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Member |
Yes, it will continue to happen. I have no issue with officers at risk err'ing on the side of their safety. Innocent people will get hurt. What I do have an issue with is the hiring of officers based on factors other than merit and then having innocent get hurt. I'm not saying this is the case here, although it seems somewhat like it. But if so, the office needs to be punished, the mgmt needs to be punished and the policy needs to be stopped. Obviously, we know what needs to happen if innocent people are killed on purpose and with malice so no need to comment on that case. "Wrong does not cease to be wrong because the majority share in it." L.Tolstoy "A government is just a body of people, usually, notably, ungoverned." Shepherd Book | |||
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safe & sound |
And that's where I have an issue. I would rather officers err on the side of the safety of innocent citizens. Afterall, that's what they've been hired to do. Protect their community. Part of signing up for that job is to put yourself at risk in exchange for the pay check. I do not want officers shooting people who pose them no harm because they are erring on the side of their own safety. | |||
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| Member |
I guess different people will have different opinions on this. It's tragic when truly bad things happen. But I believe that the greater good is served when good, well trained officers live to see another day. As in many cases, you sometimes have to accept the bad that comes with a good. Officer's erring on the side of safety as a rule may result in many dead officers. Then who will protect the community? "Wrong does not cease to be wrong because the majority share in it." L.Tolstoy "A government is just a body of people, usually, notably, ungoverned." Shepherd Book | |||
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Legalize the Constitution |
Even the preliminary information would seem to indicate that there is no plausible explanation for the actions of this officer. Hell, if they just had their alley lights on they could have clearly seen this woman--in her pajamas was no threat. Early reports indicated she was actually talking to the officer behind the wheel. _______________________________________________________ despite them | |||
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| safe & sound |
If they are only concerned about their own safety I would argue they are not protecting the community, they are only protecting themselves. Why should we hire fire fighters that refuse to get close to fire because it's dangerous? Why should we hire paramedics that refuse to get close to blood because they may contract a disease? Why should we hire road crews that refuse to work on roadways because they could get hit with a car? If you want a job that involves "putting it on the line", well....then you have to put it on the line. It's part of the job description. I don't buy that innocent citizens must die so that the police can live to "protect them". That makes zero logical sense. | |||
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| Member |
Topic for a different thread than here for which I will not debate. It's like arguing against gun control. "Wrong does not cease to be wrong because the majority share in it." L.Tolstoy "A government is just a body of people, usually, notably, ungoverned." Shepherd Book | |||
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Member |
The loud noise is not passing the smell test. If it was a startled reaction or a nd due to a loud noise that would mean he had his gun already drawn with his finger on the trigger pointing in his partners direction. Who is this guy the Barney Fife of Somalia? This onion is going to be peeled for awhile. "Fixed fortifications are monuments to mans stupidity" - George S. Patton | |||
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Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie |
Man, I really couldn't disagree with you more on this. ~Alan Acta Non Verba NRA Life Member (Patron) God, Family, Guns, Country Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan | |||
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| Member |
It's starting to smell pretty bad. Again, we don't have very many facts here. Was she at the officers window talking with the driver? She was holding a cell phone, we know that. Is that justification? Not going to try to blame her at all. What I will say is that every time I've been pulled over, 1x Ohio Turnpike, 1x outside of Detroit, I put my hands on the steering wheel. I sure as Hell didn't want to be fumbling with something in my hands. Am I blaming her? No. Something went on here that was not standard procedure and a woman died from it. Seems to me that silence from the officer is just hurting his credibility. I'd rather be hated for who I am than loved for who I'm not. | |||
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Alienator |
A few big hints. She called the cops about a sound and possible assault. They turned their body cams on purposefully. The passenger reach over the driver to shoot her in their car. SIG556 Classic P220 Carry SAS Gen 2 SAO SP2022 9mm German Triple Serial P938 SAS P365 FDE Psalm 118:24 "This is the day which the Lord hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it" | |||
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| No double standards |
