Bulldozing the site, stashing the black box, lying about things that are as obvious as the noon-day sun...I was going to post a question asking how in the world could Iran possibly think they could obfuscate their way out of this one.

Then it occurred to me that of course they thought they could. Western Europe and several previous US administrations over the years bent over backwards to give the benefit of every conceivable doubt to avoid having to make a difficult decision which might have led to having to actually do something.

There are too many missile pieces embedded with the aircraft wreckage so they’ll come clean..

Iran could have only held onto the lie for so long. EVERYONE knew they shot down the airliner. And as expected, it’s America’s fault- more specifically, Trumps fault.

I cannot WAIT for the impeachment to fail miserably and for the presidential debates to begin. The left has given Trump more than enough ammunition to completely destroy them.

I'm looking forward to the second term, and some serious unleashing on those who seem to work harder to destroy us than to keep us great.

What makes to look worse? When you permanently deny something everyone knows you did? Or admitting it finally after realizing no one is going to believe your lies?

quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:
I'm looking forward to the second term, and some serious unleashing on those who seem to work harder to destroy us than to keep us great.

President Trump is certainly not like most (any?) prior Presidents, so who knows. However, it seems like many Presidents hold back during their first term in order to be re-elected. Wouldn’t it be grand if that were the case with President Trump? Especially if we slaughter the Dems in the house and he has the full backing of Congress?
Then we might get tired of winning, but I somehow I think we’ll manage to hold up and keep cheering for more.

quote:

Originally posted by Rightwire:
What makes to look worse?

If we’re going to have any hope as individuals that we can understand and analyze events like this, we need to also understand that regardless of the source, not every false statement is necessarily a deliberate lie.

I have no great faith in the truthfulness of statements issued by a regime like Iran’s, but it is possible that the first official statement about the shoot-down was what was believed by the top leadership? Do people down the chain, even in a country like that, always provide accurate information themselves? I have long lost count of the number of times I’ve heard someone say, “What? No, of course not. Nothing like that could ever happen.”

A regime that regularly lies about other things may be prone to do so automatically in an incident like this, but was there no one near the top who would have recognized immediately that the truth would come out eventually and that lying initially would only make things worse?

quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:
I'm looking forward to the second term, and some serious unleashing on those who seem to work harder to destroy us than to keep us great.

The one thing I believe Trump will tackle during his second term, and it's a very important thing to me and many people I know. Is fixing the F'ed up Obamacare insurance/health care mess.

Terror Leaders Now Fleeing, in Hiding Because of Trump's Soleimani Strike: Report

Terrorists who sow fear are now living in fear themselves after the precision drone strike that killed Iranian Gen. Qassem Soleimani, according to a new report.

Journalist Sara Carter, writing on her website, said that terrorist leaders within Iraq are leaving the region or going into hiding for fear that they could be next. In her report, Carter quoted multiple sources she did not name, most cited as “a U.S. official.”

In her report, she quotes former CIA Station Chief Daniel Hoffman as saying that President Donald Trump’s “decapitation strike targeting general Qassem Soleimani was a seminal moment, a change in strategy for the United States.”

Carter said that soon after last Thursday’s strike that killed Soleimani, terrorists — many of whom operate with the backing of Iran — were “fleeing” or hiding.

In Trump’s speech to the nation, the president made it clear that the U.S. will not be passive in the face of terror attacks.

“By removing Soleimani, we have sent a powerful message to terrorists: If you value your own life, you will not threaten the lives of our people,” the president said, according to a White House media pool report.

Terrorists In Iraq Fearing U.S. Targeting are Fleeing and Hiding After Soleimani Killing. U.S. Intelligence officials have intercepted chatter and received confirmation that terrorist leaders in Iraq have been fleeing the region and have gone into hiding fearing United States capabilities.

“U.S. officials intercepted communications and intelligence suggesting that terrorists in the region were signaling immediate concerns over Iran’s inability to protect Soleimani from the U.S.,” she wrote.

James Carafano, a foreign policy expert at the Heritage Foundation, said terror groups hoping Iran will protect or avenge them have learned a painful lesson.

“If this is all Iran will do to avenge Soleimani no one can expect Tehran to expend a lot of capital to protect them from the Americans,” he said, according to Carter.

Hoffman said Trump made it clear “that we will deal with everyone’s proxy militia foot soldiers but we will also deal with Iranian leaders who are responsible for making the decisions that put our people and installations in harms way.”

