The caravan is at Arriaga, Mexico





https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-45999610

Mexico has offered temporary work permits to migrants who register for asylum, as a big caravan of Central American migrants makes its way through the country toward the US.

The plan also envisages temporary ID cards, medical care and schooling.

But to qualify, migrants must remain in Mexico's southern Chiapas and Oaxaca states.

The scheme, announced by President Enrique Peña Nieto, covers Central Americans who have officially asked for refugee status in Mexico or are planning to do so in the near future.

It is called Estas en Tu Casa ("This is Your Home" in Spanish).

"Today, Mexico extends you its hand," President Peña Nieto said.

But he added: "This plan is only for those who comply with Mexican laws, and it's a first step towards a permanent solution for those who are granted refugee status in Mexico."

The plan envisages:

Temporary ID cards and work permits

Medical care

Schooling for migrants' children

Housing in local hostels

But President Peña Nieto failed to explain what would happen to the migrants if they chose to carry on regardless.

The caravan is presently in Arriaga.

Most migrants said they had no intention of abandoning their plans to head to the US.

"The majority plan to cross the border. And that's my intention, too," Jose Santos, from Honduras, told the BBC.

"Because, yes, while life here is calmer than at home, it's still not like the US where it would get better. That's the goal: to have a better life."

Meanwhile, Anna Lisset Velazquez, also from Honduras, told the BBC: "It's a kind offer - but it's not the plan that we have, to stay here halfway up."

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Originally posted by GWbiker:

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Originally posted by flashguy:

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Originally posted by Ken226:

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Originally posted by bendable:
let's see, Irish, asian's, swede's, pole's, czech's, german's,

when you think about it, isn't it just their turn ?

it seems like there should be at least 6,000,000 people here that could scrape up $12,000,000 per year for three or four years to help them get on their feet and become productive American citizens

I'd like to point out that those Irish, German, Polish, etc immigrants came in legally.

Not only did they come in legally, they spent lots of time (in some case, months) at Ellis Island to insure that they were not disease-ridden.

flashguy

And they had jobs waiting for them: Coal mines, railroad maintenance, textile mills, steel mills, road construction, etc...

And, there was NO welfare teet for them to suck on.

You are absolutely right. There were three possibilities when immigrants came here prior to the moratorium in the 1920's - they either made it, they went home, or they died. Now government assists 57% of all immigrants, even higher with Hispanics.

How about a moratorium again on all immigration? Because at the rate we're going, we'll hit 420 million by mid century. If people think we're divided now, wait until then. For a great study on our exploding population, I recommend the book "How Many Is Too Many?: The Progressive Argument for Reducing Immigration into the United States," by Philip Cafaro, an environmental professor at Colorado State University.

And the timing of the caravan to arrive at the U.S. border will be how many days before the election - one, two,...? - so the Left's media coverage can be its most shrill and the progs can be their most emotional? Their methods and timing are getting easier to predict with each manufactured crisis.

And just when my total contempt for Zero is forgotten for a bit, he rears his ugly head in Milwaukee and mocks Americans that want a secure border and reminds me of how much I despise him.

https://www.washingtonpost.com...m_term=.e2526c2abd54

It’s acting more like a welcoming committee.

American Spectator
Brandon J. Weichert

As the totally spontaneous “caravan” of migrants pushes its way north from Guatemala through Mexico and toward the virtually undefended U.S.-Mexico border, the Pentagon proudly announced that it was deploying an additional 800 troops to the southwestern border to augment the insufficient National Guard forces already there. Many on the Right breathed a sigh of relief.

Unfortunately, no one should be relieved.

For starters, the sheer size of the caravan has swelled — according to some reports — to more than 7,000 people. Presently, the National Guard has around 2,100 of its troops supporting the U.S. Border Patrol. Mind you, the U.S.-Mexico border is nearly 2,000 miles long (with little standing in the way of illegal entry).

In April of this year, Secretary of Defense James Mattis approved a memo ordering the deployment of up to 4,000 U.S. National Guardsmen to the southwestern border (provided that the governors of border states approve of the action and that the Department of Homeland Security reimburse the Department of Defense for its troubles). Yet, the DoD instituted such strict rules of engagement for the National Guardsmen that they’ve proven useless to the Border Patrol.

What’s more, the 800 active-duty troops that are being deployed to the border are not charged with providing physical support of the Border Patrol and National Guard. Instead, the Pentagon has opted to send its doctors, lawyers, and engineers. What do you think military doctors, engineers, and lawyers are going to do to turn back the human wave threatening America’s porous southwest? (Hint: they’re not going to physically turn back that caravan; they’re going to accommodate it in all likelihood!)

