quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:
Protesters in Tehran clash with riot police as they demand the Ayatollah RESIGNS and call for regime change after Iran finally admits to shooting down jet and killing 176 people

Protests broke out at four universities in Tehran on Saturday after military admitted fatal blunder
Angry crowds demanded the Ayatollah's resignation and full investigation into the disaster
Regime forces cracked down hard on the demonstrators, firing tear gas into the crowds
Iranian air defenses shot down civilian passenger plane carrying 176 people, most of them Iranian citizens
The country was on high alert after targeting US forces with ballistic missiles in bloodless strike

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...-shooting-plane.html

There are MANY Persians (Iranians who refuse to call themselves Iranians because they are disgusted by what their country has become) that would love to see the fall of the Iranian regime. I think this outcome is great, let the country unravel from the INSIDE.

The media are downright criminal with their agenda "reporting" and creating narratives.

From the AP: An Iranian general dies in U.S. attack, and innocents suffer.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
I gotta say, the killing of Soleimani was one of.... No, it is the greatest foreign policy decision, maneuver, what-have-you in a generation. No question.

And that's the problem with the media. They were full in on the narrative that there was only two ways to deal with Iran, either appeasement or full out war. This was the Obama doctrine. Trump just proved there is a third option. Deterrence. Frankly, he pulled this whole thing off flawlessly.

Deterrence is a practice that works when you have peers/near-peers facing one another. Trump had the gall and gumption to do what prior administrations were afraid to do, take action.

When it comes to Iran, there's very little agreement on much of anything, thus deterrence only partially works. Whatever diplomatic meetings occur, they usually start with the Iranians reading off a list of grievance and then haranguing the US group, screaming and yelling like children. Seemingly the only thing they understand is an occasional slap or, spanking; negotiation and understanding isn't something that those fanatics understand. At some point, the response will need to be disproportionate.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

*SNIP*..., but it is possible that the first official statement about the shoot-down was what was believed by the top leadership? Do people down the chain, even in a country like that, always provide accurate information themselves? I have long lost count of the number of times I’ve heard someone say, “What? No, of course not. Nothing like that could ever happen.”

During Vietnam, an American plane mistakenly bombed a Soviet ship and killed a crewman. The Soviet premier was furious, and contacted Johnson. Johnson was assured by the military that no American airplane bombed the Soviet ship, until the Soviets produced photos of the dead body and fragments of the American bomb that hit the ship.

The USAF lied about the attack. Naturally, the president thought he was telling the truth and was furious when he found out he had just told a blatant falsehood to the Soviets. Naturally, this did nothing for Johnson's level of trust towards the military.

So, I can see how the Iranian leadership MAY HAVE initially believed they did not shoot down the airliner. Of course, their track record is worse than The Boy Who Cried Wolf, and I am inclined to doubt EVERYTHING they say.


As far as being found out lying; we have all seen how the media and leftists (one and the same, I know) bend over backwards and then some to cover for the Iranians. Even a blatant lie would be guaranteed to be accepted without question in the leftist world. Heck, I'm sure there are millions out there in this country alone that still believe we were responsible for the shoot-down. "Truth" does not matter to the leftists; only what they can spin.

This is why pelossi is running around foaming at the mouth how 'Trump did not consult with congress' over the attack on the terrorist. She KNOWS Trump did not need to, but this is a soundbite that will rustle jimmies all throughout the leftist voting bloc. This is the entire reason behind the 'impeachment' mess - to make Trump look bad. And people who do not think for themselves (leftists) eat this stuff up without questioning it.

quote:

Originally posted by ScreamingCockatoo:
The media are downright criminal with their agenda "reporting" and creating narratives.

From the AP: An Iranian general dies in U.S. attack, and innocents suffer.

And the cowards quickly changed their headline; another case of global fake news.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Balzé Halzé,

^^what a difference from obama in his non-response to the 2009 protests!

https://www.foxnews.com/world/...-death-official-says

US Special Ops tried -- but failed -- to kill another top Iranian commander on night of Soleimani's death, official says

U.S. Special Operations forces unsuccessfully tried to kill another top member of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards’ elite Quds Force on the night Gen. Qassem Soleimani was taken out by a drone strike, a senior U.S. official has confirmed to Fox News.

The covert mission in Yemen, which was first reported Friday by The Washington Post, was directed at Abdul Reza Shahla’i, a commander and financier whom the State Department says was at the center of the botched 2011 plot to assassinate a Saudi ambassador on U.S. soil.

"We have seen the report of a January 2 airstrike in Yemen, which is long-understood as a safe space for terrorists and other adversaries to the United States,” Cmdr. Rebecca Rebarich, a Pentagon spokeswoman, told Fox News. “The Department of Defense does not discuss alleged operations in the region."

U.S. officials that spoke to The Washington Post declined to offer details of the airstrike that failed to take out Shahla’i, but one said, “if we had killed him, we’d be bragging about it that same night.”

Last month, the State Department offered a $15 million reward for information leading to Shahla’i and the disruption of the Iran Revolutionary Guards’ financial apparatus. The U.S. has accused the military unit of financially assisting terrorist groups like Hezbollah and becoming involved in world conflicts through the use of proxy forces.

In December, a U.S. Navy warship also intercepted a “significant cache” of what is thought to be missile parts from Iran headed to Houthi rebels fighting Yemen’s government in a bloody civil war.

“Shahla’i planned multiple assassinations of coalition forces in Iraq, provided weapons and explosives to Shia extremist groups and planned the January 20, 2007 attack in Karbala, Iraq that killed five American soldiers and wounded three others,” the State Department said while announcing the $15 million reward.
......

quote:

Originally posted by ScreamingCockatoo:
The media are downright criminal with their agenda "reporting" and creating narratives.

