A short while back my son had another autistic rage incident and it's been suggested that we move him into a group home. We toured a couple and decided against them so far. First he'd be too far away from us and second the group homes left a lot to be desired in cleanliness and organization. That's to be expected from government facilities.

Recently, we've come upon a property with a main house and a rental that's been on and off of the realtor list over the past few years. I think businesses haven't snatched it up because it's zoned as agricultural. We were thinking of checking it out for a short while and today is the day we go look.

We're mostly debt free (except for a small HELOC that we could pay off today and a couple credit cards with about $100 on them that are used for shopping and gas). We made a couple of significant improvements on this house but none of us have any emotional attachments to it. The new place ticks a significant number of boxes for us (almost 5 acres of land, garage space, office space, it's in a township not in the city proper which offers lower taxes and less restrictions on what you can do with the property, my son will be nearby without being dangerous to my wife, and he'll be eligible for more services considering that he will "officially" be living in his own house). We can finally plant the garden we've been wanting along with fruit trees. We can finally feel ok about moving my son out without worrying about him being too far away.

The downsides are that we really don't want to go into debt again and worry about paying a mortgage all over again. We're really not sure that we can swing it as it would be like buying this house all over again as the new property is priced almost twice as what this one is worth. We were considering renting this one instead of selling but we've both heard horror stories about renting. That would probably give us more money after about 7 years and a constant income but do we really want to have that hassle?

I'm not sure the houses on the new property are in move-in condition, I'll find out tonight. I do know it's going to need improvements that we've already done at this house.

The main issues are safety for the family and freedom from city living. I'm just a little concerned considering the price but I'll also be able to have room for expansion of the business and probably be able to order more supplies to get bulk discounts.

Not sure if I'm asking a question here but if you have any insight on buying a property on the cusp of your financial abilities let me hear it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mark123,

Sometimes the piece of mind is worth the price. Good Luck.

I forgot to say that we're 54 and tired. I'll admit I've gotten a bit lazy. I hope I'm capable enough to do all the improvements.

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:
I forgot to say that we're 54 and tired. I'll admit I've gotten a bit lazy. I hope I'm capable enough to do all the improvements.

I'd say it's not a crazy idea if you were 34 but not so good at 54. It doesn't get easier with age, especially the physical part. Then there's still the financial and debt part and the pressure that keeps on you.
I wouldn't do the rental idea at all. That's not for amateurs. My wife's a Realtor and she won't get anywhere near them except to do the buy/sell part for owners. We are often reminded why that's a good idea by watching others take a swing at it.

quote:

Originally posted by 220-9er:
I'd say it's not a crazy idea if you were 34 but not so good at 54. It doesn't get easier with age, especially the physical part. Then there's still the financial and debt part and the pressure that keeps on you.
I wouldn't do the rental idea at all. That's not for amateurs. My wife's a Realtor and she won't get anywhere near them except to do the buy/sell part for owners. We are often reminded why that's a good idea by watching others take a swing at it.

Well, I'm in better physical shape now than I was at 34 but it sure wasn't easy.

Yeah, I think it would be better to sell the current house. Too many rules and deadheads that know they can play the system.

It sounds like you could be on the right track.

The two pieces for me as I listen to your post is the having your son on the property. I am thinking you are might be giving the good more emphasis than the bad. And secondly, is the new place a good investment. If it is not. Starting out in a hole will not be good.
If it is it can be a springboard financially. But over paying is not a good idea. Especially right now.

Is your son eligible for housing financial assistance if living on his own?

Good luck.

Hard to say Mark. My wife and I bought a new to us, place last October. Our last house was small and we bought before Covid. Our mortgage was like $160k. The mortgage was less than $1k a month. I could be a street mime and pay that.

This house is on a much larger piece of property and is a much larger, much nicer house. The house was twice the cost of the other home. This one costs quite a bit more per month. Everything is more expensive in this home.

I will say it’s a lot nicer. It’s nice to wake up and see an amazing sunrise everyday. It’s nice to have a big backyard and area to grill. It’s nice to have a flat driveway (other one was a 14° slope) and a big garage that I can do all kinds of projects in. It’s a big enough garage that even with the toolboxes and fridge in there, we can still park both cars. It was definitely an upgrade.

It brings about stress. I have to keep a good paying job. This shouldn’t be an issue, as I have always worked, and I’m great at what I do. But like I said, there’s some freedom when you can be a street mime and pay the bills. It has enough expense that I don’t see a lot of money going into my savings account. I had been socking away a lot, that’s not happening like it was.

It also brings some happiness. I see how much my wife loves this house. That makes it quite worthwhile for me. The sunrises are pretty amazing too.

At 44 and 59 we made the choice to leave Washington and move to AZ. It was expensive and we were starting over at that age. Moving into this more expensive home, we were 47 and 62. So I get the part about tired and not wanting to take on a mortgage.

It sounds like the place you’re looking at is pretty sweet. I hope the houses are move in ready and it makes the decision much easier.

Assuming the new house is in a price range that results in a mortgage you can support, once you factor in your down payment, it sounds like a place worth investing in.

Also, in many places the real estate market has cooled - you might not have to offer the asking price.

Bit of advice re: investigating. If you engage with a buyer's broker (who gets paid by the seller's broker via commission split, and costs you nothing) before doing the deal, you can get some independent advice on property values, comparables, etc. A buyer's broker has an obligation to you, and ethics requires them to find stuff out and tell you what they know.

