quote:

Originally posted by RichardC:
Very good, Noah and 92fstech!

Was just telling one of my employees, never marinate squirrel with Kraft Italian dressing. Its bad.

Can't even remember why I thought that would be a good idea many years ago ...

Lol, well that's good to know as I might have tried that someday...I marinate lots of stuff in Italian dressing, and usually it turns out pretty good. I'll take your word for it on the squirrel, though!

I boiled it, deboned it, and pan fried it with peppers onions and mushrooms and ate it like a Philly cheese steak. It was pretty good.

I must confess to a guilty pleasure. Last weekend I obtained (from Walmart on a Sat afternoon) some steel BB's and Crosman airgun oil.

Prepped the DPMS SBR select fire CO2 BB gun with Bushnell LilP mounted, loaded ten BB's in the magazine and machine gunned the bunny at 40 feet.

They cut flaps instead of nice holes and sent more than one through the same flap, but a few got into the kill zone.

I struggled to be steady on the NRA targets. Wobble city. Running the Stihl chainsaw for a fairly rough 1.5 tanks of gas before shooting likely didn't help. 262 total, using the Kimber sporter classic.

Not bad at all, fritz.

Nice shooting, Fritz! This one, like most bullseye type challenges, definitely proved to be tougher than anticipated. Oh, and Richard, I love that you machine-gunned the bunny !



Looks like RichardC pulled off the win this week by two points! Nice shooting sir! Whatcha got for us next?

OK.

I have an idea but need to measure target dimensions before posting the setup.

Modified Bill Drill. Target zone represents central nervous system hits.

Paste a 2" by ~29" stripe on any backer.

Any centerfire handgun, any sights.


Facing away from target at 7 yards, turn, draw and fire 6 rounds quickly. Do not draw before fully turned!
Shoot 3 separate strings for 21 lol 18 rounds total, faster each time.
Only hits cutting the tape count.

Use a shot timer if feasible.

I tried laying it out on a used IDPA target with painter's tape. Hope this works on the range.




Reference: https://www.shootingillustrate...heck-the-bill-drill/


Side match for angry lesbians, place all shots in the 'nads (the bottom six inches of tape in the "3" zone on this IDPA target.)

Interesting...definitely a different variation on your typical silhouete-style target. We'll see how this one goes. Any time limit, or just increase the speed on each iteration?

"For the basic Bill Drill, the most commonly stated goal is to run it in 2 seconds. Bear in mind, accomplishing that would make you a master-class shooter, so don't be disappointed if your time is somewhat slower. Most good shooters can do it in 4 seconds, and a reasonable goal for mere mortals is 3."

Edit: the basic drill does not include turn and draw, so our times may be 2.3 seconds or so.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RichardC,

Well, we'll give it a try!

Shot it today...boy was that humbling! We used a P320 Carry, without the red dot just to keep Noah happy.

My results:

5.27 seconds with 3 hits on the tape
5.96 2 hits
5.49 2 hits


Noah's results:
4.73 2 hits
4.85 1 hit
5.14 2 hits


Having the long strip of tape wasn't a huge advantage...the width just makes for a very narrow target area, and it's easy to drop them left or right. This is definitely none I want to shoot a few more times over the next couple of weeks to see if I can improve.

ETA: we did do the turn and draw, so I guess that just gives us an excuse to shoot it again without doing that and see if we can put up some more respectable times...maybe try to get more rounds on target this time too!

I tried it after our bowling pin match with the pin gun: iron sighted CZ TS .40 S&W 165gr ball.

Using the Dry Fire Par Timer app on my phone, I set par times at 6 seconds for the first string, 5 for the second and four for the third.

I can hear the start and stop beeps clearly when the phone is cabled to my Impact Sport ear muffs.

String 1 < 6 seconds X 4 hits
String 2 < 5 seconds X 3 hits
String 3 < 4 seconds X 3 hits

Then I tried it with three strings at <4 seconds par time.

Cerebrum: 4 seconds? Buck fever! Panic city! You gonna die!
Amygdala: Copy that. Commencing sympathetic nervous system overload.

