quote:

Originally posted by radioman:

quote:

Originally posted by BB61:
^^^^
Football is driving the seismic change in amateur college sports. However, let’s be honest, there are a lot of schools in the P5 (P4) that have not had a consistent quality football team since before the advent of the BCS and do not have P5 caliber programs. Their seat at the table is nothing more than an accident of birth so to speak and they don’t deserve to be there. For football, I’m looking at you Duke, Northwestern, Iowa State, Kansas, WVU, Baylor, Arizona State, Stanford, etc., etc., etc.

If football was really about seeing the best programs play in bowl games and for a national championship, you would have relegation like you see in soccer in Europe but that will never happen.

As for the the remnants of the PAC-12, Oregon State and Washington State have not performed as well or better than many Mountain West schools

like you said, football. But, There are something like 12 men's sports and 12 women's sports in the portfolio. Basketball has a life of it's own, but baseball, wrestling, swimming, volleyball and the rest (non football/basketball) seem to be getting the shaft here.

Air travel is routine, but the regional aspect of a conference seems to be going away. Those non-football/basketball students who are actually trying to "study" while competing in a sport will really be hurting. Not to mention added costs associated with all this non-regional travel for the more minor sports that don't get TV coverage.

somewhere there is the person who got the swimming scholarship who is now faced with nationwide travel to compete.

Which the money from the football team will pay for. The Big10 already spans New Jersey to Nebraska & sends a football team to the Rose Bowl every year. If you were a swimmer, would you rather go to Minnesota or LA?

The B1G network does a pretty good job of putting other sports on national TV, as well as showcasing some of the programs from off-field perspective. AND it's not ESPN/CBS/NBC/Fox.

Losing traditions is a downside, but there were traditions before the Big10 that got squashed. We can make new ones. You can only chant 'Ann Arbor is a whore' so many times before it gets old, I'm sure we can bunch up some panties on the left coasters.
Now that it's coast-to-coast, maybe a name-change - it hasn't been 10 schools for 30+ years. I wouldn't go big18 with all the changes going on.

quote:

Originally posted by radioman:

quote:

Originally posted by BB61:
^^^^
Football is driving the seismic change in amateur college sports. However, let’s be honest, there are a lot of schools in the P5 (P4) that have not had a consistent quality football team since before the advent of the BCS and do not have P5 caliber programs. Their seat at the table is nothing more than an accident of birth so to speak and they don’t deserve to be there. For football, I’m looking at you Duke, Northwestern, Iowa State, Kansas, WVU, Baylor, Arizona State, Stanford, etc., etc., etc.

If football was really about seeing the best programs play in bowl games and for a national championship, you would have relegation like you see in soccer in Europe but that will never happen.

As for the the remnants of the PAC-12, Oregon State and Washington State have not performed as well or better than many Mountain West schools

like you said, football. But, There are something like 12 men's sports and 12 women's sports in the portfolio. Basketball has a life of it's own, but baseball, wrestling, swimming, volleyball and the rest (non football/basketball) seem to be getting the shaft here.

Air travel is routine, but the regional aspect of a conference seems to be going away. Those non-football/basketball students who are actually trying to "study" while competing in a sport will really be hurting. Not to mention added costs associated with all this non-regional travel for the more minor sports that don't get TV coverage.

Football and basketball have been footing the bill for athletic departments for the last 30+ years. With the arms race that exists in the revenue sports, all other sports take a backseat or, get cut. The Pac12 prided itself on massive athletic departments, the many championships and its academic standing...however each of the school presidents was unable to walk and chew gum at the same time. Incapable of seeing into the future and anticipating the evolution of the student-athlete and the environment in which they exist; they got outmaneuvered & laped, multiple times by the other conferences.

I used to be a long-time season ticket holder for Cal football, it was entertainment (despite the frustrating losses) I followed the team and did a few road trips but, nothing like the SEC or, B1G. With all this realignment into super-conferences and NIL money getting tossed around, the face of collegiate sports has changed. The Have's have consolidated and the Have Not's will fade away, relegated to lesser conferences where exposure and talent will concentrated to a handful of schools. Football and basketball players will get increased level of exclusivity, their separation from the rest of the student body will increase and the student-athlete experience will become a lament for some. Just get it over with and separate these athletic departments into semi-pro teams.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It is not about the game, it is the tradition. I believe Navy did win one game out of the last 43. BTW Navy now allows players to enter the NFL draft and complete their service commitment later. I have been to a number of Navy ND games and tradition and pagentry stand out. The majority of ND players do NOT go on to play in the NFL. I would not consider the players to be semipro as they have to attend class and meet academic standards.

And then there were 2.

With Stanford, Cal and SMU landing invites to the ACC on Friday, college sports’ conference realignment revolving door of the past three years has finally closed. (We think.) In the end, 17 schools either moved up to a Power 5 conference or flipped from one Power 5 league to another.

But two, Oregon State and Washington State, have been kicked out of the club.