On the other hand, if you sign with the listing broker, be aware that they are 100+ percent representing the seller, rather than you, and are not obligated to tell you everything they know. They can't ethically lie, if you ask them a direct question, but they will not offer. If the market has changed, a seller's broker is forbidden to let you know anything that would invite a lower offer - that would break their duty to their actual client, the seller, to get the best price for the property. The listing broker will do everything they can to try to convince you that you don't need a buyer's broker, because a) that saves them the commission-split and b) if there is something behind the scenes, it makes it less likely that the buyer (you) will find it out without professional help.

RE: what could hypothetically be wrong behind the scenes? Crime stats, school district issues/trends, weakening property value trends, upcoming major developments in the area, troublesome neighbors, liens, tax deficiencies, utilities assessments (current and future), HOA agreements, flood map issues, .....

If repairs are needed after the inspection, the buyer's broker will know people who can do independent inspections, know the good contractors, etc. and if the seller proposes having their own chosen contractors do the work, the buyer's broker will probably have some prior knowledge of those contractors.

I found this out on my first RE transaction, and have had a buyer's broker on my side on every one since.

No, you’re not

Any chance of using part of your new acreage for nursery stock? Adding plantings is a natural extension to your current business model, and the margins can be very lucrative after a few years. This does not even include the possibility down the road of a "Mark's Garden Center."

This strategy has been used by many landscape contractors in the DC area who, after a decade or two of making income from their property, are eventually able to sell it to a developer, as the suburbs expand out to encompass them, and retire on the proceeds.

quote:

Originally posted by joel9507:
I found this out on my first RE transaction, and have had a buyer's broker on my side on every one since.

My experience in the handful of real estate transactions I’ve done is that both the buyer’s (selling) and seller’s (listing) agent get paid out of the deal and their first loyalty is to the deal. A really good selling agent who has a relationship with the buyer will work to find the buyer the property that best fits what the buyer is looking for and close the deal. Don’t look for a real estate agent to tell you the market is too hot right now or talk you out of buying something. That is not their role, regardless of who they are representing.

To the OP’s question, TMats is right on. Of course you are not crazy to consider it. We all make sacrifices for our family, especially our kids. You have a lot to weigh, and only you can decide what is best for your family and for you. If you go through with the purchase, I hope it works out great. If you decide not to purchase the property, you’ll feel a lot better having weighed the decision and thought it through.

quote:

Originally posted by architect:
Any chance of using part of your new acreage for nursery stock? Adding plantings is a natural extension to your current business model, and the margins can be very lucrative after a few years. This does not even include the possibility down the road of a "Mark's Garden Center."

This strategy has been used by many landscape contractors in the DC area who, after a decade or two of making income from their property, are eventually able to sell it to a developer, as the suburbs expand out to encompass them, and retire on the proceeds.

I really like this idea. Although the real estate has made a sharp turn, if you have all equity in your house and the one you are considering can be had at somewhat of a discount, this could be good purchase. That's all from a financial stand point. If the location and situation of it lends to a more comfortable life, all the better.

You only live once.

I’ve always found that taking the risks are always rewarded.

Right before Covid, I purchased a home I thought I could never afford before. Damn thing has gone up value, while providing great respite from this bullshit.

Take care of your family and God will take care of you.

You mentioned this in the other thread about buying a house across the street, and in this thread as well about a 5 acre property, that your son would no longer be a threat to your wife.

I’m not sure I’m reading this correctly, but that’s still much too close in terms of physical proximity to someone who could be a threat to my spouse, even if it’s my adult child.

At the very least, far enough that he can’t easily walk 10 minutes in the heat of the moment.

quote:

Originally posted by reloader-1:
You mentioned this in the other thread about buying a house across the street, and in this thread as well about a 5 acre property, that your son would no longer be a threat to your wife.

I’m not sure I’m reading this correctly, but that’s still much too close in terms of physical proximity to someone who could be a threat to my spouse, even if it’s my adult child.

At the very least, far enough that he can’t easily walk 10 minutes in the heat of the moment.

This is a different property than the one across the street from our current house. Hmmm, she can just not let him in if I'm not at home as he will live at the smaller house on the property.

Not letting some one in vs. someone in a rage that's going to get in regardless of simple measures to not let them in are completely different things.

I think reloader has a good point.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: old rugged cross,

There are decent group homes. They are not run by the state. They are not cheap but they have skilled professionals running the show. You are taking on TOO much imho.

On the simple issue of debt:

I'm a firm believer that once you cross the 50 year old date line, you should start reducing your debt, not adding to it.

Good luck Mark.

Have you ever had the discussion with your son about living on his own. Is there a possibility that he will absolutely hate not having constant contact/influence with you and your wife? I would hate to see you put yourself in a financial hole without a lot of time left to save and your son ends up not tolerating the living conditions.

I don't know what you do for a living but could you get a job closer to the area where the group home is so visits would be easy but your wife would be safe.

I have a long-time friend who has a son with issues similar to Markie’s. As I understand it, his son got kicked out of two different group homes in Montana because he was violent towards the staff, and now HAS to live with his parents who are in their mid 60s. I’m worried about them.

I don’t know if being forced out of a group home is a possibility in the OP’s home state, but if it is, that might play into a decision about the property in consideration.