String 1 1 hit
String 2 2 hits (I had thought to slow it down. Heard the stop beep and only got off four shots.)
String 3 3 hits


"Most shooters have a tendency to go for speed when they first start the Bill Drill, which often results in poor sight alignment and misses. "

OK, I've got that covered.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RichardC,

Turning around, drawing from a holster, then shooting quickly is not something I practice. Might have done this once before in a Rifles Only carbine course. Maybe. I think this drill can easily be described as "outside my comfort zone." I used standard file folders and some painters tape, with the targets roughly at torso height on a ravine bank.

Sig P6. Not fast -- first shots of the strings were generally around 2.5 seconds.
6.92 seconds, 3 hits
6.27 seconds, 4 hits -- then realized it probably wasn't best to stack shots on top of other -- time to aim at a different place on the target
6.51 seconds, 5 hits



Next try was Glock 17. Still slow -- first shots in strings around 2.3 seconds.
5.97 seconds, 2 hits
6.38 seconds, 5 hits
6.28 seconds, 2 hits



Final go with Glock 17, and an 8" A-zone circle of the IDPA. 6/6 for each string.
4.15 seconds
4.03 seconds
4.32 seconds

Trying to keep everything on that vertical line is tough. One would thing that with a proper stance and grip, the gun would recoil straight up and down and you could do it pretty quick, but clearly I'm still introducing some side-to-side force on the gun somewhere in the process.

I was out there again today trying to verify function after doing some magazine work on my new MkIV Tactical (more on that in another thread when I get a chance to take some pictures and write it up...long story short, I'm glad I didn't trade my MkII on this thing). The tape was still up, so I dumped a couple of mags on it. Obviously it's easier with the reduced recoil of the .22, but I still outran my sights and dropped quite a few off the sides of the tape. I need more work on this.

That s pretty good, 92fstech.

As an exercise, I think the Bill Drill is intended to be approached by shooting as slow (but cadenced) as need be to land 6 hits, and gradually decreasing the time elapsed, still 6 for sure.
I have more tape, and I broke down, ordered a shot timer from Midway yesterday.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RichardC,

I received my CED 7000, and am learning to use it at home.

On settings "RO" and sensitivity "8", it was able to accurately record sort-of Bill Drills from a CO2 pellet revolver.

Nice! I've not tried to time a pellet gun with my pocket pro yet, but I've had to clip it to the front of my shirt on occasion to get accurate readings out of some rimfire guns.

quote:

Originally posted by 92fstech:
We used a P320 Carry, without the red dot just to keep Noah happy.

It would be interesting to run it with and without the red dot, incorporating the turn, draw and fire protocol.

Especially if we wanted to stir the fecal stew in the https://sigforum.com/eve/forum...0601935/m/3360027974 thread.

That's not a bad idea at all....and I may give it a go if I can sneak away to the range today. Finally have a couple of days off....sort of. Have to go in for four hours tonight and tomorrow night, but that's better than the 15-16 the last few days have been. And I finally got around to loading up some 9mm last week, so I've got the ammo to do it with. If nothing else, it'll show how much I suck both with and without the dot !

Well, I gave it a go. I'm not sure what the numbers indicate, aside form that I'm slow:

With dot, No turn:

6.05 Seconds, 5 Hits
5.86 Seconds, 5 Hits
5.48 Seconds, 4 Hits

With Dot and Turn:

6.59 Seconds, 4 Hits
6.17 Seconds, 4 Hits
6.05 Seconds, 5 Hits

No Dot, No Turn:

6.32 Seconds, 5 Hits
6.29 Seconds, 3 Hits
5.76 Seconds, 5 Hits

No Dot, With Turn:

6.57 Seconds, 3 Hits
6.18 Seconds, 2 Hits
5.70 Seconds, 3 Hits

I also took along the S&W 32-1, because I came into some free cast bullets and wanted to do some load development for it, and it holds six, so I figured what the heck. I didn't have a holster for this one, so they were shot from the low ready, with no turn:

5.36 Seconds, 4 Hits
5.17 Seconds, 5 Hits


My groups were definitely tighter with the dot...less vertical spread, but it still didn't stop me from dropping some off of the tape.



This was after the last run with the P320 (I taped between each run so that I could get a correct count). I used a pre-existing cardboard backer at the range, so those holes weren't all from me, but you can clearly see that most of my misses were left. I also thought it was interesting that I just kind of naturally gravitated towards the vertical center of the tape....probably 80% of my shots hit the same 3" section of tape, even though I had a whole 20+ inches to shoot at.