As I reported earlier this year, the Pentagon has already approved the Department of Homeland Security’s request to turn unused areas of large U.S. military bases along the southwestern border into tent cities. Clearly, the Pentagon has decided to engage in its own bit of policymaking, regardless of what the president has ordered — or what the American people want (and what the United States Constitution outlines).

Remember that treasonous op-ed in the New York Times written by an anonymous senior Trump Administration official detailing the effectiveness of #TheResistance from within the government to Trump?

Since the 2016 presidential election, examples have abounded regarding the corruption of the U.S. government — particularly the national security state. From Peter Strzok and Lisa Page to Bruce Ohr and Christopher Steele, America’s foreign and national security policy graybeards are steadfastly opposed to the presidency of Donald J. Trump — and will do anything in their substantial power to stymie the president.

For instance, in 2017, the president issued an order seeking to ban transgendered individuals from serving in the military. This decision was controversial from a PR standpoint. It was made all the more so because Trump issued the order via tweet, which then sent the paragons of process in the Pentagon atwitter.

During that “crisis,” the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Marine Corps General Joseph F. Dunford, Jr., insisted that the Pentagon did not have to follow the president’s commands unless those orders were written out and sent down through the “proper” chain of command. So, even before the anonymous op-ed encouraging bureaucratic resistance to Trump was published, the military leadership was insulating itself from the president by hiding behind the hallowed process. This would not be the last time the DoD acted in such a self-serving way. In fact, the Bob Woodward book, Fear: Trump in the White House, clearly states that Secretary of Defense James Mattis is not sanguine about Trump’s #MAGA agenda; that he has repeatedly taken steps to limit the purported damage the president’s orders could do to national security.

Taken together, it is clear that the Pentagon today is simply going through the motions. It is as uncomfortable about physically protecting the U.S.-Mexico border as the Democratic Party is. Without a direct, inviolate command from the president explicitly ordering the Pentagon to take decisive actions to physically turn back the caravan, the Department of Defense will slow-walk and half-ass its response to this pending invasion — hiding behind process until the caravan has arrived, and there is no choice but to take the human mass in.

Unfortunately, I worry that even if Trump did issue such an explicit order, the Pentagon’s first reaction would be to “follow the letter of the law” when dealing with the “undocumented migrants.” Yet, if one looks at what this “caravan” isin its proper context — an invasion — then following the “letter of the law” would be to turn the human wave away without taking anyone in. Instead of sending doctors to care for the caravan, engineers to build new homes for the invaders, and lawyers to make them legal citizens, the Pentagon would be sending muscle — and lots of it.

But, hey, the Deep State is gonna State.

Link

If all employers were mandated to use the tools to verify their candidates, the name escapes me, less illegals would be here because they could not work.

Fine employers $500k per illegal and this issue would take care of itself.

No school, no benefits, no housing.....take these away and wpresto chango....no more illegals

That article you posted, JALLEN, infuriates me. And the people that pontificate that Posse Comitatus applies are complete morons. Last I checked, the US Constitution was superior to a statute.

Article IV, Section 4 of the U.S. Constitution

"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence."

I have read, though, that a number of patriotic Texans are planning to form a line to repel the invasion when the military does not stop them from busting through. The problem is, though, that they won't have to rush the border, as it sounds like the military is going to welcome them with open arms.

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Originally posted by marksman41:
And the timing of the caravan to arrive at the U.S. border will be how many days before the election - one, two,...?

More like Christmas if the pick up the pace.

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Yet, if one looks at what this “caravan” is, in its proper context — an invasion — then following the “letter of the law” would be to turn the human wave away without taking anyone in.

Absolutely. Machine gun them down if they attempt to cross the border. Build the Wall!

Now that Active military, as versus National Guard, are being deployed to the southern border, I do hope that plans are in place to prevent a massive surge across the border.

My hope is that various non-lethal methods are set for use (water cannon, high-frequency audio disruption devices, etc), because once a boom-boom cannon is used, things will spiral out of control quickly.

Do you really want to see unarmed civilians (women holding babies in their arms) being gunned down by a combat-equipped military? That happens in 3rd World shitholes, not here. The real threat isn’t a few thousand people at the border, but the tens of thousands of Americans who will react in outrage, no matter what happens at the border, with regard to this migrant caravan.

This could very well be the tipping-point into the chasm of a political black hole that no one wants.

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Do you really want to see unarmed civilians (women holding babies in their arms) being gunned down by a combat-equipped military?

Isn't that the attitude that puts the caravanners in control? Tell me you want to see different methods used, and I'll agree. All too often, though, people seem to think this is the last word in the conversation.