From the AP: An Iranian general dies in U.S. attack, and innocents suffer.

The AP is as far left as any MSM, not even exceeded by MSNBC. A day after the crash they cited unnamed "multiple Western intelligence agencies" as having cleared Iran of any wrongdoing, and determined it was most likely a mechanical failure as Iran had claimed.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/s...n-crisis-11578702290

Hours after a U.S. strike killed Iranian Maj. Gen. Qassem Soleimani, the Trump administration sent an urgent back channel message to Tehran: Don’t escalate.

The encrypted fax was sent via the Swiss Embassy in Iran, one of the few means of direct, confidential communication between the two sides, U.S. officials said.

In the days that followed, the White House and Iranian leaders exchanged further messages, which officials in both countries described as far more measured than the fiery rhetoric traded publicly by politicians.

A week later, and after a retaliatory Iranian missile attack on two military bases hosting American troops that inflicted no casualties, Washington and Tehran seemed to be stepping back from the brink of open hostilities—for now.

“We don’t communicate with the Iranians that much, but when we do the Swiss have played a critical role to convey messages and avoid miscalculation,” a senior U.S. official said.

A spokesman at Iran’s mission to the United Nations declined to comment on the exchanges but said “we appreciate [the Swiss] for any efforts they make to provide an efficient channel to exchange letters when and if necessary.”

One Iranian official said the back channel provided a welcome bridge, when all others had been burned: “In the desert, even a drop of water matters.”
...

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


I was wondering if something like this was going on.

Speculation:

We hit the general. Iran rattled the sword. President Trump came back hard and talked about broad targeting.

Iran comes back (secretly) and says look we have to retaliate. If we don't hit anything, don't attack us. And then we both stand down.

We say "okay"

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx


Now w super sensitive international communications going on, think about how dangerous these asshole leakers can be. Some jerk like Alexander Vindman or Eric Ciaramella could leak to the press or DEMs and have the whole thing collapse.

Kabuki on a grand scale has prevented many wars

Never liked the Swiss, they make them little clocks, these two cocksuckers come out of 'em with these little hammers, hit each other on the head. What kind of sick mentality is that?

quote:

Originally posted by sdy:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/s...n-crisis-11578702290

Hours after a U.S. strike killed Iranian Maj. Gen. Qassem Soleimani, the Trump administration sent an urgent back channel message to Tehran: Don’t escalate.

The encrypted fax was sent via the Swiss Embassy in Iran, one of the few means of direct, confidential communication between the two sides, U.S. officials said.

In the days that followed, the White House and Iranian leaders exchanged further messages, which officials in both countries described as far more measured than the fiery rhetoric traded publicly by politicians.

A week later, and after a retaliatory Iranian missile attack on two military bases hosting American troops that inflicted no casualties, Washington and Tehran seemed to be stepping back from the brink of open hostilities—for now.

“We don’t communicate with the Iranians that much, but when we do the Swiss have played a critical role to convey messages and avoid miscalculation,” a senior U.S. official said.

A spokesman at Iran’s mission to the United Nations declined to comment on the exchanges but said “we appreciate [the Swiss] for any efforts they make to provide an efficient channel to exchange letters when and if necessary.”

One Iranian official said the back channel provided a welcome bridge, when all others had been burned: “In the desert, even a drop of water matters.”
...

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


I was wondering if something like this was going on.

Speculation:

We hit the general. Iran rattled the sword. President Trump came back hard and talked about broad targeting.

Iran comes back (secretly) and says look we have to retaliate. If we don't hit anything, don't attack us. And then we both stand down.

We say "okay"

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx


Now w super sensitive international communications going on, think about how dangerous these asshole leakers can be. Some jerk like Alexander Vindman or Eric Ciaramella could leak to the press or DEMs and have the whole thing collapse.

Shouldn't this be secret stuff that no one ever know about?? How does this keep leaking out?

quote:

Originally posted by RichardC:
Never liked the Swiss, they make them little clocks, these two cocksuckers come out of 'em with these little hammers, hit each other on the head. What kind of sick mentality is that?

Let’s not overlook their chocolate, skiing, and occasional pistol design work.

quote:

Originally posted by Rightwire:
Shouldn't this be secret stuff that no one ever know about?? How does this keep leaking out?

I had the same thought. We really don't need to know about the back-channel stuff. It's fun to speculate, but if this kind of info getting out endangers it's future use and effectiveness, then it's a disservice to us all.

I hope this movement and the protests inside Iran build to a crescendo.

^^^^^
Dang...President Trump should have written, "Stop the killing of your great PERSIAN people!"

Saw an article the other day, it was called something like, "are the days of secret missions over?"

Had to do with too much technology and seemingly no one being able to keep their mouths shut because there are no longer real consequences for being someones secret source.

I'm going to Google around and find a link for it.

So....there's this....

Report: Obama Granted Amnesty to Soleimani in Iran Deal

This amnesty clause in the JCPOA removed Soleimani from the Treasury Department’s designated terrorist list he had been on since 2007. Before the JCPOA, Soleimani was targeted with sanctions in the United Nations Security Council, by the U.S., the European Union, and the Swiss government.


As if this was not enough, in 2015, the Obama administration warned the Iranian leadership of an Israeli plan, revealing that Israel was closely tracking the Iranian general, thwarting the plans and creating a rift between the U.S. and Israel.

I wonder if Stampy Feet mutters allahu akbar in his prayers.