-V is so good, as are the controls. It’s a worthwhile gamble to try one. I think you’ll be very pleased with it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: JoshNC,


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"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2327 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I didn't know the VCSEL technology affected the characteristics of the pointers as well; that's cool.

I know things like the MAWL and DIR-V perform at a higher level than my setups, and I'd like to have either. I'm honestly not sure what I'd do different, if I could turn back the clock, when it comes to the gadgets.
 
Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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JoshNC and hrcjon: What kind of practicing do y'all do, when it comes to NVGs? Any particularly unique drills?
 
Posts: 2210 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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MAWL-c1 and DIR-V both have excellent IR illumination.

Yup OK. but my point was dual or am I missing something in this discussion.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
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or am I missing something
Maybe. Most of my setups have a SF Vampire as my sole source of IR illumination, which is why he is saying I am at a disadvantage. Though you like the Vampires, do you have a more powerful illumination source on the gun?
 
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quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
quote:
MAWL-c1 and DIR-V both have excellent IR illumination.

Yup OK. but my point was dual or am I missing something in this discussion.


It was me missing your desire for dual. You’re selling short both your IR and visible illumination by using the dual Vampire head. With current tech, why make integral dual illumination a requirement for anything but a handgun?

Additionally, integral IR laser and illumination allow the illumination to be slaved to the IR aiming beam.

Are you using passive aiming through a red dot?


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2327 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
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Paying attention since you guys are talking about what I'm getting into next. I have no IR illumination anything.

I keep seeing recommendations for just getting an Inforce for a dedicated helmet light, but I tried a Streamlight TLR on an ARC picatinny section and hated that I had to use my head to direct the hotspot, so I want more articulation than something like a Thyrm Variarc would give me. That combo would at least be the cheap option for direct and umbrella lighting for indoors, though. We'll see. The cool kid option is an S&S M-AX and either the Surefire KM2 head or Modlite or Arisaka/Malkoff. You can get far more powerful heads with the latter, but they're IR only, and I think I want IR and visible for a helmet light, plus, I'm not sure I need 800-1,100MW of IR light attached to my head, and I say that as a lumen junkie. Autogate only needs to get pushed so hard, and I only need so much where I live. Decisions to weigh.

A friend of mine ordered a Somogear potted UHP in tan with green laser and then decided he didn't want it before it even arrived, so I bought it off him and it'll be headed my way soon. I'll get to weigh in soon on how the "good enough" knockoff stuff performs. They started off kinda shaky, but they've been rapidly improving with each revision and this is the most recent run of them. Is it a legit PEQ15? No, but I'm into proof of concept for a couple hundred bucks vs spending a few grand and always at the mercy of a CID investigator telling me "give it back." I really wish someone made a decent quality integrated unit in the US in the $500 range. Let's be honest, it's a fucking box with a couple of diodes and lenses filled with epoxy. It's not the black magic that imagine intensifier tubes are. Magpul can, and should get into this market. A compact, narrow footprint unit with a 700mw coaligned green and IR laser that comes with an Arisaka 250 head for $500 made from their World Famous Polymer would kill the market for the Chinese stuff (at least from everyone who isn't an airsofter) and it would force Steiner to clean up their act. Phantom Hill CTF3 would be great, but they don't have the manufacturing capability Magpul has.


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Posts: 17229 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by P220 Smudge:

A friend of mine ordered a Somogear potted UHP in tan with green laser and then decided he didn't want it before it even arrived, so I bought it off him and it'll be headed my way soon. I'll get to weigh in soon on how the "good enough" knockoff stuff performs. They started off kinda shaky, but they've been rapidly improving with each revision and this is the most recent run of them. Is it a legit PEQ15? No, but I'm into proof of concept for a couple hundred bucks vs spending a few grand and always at the mercy of a CID investigator telling me "give it back."


I say don’t go cheap to make a proof of concept for yourself. IR laser/illumination for use with nods is well vetted at this point. You’re only throwing good money away on garbage Chinesium.

Buying a full power PEQ15 makes less sense as a civilian than buying a MAWL-C1 or DesignateIR-V. The IR laser and illumination on the MAWL and DIR-V are everything you could ever need as a civilian.

The DIR-V is $2k. Combine it with an Arisaka m600 body and Malkoff head, Arisaka mount, and you have a very capable setup worth owning.


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
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