Trump has had some success in putting pressure on Mexico, but at some point there has to be a physical intercession of some kind to prevent them from getting across the river. So, what kind of physical intercession would be morally acceptable to you?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mig...offer-040211669.html

ARRIAGA, Mexico (AP) — Hundreds of Mexican federal officers carrying plastic shields blocked a Central American caravan from advancing toward the United States on Saturday, after a group of several thousand migrants turned down the chance to apply for refugee status and obtain a Mexican offer of benefits.

Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto has announced what he called the "You are at home" plan, offering shelter, medical attention, schooling and jobs to Central Americans in Chiapas and Oaxaca states if migrants apply, calling it a first step toward permanent refugee status. Authorities said more than 1,700 had already applied for refugee status

But a standoff unfolded as federal police officers blocked the highway, saying there was an operation underway to stop the caravan. Thousands of migrants waited to advance, vowing to continue their long trek toward the U.S. border.

At a meeting brokered by Mexico's National Human Rights Commission, police said they would reopen the highway and only wanted an opportunity for federal authorities to explain the proposal to migrants who had rejected it the previous evening. Migrants countered that the middle of a highway was no place to negotiate and said they wanted to at least arrive safely to Mexico City to discuss the topic with authorities and Mexican lawmakers.

They agreed to relay information back to their respective sides and said they would reconvene.

The standoff comes after one of the caravan's longest days of walking and hanging from passing trucks on a 60-mile (100 kilometer) journey to the city of Arriaga.

The bulk of the migrants were boisterous Friday evening in their refusal to accept anything less than safe passage to the U.S. border.

"Thank you!" they yelled as they voted to reject the offer in a show of hands. They then added: "No, we're heading north!"

Still 1,000 miles (1,600 kilometers) from the nearest U.S. border crossing at McAllen, Texas, the journey could be twice as long if the group of some 4,000 migrants heads for the Tijuana-San Diego frontier, as another caravan did earlier this year

At a church in Arriaga that opened its grounds to women and children Friday, Ana Griselda Hernandez, 44, of Mapala, Honduras, said she and two friends traveling with children had decided to pay for a bus ride from Pijijiapan, because the 4-year-old and 5-year-old would have never covered the 60-mile distance.

"It's difficult because they walk very slowly," she said. She pointed out scabbed-over blisters on her feet, a testament to the fact they had walked or hitched rides since leaving their country.

The caravan is now trying to strike out for Tapanatepec, about 29 miles (46 kilometers) away.

Up until now, Mexico's government has allowed the migrants to make their way on foot, but has not provided them with food, shelter or bathrooms, reserving any aid for those who turn themselves in.

Police have also been ejecting paid migrant passengers off buses, enforcing an obscure road insurance regulation to make it tougher for them to travel that way.

On Friday, authorities were cracking down on smaller groups trying to catch up with the main caravan, detaining about 300 Hondurans and Guatemalans who crossed the Mexico border illegally, said an official with the national immigration authority.

Migrants, who enter Mexico illegally every day, usually ride in smugglers' trucks or buses, or walk at night to avoid detection. The fact that the group of about 300 stragglers was walking in broad daylight suggests they were adopting the tactics of the main caravan, which is large enough to be out in the open without fear of mass detention.

However, it now appears such smaller groups will be picked off by immigration authorities, keeping them from swelling the caravan's ranks.

On Friday evening, Irineo Mujica, whose organization People without Borders is supporting the caravan, accused Mexican immigration agents of harassment and urged migrants to travel closely together.

"They are terrorizing us," he said.

quote:

Originally posted by Il Cattivo:

quote:

Do you really want to see unarmed civilians (women holding babies in their arms) being gunned down by a combat-equipped military?

Isn't that the attitude that puts the caravanners in control? Tell me you want to see different methods used, and I'll agree. All too often, though, people seem to think this is the last word in the conversation.

Trump has had some success in putting pressure on Mexico, but at some point there has to be a physical intercession of some kind to prevent them from getting across the river. So, what kind of physical intercession would be morally acceptable to you?

Arrest them and send them back home.

The problem is that the law doesn't necessarily allow that which is leaving us with few optons. This is why our immigration laws need to be changed. This is a failure of our law makers.

As sdy's post above reports, the president of Mexico has offered the caravan asylum, work permits, medical care. Which they have rejected, because they are not refugees, they are political activists. The numbers have dwindled because so many in the caravan are criminals and gang members, they have prompted others to escape them. Here is a money quote from the article:

"They're political activists hell-bent on teaching Trump a lesson and helping themselves to the U.S. taxpayer-paid goodies, not people fleeing violence and grateful for whatever they can get, the way real refugees, such as the fleeing Venezuelans, are. These mostly military-aged young men, often with criminal records, have a message to send, and they're happy to act as pawns for their NGO masters."