Seems to me the key to the whole matter is what was going on in the officers mind that led him to pull the trigger. That is something only the officer knows for sure at this point and something that may be difficult to convert into a provable "fact". "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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| Idiot by birth, Asshole by choice |
Yes, he would have to be a citizen. The rules of hire were changed after 9/11, so that any POST certified LEO had to be a US Citizen. | |||
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| Do No Harm, Do Know Harm |
That is a state-by-state requirement. Not nation wide. An agency was sued last year because they required citizenship, but the state's certifying agency didn't. I forget which state though. Edit: as shown below, I just checked their recruiting page and they require citizenship. Knowing what one is talking about is widely admired but not strictly required here. Although sometimes distracting, there is often a certain entertainment value to this easy standard. -JALLEN "All I need is a WAR ON DRUGS reference and I got myself a police thread BINGO." -jljones | |||
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Info Guru |
It's a requirement to be a US citizen to be licensed by the state of Minnesota: http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.u...olice_recruiting_faq And also a requirement for the city of Minneapolis: http://www.ci.minneapolis.mn.u...olice_recruiting_faq I couldn't find any information on exceptions or exemptions or when the requirements went into effect. “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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| Member |
Yo ! OFFICER NOOR !  BOO ! Safety, Situational Awareness and proficiency. Neck Ties, Hats and ammo brass, Never ,ever touch'em w/o asking first | |||
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| hello darkness my old friend  |
Why decline an interview? on the advice of his counsel who is likely trying to keep him out of prison. If he refuses to make a statement the local D.A. will decided to file charges on what the other officer says and the physical evidence on hand. No, if it was a diversity hire you will never hear that from a department. His training records could suggest it but as Chongo mentioned they just find another FTO is easy to please and that's how he gets the pass. It is common place. My agency recently passed two females. One who shrieked loudly and ran from a fight leaving a single male officer alone to deal with a combative suspect and another who backed up and watched as her male training officer was struggling with a combative suspect and he had to call other officers for assistance. The fact the other officer didn't see or react to the threat is a biggest clue to what happened here IMHO. | |||
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semi-reformed sailor |
Dunno, it's not my investigation. And I don't have enough facts to weigh in on it. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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| semi-reformed sailor |
1. No- typically it took 2-3 minutes for the call to be taken from 911 then sent to the guys on the street (either over the radio or MDT) then between 8-15 minutes to get to the location itself (depending how far away you were from the call to begin with). If you are discussing blue lights-then no most calls are not responded to with blue lights.... If you are talking about headlights, then -no, sometimes it's best to quietly pull up darked out and exit the car and approach on foot to try and locate the exact call. information received by the officer from 911 is notoriously inaccurate for many reasons... 2. Policy never spells out when you can pull out your weapon, there is always some ambiguity because the use of force is different for everyone. I weigh 160 lbs soaking wet but I might not be threatened and in fear for my life from someone who is twice my size-due to my experience and training, but a 100 lb skinny officer might be in fear of his life if a 250 lb guy jumps on him..... "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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| SIGforum Official Eye Doc  |
From the Daily Mail: Killer policeman Mohamed Noor has said he was 'startled' by his victim Justine Damond seconds before he opened fire. The cop has told friends about why he gunned down the bride-to-be, 40, in his first account of what happened Saturday night. DailyMail.com has spoken to those friends to reveal for the first time his account of what happened that night. The fact Noor has disclosed the events of the evening to friends will raise questions over his conduct. The Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension (BCA), which is investigating the shooting, said in a statement Tuesday that he had declined to be interviewed and that his attorney had not said if or when an interview would take place. However, many of the key parts of Noor's narrative gel with the version of events released by the BCA, who had interviewed his partner, Matthew Harrity. | |||
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| Doing what I want, When I want, If I want!  |
I would agree with the above. ******************************************** "On the other side of fear you will always find freedom" | |||
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