quote:

Originally posted by jed7s9b:
Classic cars is a category of mild interest to me and I hate seeing an uncommon car in good shape butchered into someone’s view of the perfect new version that ends up being the flavor of the week.

And vintage amps was my business for a while. This is like changing the tires to something other than whitewalls, not a major re-work.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
It's how people will react to it than what "it" really is, which is to say, while it truly shouldn't affect value all that much to someone who knows their shit or bothers to ask instead of just react.

Ah, but, by your own admission: You had information to which the rest of us weren't privy--following which was his response to ArtieS's classic car question.

I addressed his comments in their context.

I stand by my reply.

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
Me: "I'd like to re-lume the dial and hands on this watch."

Them: "You shouldn't do that. This is an original, untouched dial. You'll ruin the value."

Me: "I understand that. But I need to be able to use it in low light. That's the value to me. I am never selling it."

Them: "I really wouldn't do that. Can you wear a different watch when you're working?"

Me: "Since I'm a 'watch guy' and have more, yes. But I don't want to. I want to wear and enjoy this watch. It has a boatload of sentimental value."

Them: "How 'bout if I swap the dial out for a similar one that's not original to the watch, then you can preserve this dial?"

Me: "How 'bout if I just go to another watchmaker that'll give me what I'm asking for?"

It's like you experienced my life.

I can see some of the points made here but I don't think this is as valuable as you may think. Old doesn't mean costly. If this were a 1969 Marshall SLP worth $5000 I'd probably just restore it. But this is like what? A $800 amp? It's neither exceedingly valuable nor is it somehow historic (I just don't remember Hendrix playing a Fender Bassman at Monterey).

In reality it's worth exactly $0 as, and let me emphasize this, I’M NOT SELLING IT. It's mine and I can't figure why so many get emotionally involved in it.

Another point, do you think an early Marshall Super Lead is worth more or less than an early Marshall Super Lead modified by Jose Arredondo? What I'm saying is that mods, especially reversible ones, shouldn't be considered as devaluing.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
Ah, but, by your own admission: You had information to which the rest of us weren't privy[...]

In terms of exactly what he's intending? Only because I decided to ask. Anyone here could have done the same. What they would have done with the information I don't know. I do have knowledge many here don't have beyond the scope of this limited discussion, which gives me the perspective that this is not the heresy some see it as. You can dismiss that if you like, but if it's only because it runs counter to your initial reaction and you're not willing to reconsider your position with more information, I think that's somewhat obstinate.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I addressed his comments in their context.

He didn't say anything about refinishing a WWII era 1911, though.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I stand by my reply.

Then I'll also assume you chose to do no further reading on anything I posted about. This is input that's only valuable in that it shows Mark that he's going to catch a lot of heat for doing this from people who know fuck-all about vintage amps.

You should restore it.

Actually, this thread is stressing me out; I'm trying to put myself in your situation and I'm torn between the decisions. Decisions, especially one way decisions, stall me as I want to make the perfect decision. I have to remind myself "perfection is the enemy of progress."

Back to the original point, it's a hobby.
The owner may have bad taste or judgement but it belongs to them to do as they please.
If the others who are so offended really don't want the change made, start offering enough money to get that person to change their mind and sell it.
Otherwise, they have a right to their opinion but nothing else.
We're not talking about curing cancer here or saving lives.
It's a hobby.

Why bother asking anyone's opinion on whether or not to modify something you own? If you ask you're going to get those who insist you keep it original and then criticize you if you don't go along with their way of thinking. My question is will modifying your amp somehow detract from its value and do you ever plan on selling it? Its yours so do with it what you will and don't ask the opinion of others on a public forum

I’m going to answer the general question, and not the specific situation that mark123 asked.

We are stewards of not only what we own, but what we impact. There are things that are absolutely legal to do, but will impact future generations.

For example, passenger pigeon hunting. I, or future generations, will never experience the incredible sight of literally hundreds of thousands of birds overhead, as they were hunted to extinction. Absolutely legal at the time, and I do not judge ANYONE for hunting them at the time. However, it makes me think “what am I doing now, that future generations might wish I had considered them in the equation?”