A few rows of concertina wire, which can be laid quickly in a very wide swath, backed up by water cannons and tear gas will stop them. Rubber bullets and batons for anybody who gets past that.

https://www.americanthinker.co...offer_of_asylum.html

quote:

Originally posted by justjoe:
As sdy's post above reports, the president of Mexico has offered the caravan asylum, work permits, medical care. Which they have rejected, because they are not refugees, they are political activists. The numbers have dwindled because so many in the caravan are criminals and gang members, they have prompted others to escape them. Here is a money quote from the article:

"They're political activists hell-bent on teaching Trump a lesson and helping themselves to the U.S. taxpayer-paid goodies, not people fleeing violence and grateful for whatever they can get, the way real refugees, such as the fleeing Venezuelans, are. These mostly military-aged young men, often with criminal records, have a message to send, and they're happy to act as pawns for their NGO masters."

A few rows of concertina wire, which can be laid quickly in a very wide swath, backed up by water cannons and tear gas will stop them. Rubber bullets and batons for anybody who gets past that.

https://www.americanthinker.co...offer_of_asylum.html

Bingo! This 3rd world garbage refusing Mexico's offer of asylum, support, and potential citizenship should be all the US needs to refute their claim of refugee status and turn them back at the border. And I wholeheartedly agree. Get the concertina wire on the ground and deterrents behind it, and do 'whatever' is necessary to keep them from stepping foot onto US soil. The hell with what the world community thinks. Sometimes doing what's right is not always popular with everyone.

As has already been said by myself and others in this thread, it is time for an executive order that halts current immigrant refugee rights (yes, they are invaders, but it needs to be inclusive).

Let them walk across the border, truck them immediately to waiting planes, and fly them back to wherever the hell they hail from. They’ll certainly try again, but not in this “show for the media” iteration. But there is nothing to say that the temporary halt to immigration rights to our sovereign soil has to be reinstated anytime soon. Or at all.

Give it a day or two of discussion on the floor to flush out the traitors and accomplices to the assault on our country for mere votes. Put them in the spotlight. I guarantee most Americans do not want a flood of undocumented anyones coming in willy-nilly.

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:
Give it a day or two of discussion on the floor to flush out the traitors and accomplices to the assault on our country for mere votes. Put them in the spotlight. I guarantee most Americans do not want a flood of undocumented anyones coming in willy-nilly.

And therein lies the issue. The Repub's are simply pandering to us right now because of Trump and that it buys them votes, but they don't really care about this inflow of human garbage into the country. Obviously the Dem's welcome it with open arms as they see political advantage in diluting the voting populace in this country. Both groups are completely at odds with the citizens of this country that over and over again, through poll after poll have shown they want this nonsense stopped. So I ask you. What happens when governments become detached, insulated, and completely unwilling to support the people who give them their power? Anger, distrust, and violence usually are the result as such governments are ignored. If things don't change, we're not far from a similar outcome.

Concertina wire, etc. would have to be deployed within Mexico to avoid problems with current law (which requires judicial examination prior to ejection for anyone actually reaching the US). Do we have Mexico's approval to do that?

Ideally, there is time for Congress to pass a law making it possible to simply turn around anyone crossing the line illegally without judicial action; anyone seeking asylum could then make application the right way (from inside Mexico). Don't hold your breath, though.

flashguy

quote:

Originally posted by flashguy:
Concertina wire, etc. would have to be deployed within Mexico to avoid problems with current law (which requires judicial examination prior to ejection for anyone actually reaching the US). Do we have Mexico's approval to do that?

The absolute best way to manage this whole clusterfuck is to stop them in Mexico, stop them way before they are near the border. IMO, this is critical.

quote:

Originally posted by Il Cattivo:

quote:

Do you really want to see unarmed civilians (women holding babies in their arms) being gunned down by a combat-equipped military?

Isn't that the attitude that puts the caravanners in control? Tell me you want to see different methods used, and I'll agree. All too often, though, people seem to think this is the last word in the conversation.

Trump has had some success in putting pressure on Mexico, but at some point there has to be a physical intercession of some kind to prevent them from getting across the river. So, what kind of physical intercession would be morally acceptable to you?

I fully agree with tanglefoot concertina wire, water cannon, sonic disrupters, economic pressure on the countries with citizens in this, etc. Hell, even non-lethal chemical dispersal systems is OK by me. Anything of a NON-LETHAL force, unless they begin shooting at you first. It’s when the machine guns get turned toward those people, that’s when things are really going to go to shit fast. Further, would that even be a “lawful order” for the military to follow; and would they? Think of how many hoops they have to jump thru just to kill the known bad guys at their locations. What are the Rules of Engagement (ROE) against border jumpers?

Tell me how well things went with Czarist Russia on Bloody Sunday in 1905. Tell me how things went in British India at Jallianwala Bagh in April 1919. The visual optics would be horrendous.