In an Op-Ed on Fox News, national security analyst Rebecca Grant also said Trump’s attack put terrorists on notice that there is a new policy at work.

“The deliberate killing of Soleimani opens a new chapter and shows Trump’s willingness to use military force to put Iran’s terrorist monster machine back in its box,” she wrote. “The aim was to deter future Iranian attacks.”

Granted said some terrorists will risk the wrath of America.

“Expect more strikes on Iranian terror networks in Iraq, if necessary. U.S. forces have the ability to target and strike other Iranian terrorist kingpins in Iraq, Syria and other locations. With or without cooperation from others, U.S. forces can track them down and kill them,” she wrote.

She noted that Trump’s strategy goes beyond payback.

“President Trump authorized the killing of Soleimani not for revenge, but to start shutting down the monster of Iran’s terror network,” she wrote.

“This was calculated to make America safer right now, and over the long term.”

https://www.westernjournal.com...tent=libertyalliance

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

I have no great faith in the truthfulness of statements issued by a regime like Iran’s, but it is possible that the first official statement about the shoot-down was what was believed by the top leadership?

Not a chance in this case.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Not a chance in this case.

As you are so certain, how do you know that? I.e., what is your basis of knowledge?

(A question I used to always ask people who were reporting information about a crime. If, BTW, it is merely assumption based on general opinion about the regime of the “Not all liars are Iranians, but all Iranians are …” sort, that’s fine, but I am genuinely curious if there is more to your statement than that.)

The good news is, they only have one punishment for every screw up....

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Not a chance in this case.

As you are so certain, how do you know that? I.e., what is your basis of knowledge?
(A question I used to always ask people who were reporting information about a crime.)

I'm obviously giving my opinion. Clearly--based simply on the fact that I'm sitting on a ship on the Delaware river instead of in the mullahs' situation room--it is indeed possible from my standpoint that the Iranian leadership truly believed this was a mechanical failure, just like it's technically possible that an alien from Mars is standing on the other side of the bulkhead in front of me simply because I can't see behind there at this very moment.

So yes, it's possible.

Now, having said that, I'll say this again. Not a chance.

Protesters in Tehran clash with riot police as they demand the Ayatollah RESIGNS and call for regime change after Iran finally admits to shooting down jet and killing 176 people

Protests broke out at four universities in Tehran on Saturday after military admitted fatal blunder
Angry crowds demanded the Ayatollah's resignation and full investigation into the disaster
Regime forces cracked down hard on the demonstrators, firing tear gas into the crowds
Iranian air defenses shot down civilian passenger plane carrying 176 people, most of them Iranian citizens
The country was on high alert after targeting US forces with ballistic missiles in bloodless strike

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...-shooting-plane.html

^^^^
Maybe, just maybe, this whole series of events begun with the death of a brutal tool of dictatorship is what the people of Iran needed to topple the madmen that hide acts of global terror behind a religious façade.

quote:

“U.S. officials intercepted communications and intelligence suggesting that terrorists in the region were signaling immediate concerns over Iran’s inability to protect Soleimani from the U.S.,” she wrote.

"Yes, what we do for you will cost you more. Yes, it will be done less often, less aggressively and perhaps less competently. Yes, we're now pricing in exit strategies. Got any of that $1.5 billion left?"

Probably already noted, but does anyone want these poorly educated religious fanatics to have a nuclear bomb after this fiasco?

Also it appears that YouTube has taken down the nutcase melt down of Iran's president. Anyone have a link still working?

I gotta say, the killing of Soleimani was one of.... No, it is the greatest foreign policy decision, maneuver, what-have-you in a generation. No question.

And that's the problem with the media. They were full in on the narrative that there was only two ways to deal with Iran, either appeasement or full out war. This was the Obama doctrine. Trump just proved there is a third option. Deterrence. Frankly, he pulled this whole thing off flawlessly.

quote:

Originally posted by Il Cattivo:

quote:

“U.S. officials intercepted communications and intelligence suggesting that terrorists in the region were signaling immediate concerns over Iran’s inability to protect Soleimani from the U.S.,” she wrote.

Gawd, these people are stupid, ignorant savages. The only reasons we don't remove more threats than we do are: 1. We can't locate them (e.g.: OBL), 2. The collateral damage can't be justified (e.g.: Reprisal for drone downing), and the biggest reason: 3. We choose not to for our own reasons.

That last one was the only reason Soleimani survived as long as he did: Our forbearance.

Here's one theory of why the Iranians shot down the plane:



https://twitter.com/Imamofpeac.../1215897120231714816