Oregon State just completed a $161 million renovation of its stadium. Jonathan Smith’s football team won 10 games last season and is ranked 18th in the preseason polls.

And yet, it doesn’t have a home.

“I’m sorry that a top-20 football team ends up where we are because of the focus on media rights and media valuations,” Oregon State president Jayathi Murthy said Friday.

With the American Athletic Conference saying it will “not look westward,” the Mountain West seems like the obvious landing spot for the two Pacific Northwest schools, which would mean a precipitous drop from a Power 5 league that distributed $37 million per-school revenue in 2021-22 to a Group of 5 conference whose payout was less than $10 million.

Wow, sorry for Oregon State and Washington State. There was a time in my life where I kinda wanted to go to Wazzu; I thought the Palouse country looked pretty and the connection with the University of Idaho was intriguing (they’re what…30 miles apart?). Didn’t seriously pursue it; couldn’t afford out state tuition anywhere. Anyway, the subject at hand is those two schools and college sports. There was a vacuum in conference leadership in the PAC-12 that led to its demise. It became everyone for themselves and you can’t blame them. I hadn’t heard about Cal and Stanford landing in the ACC, I guess Oregon State and Wazzu are pretty much forced to land in the MWC.

My understanding is both Cal and Stanford will receive partial shares for the first 10-years, then go to full shares. I don't see all this lasting past five years. The travel impact will be crippling to the students, as both school's administrations are nowhere near as accommodating as other schools when it comes to re-scheduling tests and deadlines.

quote:

As an incentive to get reluctant programs to go along with the cross-country additions, each of the new programs will forgo significant revenue, at least initially, with Cal and Stanford expected to accept 30% revenue shares and SMU no revenue at all, at least initially, with the expected additional revenue of over $50 million to be split among Notre Dame and the other 14 full members of the conference.

All three programs are expected to be at 100% revenue share by the end of 10 years with the shares increasing over time until that point. The three new programs are also expected to receive a full share of postseason pe

Whoever is managing the Pac-12 needs to go to jail. I don't know for what, but they need to be held accountable at some level.

Deadline passes for Mountain West, Washington State, Oregon State to renew football scheduling deal

The Sept. 1 deadline for the Mountain West and Washington State and Oregon State to renew their football scheduling arrangement passed without an agreement, and the conference said Monday it is anticipating making schedules for next season without the Pac-12 schools.

Oregon State and Washington State are operating as a two-team league this season and intend to do so in 2025 as well after 10 Pac-12 schools scattered to other power conferences this year.

To fill out football schedules, Washington State and Oregon State agreed to a deal with the Mountain West to play six games against those schools that do not count toward the conference standings. The deal paid the Mountain West about $14 million for this year.

The Mountain West and the Pac-12 schools said at the time they would look to possibly extend the agreement another year by Sept. 1, but the sides could not come to terms.

https://www.dailyrecordnews.co...8d-b3cb751535dc.html

So, first of all it's the PAC-2.

Not surprising, they are in such a state of flux I'm not sure it would have made any sense for either side to make any commitments without more insight to longer term plans. That they got games this year is fortunate for them.

My understanding is that Oregon State and Wazzu both decided they weren’t interested in continuing the MWC football alliance. No word on what exactly they ARE interested in doing, although I imagine they want to try and somehow work their way into one of the remaining Power 4 conferences.

and then there were 6:

Oregon State
Washington State

and as of this morning:
Boise State
Colorado State
San Diego State
Fresno State

not sure how this works, but the new teams are minor league compared to what has been in the Pac-12 in the past. I mean, none of the new teams are worthy of being in one of the "power-5 conferences".


link to news item above:
https://www.espn.com/college-f...ools-set-join-pac-12

quote:

Originally posted by radioman

and as of this morning:
Boise State
Colorado State
San Diego State
Fresno State

My boss went to Oregon State, so I texted him "The Pac-2 is now the Pac-8." I then texted the list of four actual colleges and added Willamette U and Warner Pacific U. He texted back that he hadn't heard that yet. I'm waiting to hear back when he finally discovers the last two are not really joining the Pac-6. Warner Pacific doesn't even have a football team.

quote:

Warner Pacific doesn't even have a football team.

You are a bad man.

This move makes no sense by the P12. They didn't even take the MWC's best schools as Utah State has brought in the 3rd largest amount of revenue over the last five years. In addition, they didn't bring in the biggest media market areas.

In addition,the P12 owes the MWC 40M for poaching 4 schools. This is based on a scheduling agreement/lifeline the MWC threw the P2. On top of that, exit fees for the 4 schools leaving will be a little under 20M as well.

All told the new P6 will pay the MWC about 117M. That might be Texas' and Bama's annual budget but not these schools. The math doesn't add up. And I for one believe these penalty amounts will hold.

On top of that, if everything I've read is correct, the final AAA football break will happen by 2027. And nobody in the P12/MWC will be in that new group. So a lot of money for no long-term or short-term gain.

NIL has killed college sports.