This is where possessions come into play. Unless you belong to a new branch of the ancient Egyptian religions, your stuff isn’t buried with you at death. Of course, a vast majority of what we own is disposable (clothing, most electronics, etc), but there are things that are irreplaceable and have some value.

It is absolutely OK to do whatever you’d like with an item once it is yours. However, sometimes it is worth reflecting on perhaps a descendant of yours, at the exact same age that you acquired your item, if they would have the same joy and wonder or instead be disappointed because of the changes.


Mark123, if you have the funds to buy all of the “X” amps from 1968 and burn them, that is your call (I know what you are doing is totally reversible, that was for exaggeration). Just the fact that you are asking the question shows that whatever decision you take will be the right one.

quote:

Originally posted by calugo:
Why bother asking anyone's opinion on whether or not to modify something you own? …

Well, the original question was “I have this amp, I’m not using the bass channel, I can make the preamp section like a JCM800 but that leaves a whole 12AX7 unused. What can I make it into that will use the extra two gain stages?” Then the insults started.

Passenger pigeons.

Ok, I'm out.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
Passenger pigeons.

Ok, I'm out.

It’s like making a joke about the Second Baptist Church.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:

This is input that's only valuable in that it shows Mark that he's going to catch a lot of heat for doing this from people who know fuck-all about vintage amps.

Wasn't that in fact the original question? Well partially, he really wasn't asking for advice from people who knew fuck-all about anything, amps to be precise.
Wasn't it really a bitch about why people feel the need to question a posters actions, and respond with advice they weren't really asking for?

Didn't interpret it as a request for what he could do, what should be done, what would happen to the value...

Not picking on the advice provided because, well I don't know fuck-all about vintage amps for that I defer to someone like yourself with experience in the area, which you clearly possess and reaching out to help him was a good idea, as is the advice given.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
Passenger pigeons.

Ok, I'm out.

P220, I was answering the general question, not the specific situation.

At the bottom of my response, I addressed the specific situation. Mark123 knows whatever the right decision is much better than anyone else, and the fact that he even asks the question shows that he is being thoughtful in his approach.

You, on the other hand, resemble more the people that you bemoan at the end of your last message. Just a thought.

Getting back to Mark's OP...

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:
But it's not for sale. ... repeat ad naseum. It got to the point where I was being insulted for daring modify my own possession and then doubting my abilities in general.

Perhaps it's the wisdom that eventually comes to most of us in old(er) age, but, I've mostly learned there is a point beyond which it becomes counter-productive to carry on.

When people debate/argue in poor faith (ignoring or misrepresenting my points, taking things entirely out of context, raising straw man arguments, etc.) I tend to simply bow out--often silently. When they become insulting I generally tend to ignore them--often permanently.

Life's too short

quote:

Originally posted by reloader-1:
Just the fact that you are asking the question shows that whatever decision you take will be the right one.

Or at least a considered one

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
Wasn't it really a bitch about why people feel the need to question a posters actions, and respond with advice they weren't really asking for?

Didn't interpret it as a request for what he could do, what should be done, what would happen to the value...

Originally, yes. But, then, in response to another comment, he wrote: "...what if your friend was never going to sell one of the cars. Does it even matter what he does with the modifications or if he just tosses the original parts?", which rather opened-up the discussion to something of a more philosophical one.

That was the point I, reloader-1, and some others addressed.

Fuck 'em. It is a Bassman Amp, not the Mona Lisa. And it is yours.

quote:

I'm allowed to do what I want with what is mine, right?

It's yours, right? Why do need to be "allowed" to do anything with it?

people that give unsolicited advise in the 'you should' or 'you shouldn't' form are boring knuckleheads

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

I'm allowed to do what I want with what is mine, right?

It's yours, right? Why do need to be "allowed" to do anything with it?

Exactly. Some folks at the other forum took it personally. As if I insulted their grandmother.

Of course you’re allowed. It’s your property. If someone cares that much about its originality, there’s no harm in offering to buy it. At least until you decline. Everything has a price.